View Poll Results: Men: Would you marry an American Woman?

Voters
102. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes

    72 70.59%
  • No

    23 22.55%
  • Does not apply to me.

    7 6.86%
Page 158 of 164 FirstFirst ... 58108148156157158159160 ... LastLast
Results 1,571 to 1,580 of 1640

Thread: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?[W:771]

  1. #1571
    Sage
    RiverDad's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Last Seen
    04-20-14 @ 02:16 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    5,039

    Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?[W:771]

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    I really have no interest in going further into his work after reading his trash he put down there. Psychologists have a tendency to piss me off because they bull**** endlessly and this guy is a great example of that.
    I'd suggest that you give Haidt's work more attention. It maps pretty damn well to observable reality. This puts him into a different league than most psychologists who do bull**** endlessly. Don't throw the baby out with the bath water.

    If you want to piss off liberals, quoting Haidt's work can be beneficial, it just depends on how harshly you can get the point across. For instance, look at how tacomancer phrased the distribution of morality and now watch this: liberals lack two moral values - they're simply deficient and they overcompensate by going through the roof on issues like equality, which means that conservatives can well understand the views of liberals because we overlap with their moral compass but liberals are completely baffled by how conservatives think because liberals are morally stunted. That will insult most liberals. The trick is to phrase it correctly, but still honestly report the findings.

  2. #1572
    Banned
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Last Seen
    07-19-17 @ 03:51 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    60,458

    Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?[W:771]

    Quote Originally Posted by tacomancer View Post
    case in point.
    His conclusion is wrong.

    Our results suggest that libertarians are a distinct group that places lower value on morality as typically measured by moral psychologists
    Libertarians are morally consistent as they form a foundation to build from. That is the entire reason they are in between conservatives and liberals on pretty much everything he comes across. If he even bothered to look up the philosophy he would know that. Yes, it's a philosophy built on reason, but the non-aggression principle is very much a moral principle.

  3. #1573
    Doesn't go below juicy
    tacomancer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Cleveland
    Last Seen
    05-20-16 @ 02:42 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    31,781

    Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?[W:771]

    Quote Originally Posted by RiverDad View Post
    I'd suggest that you give Haidt's work more attention. It maps pretty damn well to observable reality. This puts him into a different league than most psychologists who do bull**** endlessly. Don't throw the baby out with the bath water.

    If you want to piss off liberals, quoting Haidt's work can be beneficial, it just depends on how harshly you can get the point across. For instance, look at how tacomancer phrased the distribution of morality and now watch this: liberals lack two moral values - they're simply deficient and they overcompensate by going through the roof on issues like equality, which means that conservatives can well understand the views of liberals because we overlap with their moral compass but liberals are completely baffled by how conservatives think because liberals are morally stunted. That will insult most liberals. The trick is to phrase it correctly, but still honestly report the findings.
    We don't need "how to be a hack lessons" on this forum please. We need less of that behavior.

  4. #1574
    Doesn't go below juicy
    tacomancer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Cleveland
    Last Seen
    05-20-16 @ 02:42 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    31,781

    Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?[W:771]

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    His conclusion is wrong.



    Libertarians are morally consistent as they form a foundation to build from. That is the entire reason they are in between conservatives and liberals on pretty much everything he comes across. If he even bothered to look up the philosophy he would know that.
    again, you seem to think morality is an exercise in logic, this is your first fundamental flaw in your reasoning.

  5. #1575
    Pragmatist
    SouthernDemocrat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    KC
    Last Seen
    Today @ 09:52 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    17,410

    Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?[W:771]

    Quote Originally Posted by RiverDad View Post
    I'd suggest that you give Haidt's work more attention. It maps pretty damn well to observable reality. This puts him into a different league than most psychologists who do bull**** endlessly. Don't throw the baby out with the bath water.

    If you want to piss off liberals, quoting Haidt's work can be beneficial, it just depends on how harshly you can get the point across. For instance, look at how tacomancer phrased the distribution of morality and now watch this: liberals lack two moral values - they're simply deficient and they overcompensate by going through the roof on issues like equality, which means that conservatives can well understand the views of liberals because we overlap with their moral compass but liberals are completely baffled by how conservatives think because liberals are morally stunted. That will insult most liberals. The trick is to phrase it correctly, but still honestly report the findings.
    That predisposes though that respect / submission to tradition is a moral value and that loyalty to one's group is a moral value. I think care / harm, fairness / cheating, and liberty / oppression are certainly moral values that just about everyone would agree on as being moral values. The other two are much more subjective though. For example, I think you should be loyal to your family, but I don't understand why respect for tradition is a moral value at all.

