Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?[W:771]

Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?

lizzie said:

Interesting to me as well, as my experience has been that it's typically women who have the affairs, at least among the type of people I hang around with. In fact, I can't think of a single male friend of mine who has had an affair, but I can think of several women friends who have.

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Hmm. Total opposite for me.

Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?

Gathomas88 said:

I mentioned internet pornography earlier.

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Um, I'm sorry I missed that though the kind of technology was referring to was virtual.

Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?

Gina said:

Um, I'm sorry I missed that though the kind of technology was referring to was virtual.

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We have pretty much all the technologies that Japan does in this regard.

Honest to God "virtual reality" might not be too far around the bend either.

Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?

Gathomas88 said:

We have pretty much all the technologies that Japan does in this regard.

Honest to God "virtual reality" might not be too far around the bend either.

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From your article:

Japanese-American author Roland Kelts, who writes about Japan's youth, says it's inevitable that the future of Japanese relationships will be largely technology driven. "Japan has developed incredibly sophisticated virtual worlds and online communication systems. Its smart phone apps are the world's most imaginative." Kelts says the need to escape into private, virtual worlds in Japan stems from the fact that it's an overcrowded nation with limited physical space. But he also believes the rest of the world is not far behind.

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Different kind and different reasons than in the U.S.

Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?

Lursa said:

IAgain, I dont think I really understood the main point of your post, sorry. That's my attempt at interpretation. ^^

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Society has scripts for men and women. They're general scripts of course, but still, these scripts tell us what is expected of us. These scripts have changed over time. Men used to be expected to do A + B + C + D and women were expected to do Z + Y + X + W and this resulted in a stable society. The script for woman has been changed by the revolution of feminism. Now women read the script and that script paints a very different picture for women than it used to. The script for women has changed a lot more than the script for men. Well, if the two historical scripts for men and women resulted in the creation of stability, then changing one script while leaving the other intact is going to create instability. Either the instability can be stabilized or it can't. If it can, then society continues to function but in a new manner. If it can't then society crumbles, just like other societies throughout history have crumbled.

Women's sexuality has been freed. That's great for women and that's great for a lot of men. It might not be so great for a stable society though. Women are objecting to the fact that men like sleeping with them but won't commit to relationships. Women have the freedom to fully express their sexuality with lessened stigma attached to such expressions. That sexual freedom though comes at a cost. Men are showing that they're less willing to commit, especially the men who are the beneficiaries of sex with a lot of women. Women seem to find preselected men attractive - if other women qualify a man as being desirable then that makes him more attractive, and so we get a lot more women chasing fewer desirable men. This leaves the guys at the bottom of the totem pole stranded because all of the women have shifted their sights a few notches higher. This state of affairs is what genetic analysis shows us actually transpired during the long run-up that humanity followed to civilization - about 80% of all women who had ever lived, reproduced, compared to about 40% of men. We see that dynamic in many parts of nature too.

OK Cupid has been doing a lot of number crunching on their database. They reported that women rate 80% of men below average. Do you see the problem with that? The male medium that women desire has been upshifted. The guys that women desire to marry don't want to marry them because they're enjoying being a scarce commodity. This dynamic is even taking place on university campuses. It's so funny to watch and sad in a way too. Plenty of schools now have 2 women for every guy. Terrific to be a guy, right? Maybe. The loser guys are still loser guys and the scarcity of men isn't helping them with women. It's the guys at the top who are reaping the benefit of all the women students. This is female sexuality unleashed from societal restraints. Yay freedom. As with double entry bookkeeping, for every credit there is a debit.

Those two articles I linked speak to two sides of the same coin. Women are scripted to see their roles in certain ways or are scripted to see the parameters of what is either acceptable or expected, so the script of women going to school, riding the merry go round of multiple men, launching a career, focusing on their career and then turning their attention to finding a mate is seen as normal. They'll get all of the bad boys out of their system and then find a nice guy to settle down with. Well, those nice guys don't like that. They want to be with these women when they're young, firm, bubbly, not jaded, not afflicted with a scarred heart and wounded self-esteem from being dumped so frequently by the high quality men that they've been targeting and not getting. The most valuable things that a woman can give to a man are wasted on the wrong men and then when the women choose to settle they give the man what's left over. The men aren't finding that to be such a great bargain, hence they're no so eager to settle with these older women because now they're either disengaged and gone their own way or they're using what they've got to target the younger women who do find them attractive. After all, there is still plenty of sex going on all over the place, it's just not working out the way women want it to work out.

Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?

RiverDad said:

Society has scripts for men and women. They're general scripts of course, but still, these scripts tell us what is expected of us. These scripts have changed over time. Men used to be expected to do A + B + C + D and women were expected to do Z + Y + X + W and this resulted in a stable society. The script for woman has been changed by the revolution of feminism. Now women read the script and that script paints a very different picture for women than it used to. The script for women has changed a lot more than the script for men. Well, if the two historical scripts for men and women resulted in the creation of stability, then changing one script while leaving the other intact is going to create instability. Either the instability can be stabilized or it can't. If it can, then society continues to function but in a new manner. If it can't then society crumbles, just like other societies throughout history have crumbled.

Women's sexuality has been freed. That's great for women and that's great for a lot of men. It might not be so great for a stable society though. Women are objecting to the fact that men like sleeping with them but won't commit to relationships. Women have the freedom to fully express their sexuality with lessened stigma attached to such expressions. That sexual freedom though comes at a cost. Men are showing that they're less willing to commit, especially the men who are the beneficiaries of sex with a lot of women. Women seem to find preselected men attractive - if other women qualify a man as being desirable then that makes him more attractive, and so we get a lot more women chasing fewer desirable men. This leaves the guys at the bottom of the totem pole stranded because all of the women have shifted their sights a few notches higher. This state of affairs is what genetic analysis shows us actually transpired during the long run-up that humanity followed to civilization - about 80% of all women who had ever lived, reproduced, compared to about 40% of men. We see that dynamic in many parts of nature too.

OK Cupid has been doing a lot of number crunching on their database. They reported that women rate 80% of men below average. Do you see the problem with that? The male mean that women desire has been upshifted. The guys that women desire to marry don't want to marry them because they're enjoying being a scarce commodity. This dynamic is even taking place on university campuses. It's so funny to watch and sad in a way too. Plenty of schools now have 2 women for every guy. Terrific to be a guy, right? Maybe. The loser guys are still loser guys and the scarcity of men isn't helping them with women. It's the guys at the top who are reaping the benefit of all the women students. This is female sexuality unleashed from societal restraints. Yay freedom. As with double entry bookkeeping, for every credit there is a debit.

Those two articles I linked speak to two sides of the same coin. Women are scripted to see their roles in certain ways or are scripted to see the parameters of what is either acceptable or expected, so the script of women going to school, riding the merry go round of multiple men, launching a career, focusing on their career and then turning their attention to finding a mate is seen as normal. They'll get all of the bad boys out of their system and then find a nice guy to settle down with. Well, those nice guys don't like that. They want to be with these women when they're young, firm, bubbly, not jaded, not afflicted with a scarred heart and wounded self-esteem from being dumped so frequently by the high quality men that they've been targeting and not getting. The most valuable things that a woman can give to a man are wasted on the wrong men and then when the women choose to settle they give the man what's left over. The men aren't finding that to be such a great bargain, hence they're no so eager to settle with these older women because now they're either disengaged and gone their own way or they're using what they've got to target the younger women who do find them attractive. After all, there is still plenty of sex going on all over the place, it's just not working out the way women want it to work out.

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People dont think of society, they think of themselves and their own happiness. Thinking of 'society' will not make a marriage work. You have to be happy, you have to make each other happy.

It's not realistic to think that looking at the effects on society are going to have any affect on individual human behavior. At least not regarding sex, marriage, and reproduction.

And there is too much positive reinforcement for people that choose happiness (by definition ) Or at least instant gratification and selfishness. So society will just have to adapt, the way it always has.

Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?

Michael Johnson said:

Cherry picking from history, are you?

Most men did benefit from patriarchy, no matter your socialist agenda towards wealthy men. Men got to have good paying jobs, kept their families intact, and didn't have to worry about their women becoming self-entitled to every asset and luxury they never worked a day in their lives for. As is the case with today's modern woman.

You're beating a dead horse about wealthy men and it shows your complete denial of history.

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No. That's how strong patriarchies have always worked the world over. The less these things happen, the weaker the patriarchy is. It's been weakening in the West for about 200 years, slowly but surely.

My what agenda? :lol: And are you serious? Most men did NOT have good paying jobs under the strong patriarchy. They were hardly more than slaves, and that's still true in strongly patriarchal countries (all of which are in the third world, by the way). Under strong patriarchies, most people are extremely poor.

Uh, you are aware most women now work, right? In fact, younger women tend to make more money than younger men. They worked plenty for what they have.

Ok, I'll add an addendum: if a woman of high royalty was lucky enough not to have been married off when the ruling king dies, she may find herself with power. Other than that... nope. That's pretty much how it works.

Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?

RiverDad said:

OK Cupid has been doing a lot of number crunching on their database. They reported that women rate 80% of men below average. Do you see the problem with that? The male mean that women desire has been upshifted. The guys that women desire to marry don't want to marry them because they're enjoying being a scarce commodity. This dynamic is even taking place on university campuses. It's so funny to watch and sad in a way too. Plenty of schools now have 2 women for every guy. Terrific to be a guy, right? Maybe. The loser guys are still loser guys and the scarcity of men isn't helping them with women. It's the guys at the top who are reaping the benefit of all the women students. This is female sexuality unleashed from societal restraints. Yay freedom. As with double entry bookkeeping, for every credit there is a debit.

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Is there a version of that for men? What percentage of women do they find below average? And what are the criteria for the women's study? For the men's (if it exists)?

As for women 'enjoying being a scare commodity,' that is bull****. Sadly, some women I know...and certainly most I read/hear of...are desperate to marry. even worse, that is how we are CONSTANTLY portrayed on TV and in the movies. It makes me sad. Because that desperation, that narrow focus, makes them take just about anybody and put up with anybody. Society has pounded this into their heads from infancy and there is no escape for most...most cannot think outside that box and can only see themselves 'as they imagine society sees them'...as nothing if they are not part of a couple. And then nothing if they dont reproduce.

Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?

Lursa said:

Is there a version of that for men?

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It doesn't really matter what the male figure is because it is women who are the gatekeepers to sex. To stretch a point here, men will sleep with most women if only the women would consent. What matters is "The Decider" and that happens to be a she, and she is targeting men well above the medium in terms of what she wants. This means that she's turning down a lot more men that, in this mathematical examination, she shouldn't be turning away.

As for women 'enjoying being a scare commodity,' that is bull****. Sadly, most women I know...and certainly most I read/hear of...are desperate to marry.

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Are they desperate to marry when they are at the peak of their sexual market value or after they've peaked? This is a key point.

Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?

RiverDad said:

It doesn't really matter what the male figure is because it is women who are the gatekeepers to sex. To stretch a point here, men will sleep with most women if only the women would consent. What matters is "The Decider" and that happens to be a she, and she is targeting men well above the medium in terms of what she wants. This means that she's turning down a lot more men that, in this mathematical examination, she shouldn't be turning away.


Are they desperate to marry when they are at the peak of their sexual market value or after they've peaked? This is a key point.

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Yeah...but women are looking for more than sex generally. THey'll have casual sex but often want 'more' with it. And some are stupid but most realize that men are just looking to get laid. Hope gets in the way tho, and men lie very well. Still...I cant believe that so many women do get coerced into sex on false pretenses. Alcohol doesnt help!

and a similar study for men would still be valid...they have their 'standards.' Not being successful in getting laid shouldnt interfere with that, lol.


Mostly younger ones. The older ones dont need to be married..they might be lonely but dont need marrriage. And arent looking for kids.

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I was referring to my own perceptions but my experience is very limited because I married the girl I dated in high school. That's lasted for 39yrs and she's the only one I've been married to. I have seen many friends go through the heart break of divorce, infidelity and financial ruin and that's not for me. If it sounds fun to you by all means give it a whirl!

Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?

Lursa said:

Do you think it's an age or maturity thing tho?

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I think it is a bit of a generational thing, absolutely. It's going to be stronger in the younger Xers and Millennials. However, it's also strongest in our lower socio-economic classes.

But I think everyone matures..in society and in relationships, even tho they dont necessarily survive (the relationships)...and dont remain the same.

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We are delaying maturity more and more and more - it's not just putting off marriage and children until 30, it's all the growing up that occurs when you have to start putting others ahead of yourself. It seems that the natural state for a young male adult is not to finish growing up unless he has to, and so we are extending adolescence until the late 20s and early 30s.

(Of course some people never grow up true). Dont younger under-achievers and rebels often eventually end up becoming part of the Establishment whether they like it or not?

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That depends. Can they live in the Establishments' basement and play video games?

Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?

I am watching a PBS special on the Triangle Shirtwaist Fire. Amazing.

The WOMEN in 1911 organized and went on strike to gain fairer labor laws and unionization. They were beaten and fired and arrested and shamed in public. And still they fought for their rights to safety and fairness. For weeks on end. The judges claimed they were 'on strike against God and nature'. They were shipped to jail and work houses.

Yeah...that feminist **** was lame. [/sarcasm] They didnt look at it as a feminist issue...it was about equality and survival. Damn they were good!

Edit: Lord, this is heart wrenching.

Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?

Lursa said:

That's right...and I bolded all the areas that she would be interviewing people rather than just gathering info 'from the couch.' Her resume spelled it out clearly. You dont make a documentary or have a TV show without *interviewing* people.

Do you really need this spelled out for you?

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Yes, she has done other things in her life outside of her twenty years as a psychologist where obviously she gained the knowledge that she used towards her book. To suggest she is going to get anything useful out of a TV show is a bit absurd, sorry.

Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?

Lursa said:

Yeah...but women are looking for more than sex generally.

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Yeah, but on a dating site they're picking and choosing on looks. There's a mismatch right out of the gate. They SAY that they're looking for more than sex but then they ACT on the photos. If they ACTED in accordance with what they SAY then shouldn't we expect the parameters of acceptable men to be lower in order to give the women greater opportunity to qualify the men on other criteria?

THey'll have casual sex but often want 'more' with it.

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There's always an opportunity cost. Think back to the Fonzie Era. Before the Pill. Good Girls didn't do IT. A couple would go steady, the stereotype would be the boy pressuring the girl to have sex, she'd refuse him. Rinse and repeat. Eventually he has to make a choice - stick with her or dump her. If he dumps her then he needs a new girlfriend. He can go with the town tramp though. Now what happens if the town tramp isn't socially ostracized by the Good Girls? Other Good Girls but ones on the margin, see that it's not so bad being a town tramp and so they crossover and are rewarded with boyfriends. Good Girls have an incentive to police the boundaries for that denies the men opportunity. If there is no town tramp, then the frustrated boyfriend sticks with the girlfriend because he's not going to get sex any easier out there with a new girlfriend.

What's the feminist position on slut shaming? Oh yeah, that it's a bad thing. You see what I mean about feminism being incoherent. Yeah, slut shaming isn't pretty, well no shaming actions are pretty, they're all harsh, but there are consequences to refraining from shaming actions.

So now to modern sexual relations. As the saying goes, why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free. If a girl doesn't put out, then there is always another girl who will, and so you have girls having sex when they'd rather not, or not so early in a relationship or not before there even is a relationship. Again, change the conditions on one side of the equation and you change the other side. Women now have more sexual freedom. That's a benefit. Well, there's a cost too. The question is which scenario, weighing both costs and benefits, had the larger net benefit?

Mostly younger ones. The older ones dont need to be married..they might be lonely but dont need marrriage. And arent looking for kids.

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What do you consider "younger ones?" Women's fertility peaks between the ages of 20-24. I'm not seeing a lot of young women that age clamoring for marriage. They're still eager to follow the script at this age. The whole Sex & the City lifestyle awaits them. I'm not considering a 30 year old woman young anymore.

Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?

Grant said:

Can't there be a simple conversation giving different points of view as judged by our life experiences without using tired terms like 'sexist'? It stunts conversation.I can see you graduated cum laude from your sensitivity training course but you needn't flaunt your credentials here.

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There was no conversation going on between me and Lursa, nor is there any conversation going on now. In fact, there is no conversation possible since she is not qualified to be involved in one on this issue. There was nothing to stunt by calling Lursa a sexist.

I'm sorry I bothered you by calling a woman a sexist, but get over it.

Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?

SmokeAndMirrors said:

My what agenda? :lol: And are you serious? Most men did NOT have good paying jobs under the strong patriarchy.

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Most men did have good paying jobs, if they had enough to put food on the table for their families. You're equating being able to buy excessive "wants" to a decent wage.

They were hardly more than slaves, and that's still true in strongly patriarchal countries (all of which are in the third world, by the way). Under strong patriarchies, most people are extremely poor.

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Based on what criteria? If you're going to make a bogus claim, back it up. This is nothing more than standard feminist rhetoric. Under strong patriarchies most people were not poor in the U.S. The common man had a living wage where he could support his family, and pay his bills. And all third world countries are not under patriarchies. Many places such as Mexico and Argentina live under socialist/progressive ideals that are not based on patriarchy at all.

Uh, you are aware most women now work, right? In fact, younger women tend to make more money than younger men. They worked plenty for what they have.

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Making more money than men? Sure in some industries such as the paper pushing one. But there are still millions of SHAMS and those who do work, still want to quit their jobs and rely on a man.

Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?

Gathomas88 said:

It really was not, but I suppose we can dispense with it all the same.

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It was one of them:

me said:

And then, really? Human beings are going to give up sex for materialistic pursuits?

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Gathomas88 said:

It's already happened.

Study Says Japanese Men And Women “Despise Sexual Contact”: Birth Rates At All-Time Low

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They're not reproducing, and they're not marrying; favoring their own careers instead.

I fail to see how you could assume that it is not the case.

Again, how do you figure? The portion of the population we are discussing here is "dying out" specifically because of its rejection of more traditional gender roles.

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You didn't catch the sarcasm in my comment, so you obviously believe women pursuing the same career track at men, are selfish, but men are not. Instead of brood maring for the sake of the country, having a life men are entitled to without question is an national emergency. That portion of the population will be reduced by attrition and the wheel will turn and the population from the lower economic rungs will climb up. Such is life. It's not a national emergency.

It's observable in both Japan and in the OP. It is an undeniable fact.

More women "going it alone" leads more men to stop trying to pursue them.

Those kinds of men often seem to lose the motivation to do much else when this occurs.

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We've dispensed with Japan, so what kind of men in the OP?

My mother would be a fairly good example, IMO. She's college educated, and she had five children.

She stayed at home while we were young, but went back to school five years ago to become a nurse. She succeeded, and is now working in this new career, while taking classes on the side to attain a second bachelor's degree.

While I'm certainly not suggesting that all women should have to take this route if they do not wish to, she does demonstrate that it is not necessary for notions of traditional family and career to be mutually exclusive. It is entirely possible to pursue both.

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That's terrific that your mom has a career now. I know lots of women like her, who went into nursing after having children.

But she and they, put their careers second. Men do not have to ever consider that. In many professional fields, time off to have children negatively effects a woman's earning power and trajectory. These are the women we are discussing. Something men never have to be concerned with. So, here we are again, women have to sacrifice and be scorned as not holding up their end of society.

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Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?

RiverDad said:

I don't think that this is the proper formulation. What we see is that men without women in their lives are, generally, more content to live in a cardboard box and eat cheerios and play video games. They'll, again speaking generally, work less and only to the point that is sufficient to cover their needs. The labor economics literature shows a very real "marriage effect" for men - increased wages and increased rates of wage raises being sustained for long periods of time in their careers compared to single men. There has to be a reason that men continue to engage in soul-crushing jobs, endure the mindless droning of the workplace, etc. If it's just a matter of meeting survival needs, the work required to earn the pay is far less and that's exactly what we see from men who've been kicked in the nads in the sexual market place. Single guys who are competing for women put in a lot more work effort in order to marshall more resources. Married men out-earn them.

Remove the prospect of women from a man's live and then you pretty much sap ambition too.

Those slackers we see growing in number in society didn't really have a counterpart in 1940. There was an expectation of marriage, people got married young, there was no need to self-actualize during your 20s and 30s and then seek to get married. The rate of singlehood was lower, meaning that even the loser guys could match up with their loser girl counterparts. Now you have guys who have "something" by being married.

Sure, it's not always a bed of roses - being poor and married isn't a Garden of Eden, but it's a sight better than being single, poor and crushed from being a loser in a more fiercely competitive sexual marketplace.

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Why do you lay this at the feet of women? Why are we responsible to make men productive? What happened to personal responsibility? How about pulling themselves up by the bootstraps if they want to compete. Though I'm skeptical this sexual marketplace exists when men are looking outside of bars and clubs for a marriageable woman.

Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?

Gina said:

But she and they, put their careers second. Men do not have to ever consider that. In many professional fields, time off to have children negatively effects a woman's earning power and trajectory. These are the women we are discussing. Something men never have to be concerned with. So, here we are again, women have to sacrifice and be scorned as not holding up their end of society.

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To the bolded. A wife has the power to change that. All she need do is first select a man to marry who has no accomplishment to his name. Then, when married, bargain like the dickens to construct a marriage which suits her interests by sacrificing on some issues and demanding the same degree of sacrifice from her husband.

Wives are the most influential bargainers around to compel men to change.

Now that I've laid the theoretical groundwork for women, I'll leave it up to the women to be attracted to men of no accomplishment and then to marry these men.

Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?

Gina said:

Why do you lay this at the feet of women? Why are we responsible to make men productive?

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When a man and a woman are walking down a sidewalk and a mugger jumps out, why do the women leave it to the man to protect her instead of jumping forth and dispatching the mugger?

Or when there is some nutcase shooting people in a theater, why is it that the boyfriends roll over and use their bodies to protect their girlfriends, with 3 men dying from this act, instead of the reverse?

Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?

RiverDad said:

When a man and a woman are walking down a sidewalk and a mugger jumps out, why do the women leave it to the man to protect her instead of jumping forth and dispatching the mugger?

Or when there is some nutcase shooting people in a theater, why is it that the boyfriends roll over and use their bodies to protect their girlfriends, with 3 men dying from this act, instead of the reverse?

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Um, that doesn't answer my questions. If a woman wasn't there, he wouldn't be motivated to dispatch the mugger?

The same reason a mother would shield her child in the same circumstances. But really, what does any of that have to do with making women responsible for making men productive?

Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?

LowDown said:

If given the chance to re-marry would you marry (another) American woman?

Increasingly the answer is "no".

Men are increasingly disrespected by American women. They face extreme economic and social disadvantages in family law that makes it possible for a wife to divorce them and take most of what they have including their children for any reason or no reason. They are constantly told that they are worthless and stupid. Disrespect for men has become standard practice. Men are disrespected by their wives – they’re disrespected publicly, they’re disrespected privately, they’re disrespected and then told that they have no right to be upset about it because they aren’t worthy of respect in the first place.

Disrespect of men is a joke to Americans now.

The result has been that men are increasingly dropping out of society. They don't marry, they don't go to college because they see no reason to break their humps to get ready to provide for a family -- they aren't going to be having a family.

Lots has been written about this phenomena, most of it in the strain of "why is it that men are so childish now." But men are not dropping out because of arrested development. They are acting rationally in response to myriad laws, attitudes and hostility against them for the crime of happening to be male in the twenty-first century.

Men on Strike: Why Men Are Boycotting Marriage, Fatherhood, and the American Dream - and Why It Matters: Helen Smith: 9781594036750: Amazon.com: Books

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Sounds like there are a lot of men here who are still stuck in the Neanderthal stage, who can't handle not being able to intimidate women to get their way.

Here's another thing that will tick off the "real he-men" here - women are generally somewhat more intelligent than men.

Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?

Gina said:

But really, what does any of that have to do with making women responsible for making men productive?

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It's not a matter of choice, it just is the way it is. Think of it like a low-grade depression. The will is eroded. Look at these guys yourself. They're going they're own way. They're not on script anymore. They seem to be happy, they're playing their games, mountain biking, going out with their buddies, and doing whatever it is that they're doing. What they're not doing is doing things which appeal to women. One of those things that they're not doing is working more than is necessary to maintain their minimalist lifestyle.

Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?

Glen Contrarian said:

Sounds like there are a lot of men here who are still stuck in the Neanderthal stage, who can't handle not being able to intimidate women to get their way.

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Sure let's play with that and assume it to be true. OK, it's true. Now what? Nothing, that's what. What you're engaged in is a form of fat-shaming, something that is directed at fat, loser women to make them feel bad and start losing weight. Is that tactic applauded when directed at women? Should your tactic of shaming men be applauded?