    Maybe they are moral values, but as a moral value they are certainly off my radar screen. Its kind of like how some people sense and perceive while others feel and judge. The latter group is far more prone to having gut feelings. I can honestly say that i don't think I have ever had a gut feeling in my life. So I suppose we are all wired up quite differently.
    "You're the only person that decides how far you'll go and what you're capable of." - Ben Saunders (Explorer and Endurance Athlete)

  6. #1576
    Banned
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Last Seen
    07-19-17 @ 03:51 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    60,458

    Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?[W:771]

    Quote Originally Posted by tacomancer View Post
    again, you seem to think morality is an exercise in logic, this is your first fundamental flaw in your reasoning.
    I think when you look at the moral beliefs through time and cultures you there is a pattern that forms. A certain underlining understanding that is getting built upon as human understanding expands and people learn to understand themselves better. If however you are forming your own morality than I fail to see why you wouldn't use reason to find the answer. If the foundational support is built on essentially what amounts to nonaggression than there is no reason to consider anything that causes aggression morally valid. Of course, other things come into play here, but morally sound behavior would at some point even if it is culturally created have to have some sort of logic behind it. It can't simply be emotional and responsive to the world around you without there ever being a reactive response that makes people think of the consequences of those actions. If the consequences to aggression are always negative, as in pain or oppression, then clearly people could determine that it is the aggression itself that is the problem and apply it logically across the board.

  7. #1577
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Last Seen
    07-16-14 @ 01:18 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    47,571

    Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?[W:771]

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    That predisposes though that respect / submission to tradition is a moral value and that loyalty to one's group is a moral value. I think care / harm, fairness / cheating, and liberty / oppression are certainly moral values that just about everyone would agree on as being moral values. The other two are much more subjective though. For example, I think you should be loyal to your family, but I don't understand why respect for tradition is a moral value at all.

    Maybe they are moral values, but as a moral value they are certainly off my radar screen. Its kind of like how some people sense and perceive while others feel and judge. The latter group is far more prone to having gut feelings. I can honestly say that i don't think I have ever had a gut feeling in my life. So I suppose we are all wired up quite differently.
    I don't think traditions are really morals but more like a system of beliefs.

  8. #1578
    Pragmatist
    SouthernDemocrat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    KC
    Last Seen
    Today @ 09:52 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    17,410

    Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?[W:771]

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    I don't think traditions are really morals but more like a system of beliefs.
    But the whole "Moral Foundations Theory" predisposes that respect for tradition is a moral value. I don't get that at all.
    "You're the only person that decides how far you'll go and what you're capable of." - Ben Saunders (Explorer and Endurance Athlete)

  9. #1579
    Sage
    RiverDad's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Last Seen
    04-20-14 @ 02:16 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    5,039

    Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?[W:771]

    Quote Originally Posted by tacomancer View Post
    Lets start over, but this time I will state my reasoning. Children are by default selfish and self centered.
    We agree.

    So as children mature, parents tend to have to be the ones to say things like "stop kicking your brother!" or "we need to learn to share" which are lessons in morality.
    Here's my point - just because a parent engages in the practice of socializing her child to a parental norm doesn't imply that the lesson has stuck, even if the child begins to behave in the desired manner. This is so because we haven't controlled for the heritability of behavior. Does the parent hold that value because they too were socialized into holding that value or does the parent hold that value because it feels right, because there is something innate in the parent which allows that value to be expressed?

    Here's Scientific American interviewing Harris:

    But my primary motive was scientific. During the years I spent writing child development textbooks for college students, I never questioned the belief that parents have a good deal of power to shape the personalities of their children. (This is the belief I now call the ďnurture assumption.Ē) When I finally began to have doubts and looked more closely at the evidence, I was appalled. Most of the research is so deeply flawed that it is meaningless. And studies using more rigorous methods produce results that do not support the assumption. . . .

    There has also been some improvement in research methodology, due not to my nagging but to a greater awareness of genetic influences on personality. Itís no longer enough to show, for example, that parents who are conscientious about childrearing tend to have children who are conscientious about their schoolwork. Is this correlation due to what the children learned from their parents or to the genes they inherited from them? Studies using the proper controls consistently favor the second explanation. In fact, personality resemblances between biological relatives are due almost entirely to heredity, rather than environment. Adopted children donít resemble their adoptive parents in personality. Iím not particularly interested in genetic effects, but the point is that they have to be taken into account. Unless we know what the child brings to the environment, we canít figure out what effect the environment has on the child. . . .

    The belief that parents have a great deal of power to determine how their children will turn out is actually a rather new idea. Not until the middle of the last century did ordinary parents start believing it. I was born in 1938, before the cultural change, and parenting had a very different job description back then. Parents didnít feel they had to sacrifice their own convenience and comfort in order to gratify the desires of their children. They didnít worry about boosting the self-esteem of their children. In fact, they often felt that too much attention and praise might spoil them and make them conceited. Physical punishment was used routinely for infractions of household rules. Fathers provided little or no child care; their chief role at home was to administer discipline.

    All these things have changed dramatically in the past 70 years, but the changes havenít had the expected effects. People are the same as ever. Despite the reduction in physical punishment, todayís adults are no less aggressive than their grandparents were. Despite the increase in praise and physical affection, they are not happier or more self-confident or in better mental health. Itís an interesting way to test a theory of child development: persuade millions of parents to rear their children in accordance with the theory, and then sit back and watch the results come in. Well, the results are in and they donít support the theory!

  10. #1580
    Banned
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Charleston, South Carolina
    Last Seen
    12-02-16 @ 01:15 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    28,659

    Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?[W:771]

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    (ISFJs are less likely to have personality disorders than INTJs for example).
    Narcissistic personality disorder FTW!
    Last edited by Gathomas88; 03-12-14 at 12:58 AM.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •