View Poll Results: Men: Would you marry an American Woman?

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Thread: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?[W:771]

  1. #1371
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    Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?[W:771]

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    So what happens when these premature judgments are made?
    people are undeservedly condemned and judged.
    "Judge a man by his questions rather than his answers" - Voltaire
    "There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow men. True nobility lies in being superior to your former self" -Hemingway

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    Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?[W:771]

    Quote Originally Posted by opendebate View Post
    people are undeservedly condemned and judged.
    They don't deserve it?

  3. #1373
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    Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?[W:771]

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    They don't deserve it?
    no. when you judge a person based on stereotypes about their gender, party, lifestyle instead of who they are as an individual IMO you often end up handing out undeserved judgment.
    "Judge a man by his questions rather than his answers" - Voltaire
    "There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow men. True nobility lies in being superior to your former self" -Hemingway

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    Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?[W:771]

    Quote Originally Posted by opendebate View Post
    no. when you judge a person based on stereotypes about their gender, party, lifestyle instead of who they are as an individual IMO you often end up handing out undeserved judgment.
    Ok, I got ya. That wasn't really what I was getting at, but sure that is true.

  5. #1375
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    Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?[W:771]

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    I'm aware of how it works. She wants the man to do something and after making it abundantly clear to her it's not going to happen she decided to practice coercion.
    No, she needs her husband to help around the house and he should not have to be asked 50 times before doing what he needs to do. She needs him to be something more than a bit actor in the play that is their marriage.

    Sometimes women do use coercion which does not help in their marriage but what are women to do if men act like little spoiled children when they have to do their share of the work in the household? Do it themselves? They are their wives, not the reincarnation of their mothers. Some men should learn to do their fair share and not try to treat their wives like their did their mothers before they got married. Wives were not put on earth to clean up behind men. Men are perfectly able to put their dirty clothes in hampers, pick up stuff they drop etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    This should be interesting for you to prove.
    You mean other than spousal abuse, rape inside the marriage, sexual harassment at the workplace, discrimination at the workplace, wage discrimination (because also outside of the marriage men like to be controlling women).

    And it is not just actions but it also is attitudes towards women that go towards controlling them. That attitude is present everywhere, young culture is rampant with that. Modern music videos are mostly about men with scantily clad women, you may not think that is about control but I do. This kind of attitude is what is wrong IMHO. Men have a habit of objectifying women, treat women like property and that is not right.

    And even though a lot of men do not think of themselves as controlling, that does not mean that they are not in reality controlling women. When women's reproductive issues were discussed in Washington, all one could see was men.

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    No control present with that action.

    No control present.

    Still no control present.

    Still no control present.

    Still no control. Sorry, you didn't prove your premise.
    I was not trying to prove any premise about control with those examples but about how male attitudes/male culture is in part to blame for the break up of marriages as I had previously stated. You asked in a previous post "What makes you think that just has to do with men?" and I gave examples why I think it has to do with males.

    And FYI, I disagree with you about them not proving control of the man. With their actions, and some of those actions I mentioned in my previous post, are evidence that men are controlling their wives in these situations. As said, a man takes the rights to go with his mates to a bar, controlling their marriage, the work his wife will have to do extra and the freedom of his wife. While he is at the bar, his wife will have to do things he could have/should have done and it also limits her freedom. She cannot go out with her friends for a drink because she has to stay home for the children.

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    You mean other than the crying nonsense?
    Yes, yes, another great example of the wonderful good old "male attitude/culture".
    Former military man (and now babysitter of Donald Trump) John Kelly, is a big loud lying empty barrel!

  6. #1376
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    Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?[W:771]

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter King View Post
    No, she needs her husband to help around the house and he should not have to be asked 50 times before doing what he needs to do. She needs him to be something more than a bit actor in the play that is their marriage.
    Asking fifty times is annoying as hell. You would think that after once the answer would be clear to everyone. Apparently not.

    Sometimes women do use coercion which does not help in their marriage but what are women to do if men act like little spoiled children when they have to do their share of the work in the household?
    They have to do what again? Don't see the problem with saying "have to do their share"? The share is set by both parties, not whatever she thinks. In other words, there has to be an agreement made.

    Do it themselves? They are their wives, not the reincarnation of their mothers.
    They want the task done and an agreement for the man to do it was failed to be reached. So ah..yeah.

    Some men should learn to do their fair share and not try to treat their wives like their did their mothers before they got married. Wives were not put on earth to clean up behind men. Men are perfectly able to put their dirty clothes in hampers, pick up stuff they drop etc.
    Who said the woman had to do anything? The woman don't have to wash his dirty clothes. Just leave them be.


    You mean other than spousal abuse, rape inside the marriage, sexual harassment at the workplace, discrimination at the workplace, wage discrimination (because also outside of the marriage men like to be controlling women).
    Define sexual harassment. Most of the others are legitimate crimes except the two dealing with the workplace.

    And it is not just actions but it also is attitudes towards women that go towards controlling them. That attitude is present everywhere, young culture is rampant with that. Modern music videos are mostly about men with scantily clad women, you may not think that is about control but I do. This kind of attitude is what is wrong IMHO. Men have a habit of objectifying women, treat women like property and that is not right.
    Oh please, the women in question weren't forced to appear in the videos and no one is controlling anyone to do anything. They were hired to dress in a certain way and do whatever they were hired to do in the video. They agreed to it, which was a completely voluntary action on their part. Can you expand on the last point about objectifying women? That could mean all kind of things.

    And even though a lot of men do not think of themselves as controlling, that does not mean that they are not in reality controlling women. When women's reproductive issues were discussed in Washington, all one could see was men.
    Both women and men are pro-life.

    I was not trying to prove any premise about control with those examples but about how male attitudes/male culture is in part to blame for the break up of marriages as I had previously stated. You asked in a previous post "What makes you think that just has to do with men?" and I gave examples why I think it has to do with males.
    Ok.

    And FYI, I disagree with you about them not proving control of the man. With their actions, and some of those actions I mentioned in my previous post, are evidence that men are controlling their wives in these situations. As said, a man takes the rights to go with his mates to a bar, controlling their marriage, the work his wife will have to do extra and the freedom of his wife. While he is at the bar, his wife will have to do things he could have/should have done and it also limits her freedom. She cannot go out with her friends for a drink because she has to stay home for the children.
    She doesn't have to do anything. She can get a babysitter and not do anything around the house. He didn't control her in any sort of way.

    Yes, yes, another great example of the wonderful good old "male attitude/culture".
    That you're not seen as manly because you cry? There is no reason to cry dude. Even when something really hurts.
    Last edited by Henrin; 03-09-14 at 03:46 AM.

  7. #1377
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    Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?[W:771]

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Asking fifty times is annoying as hell. You would think that after once the answer would be clear to everyone. Apparently not.
    Well, having to ask someone many times to do something is much more annoying that hearing all those times iMHO. Well, if the man's response is blunt refusal then this again proves the need for re-education. No wife can or should do everything by herself.

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    They have to do what again? Don't see the problem with saying "have to do their share"? The share is set by both parties, not whatever she thinks. In other words, there has to be an agreement made.
    Their fair share of house hold work. The share should be set by both parties and for that you need good communication and listening skills, both often sorely lacking in some men. As soon as men have an inkling of an idea how to run a household with a couple of kids they can have their own thoughts about how things should run. They can then either communicate and compromise or do it how it normally is done by the wife.

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    They want the task done and an agreement for the man to do it was failed to be reached. So ah..yeah.
    Sorry, but men should take some responsibility as said, their wives are not their mothers. If men lie around or do their own thing then an agreement can never be reached.

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Who said the woman had to do anything? The woman don't have to wash his dirty clothes. Just leave them be.
    I am sorry, but when CPS comes to take the children away because she does not clean the house, wash the clothes or feed the kids. It will also be real amusing to see hubby loose his sales job because all the customers refuse to buy from him because his clothes are stained and smell horribly. And when that happens and they have to sell the house they will loose big on the house because dirty houses are not that easy to sell.

    Women have a sense of pride and will not live in a filthy pigsty.

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Define sexual harassment. Most of the others are legitimate crimes except the two dealing with the workplace.
    Inappropriate remarks, unwanted sexual advances, slaps on buttocks, "accidentally brushing against her breasts" etc. etc. etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Oh please, the women in question weren't forced to appear in the videos and no one is controlling anyone to do anything. They were hired to dress in a certain way and do whatever they were hired to do in the video. They agreed to it, which was a completely voluntary action on their part. Can you expand on the last point about objectifying women? That could mean all kind of things.
    I am not justifying the choices of these women but talking about the attitude of these men. And men control the women in those videos by money and promises. Objectifying women is a pretty self explanatory remark IMHO. They objectify women like sex symbols, as loose women, sluts, etc. They portray woman like sex objects and often show women as less than the men.

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Both women and men are pro-life.
    Wrong, not both men and women are pro-life. And an all male panel on birth control for women is just insane IMHO.

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    She doesn't have to do anything. She can get a babysitter and not do anything around the house. He didn't control her in any sort of way.
    She does have to do anything. Usually the man holds the purse-strings and her financial means are often controlled by the man.

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    That you're not seen as manly because you cry? There is no reason to cry dude. Even when something really hurts.
    I never said that not being seen as manly is a reason to cry. And there are lots of reasons to cry, even for men.
    Former military man (and now babysitter of Donald Trump) John Kelly, is a big loud lying empty barrel!

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    Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?[W:771]

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter King View Post
    I am not advocating men to become blubbering crying narcissistic make-up abusing fancy boy. Women also do not cry all the time but when it is healthy for them to cry they will do so and men should be able to do the same. It is also not wrong to well up when seeing incredible tragedy. If a father looses his child he should be able to cry and mourn and not "be tough" about it even though it is killing him inside.

    I still feel sad about some things in life (even though I might not cry about it). Things like the death of my 18 year old cat, the death of my grandfather and grandmother, Natalee Holloway, etc. Having feelings is not wrong IMHO, not even for a man. Burying their feelings because it is unmanly to have them is a problem IMHO.
    I'm quite sure that men do cry, just not in front of other people, and there is nothing wrong with that. I don't like to cry in front of anyone else either and I'm a woman. I think that MOST men see their feelings as being personal and not something to be shared with everyone else.

  9. #1379
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    Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?[W:771]

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter King View Post
    Order? I am sorry but since when is a partnership ordering the other to do something. Negotiate, communicate and compromise are words that should be very important in a marriage. Sadly one gender has more issues with these kinds of things and women are not that gender.
    Seems to me that the people in the relationship should be the ones to determine how their relationship should work. I find interference from third parties most wholly inappropriate and frankly unneeded. Who are you to judge that things need to change for them? Isn't that really their business and none of yours?

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter King View Post
    A wife usually asks her husband to bring out the trash ten times before she orders him. Men usually are the worlds greatest experts at procrastinating. Sure some men actually do something when they are asked to do it but most will have to be asked multiple times before doing it. You might be different than those men but a lot of men have problem in that department.
    This is just an observation of yours? Are you projecting?

    What makes me think it is to do with the culture of men? I am a child of divorced parents. I have seen other couples break up and often it is due to issues caused by males. The vast majority of men however are controlling women. They control them by the most basic things, going out with their friends watching monday night football at Hooters. That the dishes have to be done, the children have to be put to bed, the house has yet to be cleaned etc. etc. etc. etc. is less important that "hanging out with the bro's" because a man needs his guy time. A lot of women do not get to have a "girl time" because they cannot afford to not bring the children to bed, clean the house, cook the dinner etc.

    Men come home from work and need their time. When women come home from work most of them do not have the luxury to kick off their shoes and fall onto the couch and should "honey can you get me a beer".

    Now I am not saying that all men are like that but men are still the ones in the partnership who come up lacking and that can be very detrimental to a marriage. From personal experience it is the woman who bends over backward to keep the wedding, the house hold and the family going even though she is unhappy with the whole situation.

    I might be a bit prejudiced but I have seen the "old culture of men" personally. When the a-hole that my dad was, finally came home from being at the canteen of the local soccer club on Sunday night, refereeing instead of spending time with his children, he sat his large ass down on the sofa and switched the TV to his channel so that he could watch soccer on TV. That my sister and me would want to watch sesame street before going to bed was not his problem. His house, his TV and his shows. My sister, mom and me were sitting huddled in front of a small screen black and white TV set while he was sitting on his backside chugging down beers while watching soccer.

    I am not advocating re-educating manly character trades out of men, I am talking about re-educating them so that they are able to negotiate, communicate and compromise to make their relationships work. Now women might also need some re-education but the biggest problem lies with men IMHO. They think they are doing enough when their wives obviously do not see it that way and in the end this will most likely kill the marriage.[/QUOTE]


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    Re: Men: Would You Marry an American Woman?[W:771]

    Quote Originally Posted by eohrnberger View Post
    Seems to me that the people in the relationship should be the ones to determine how their relationship should work. I find interference from third parties most wholly inappropriate and frankly unneeded. Who are you to judge that things need to change for them? Isn't that really their business and none of yours?



    This is just an observation of yours? Are you projecting?

    What makes me think it is to do with the culture of men? I am a child of divorced parents. I have seen other couples break up and often it is due to issues caused by males. The vast majority of men however are controlling women. They control them by the most basic things, going out with their friends watching monday night football at Hooters. That the dishes have to be done, the children have to be put to bed, the house has yet to be cleaned etc. etc. etc. etc. is less important that "hanging out with the bro's" because a man needs his guy time. A lot of women do not get to have a "girl time" because they cannot afford to not bring the children to bed, clean the house, cook the dinner etc.

    Men come home from work and need their time. When women come home from work most of them do not have the luxury to kick off their shoes and fall onto the couch and should "honey can you get me a beer".

    Now I am not saying that all men are like that but men are still the ones in the partnership who come up lacking and that can be very detrimental to a marriage. From personal experience it is the woman who bends over backward to keep the wedding, the house hold and the family going even though she is unhappy with the whole situation.

    I might be a bit prejudiced but I have seen the "old culture of men" personally. When the a-hole that my dad was, finally came home from being at the canteen of the local soccer club on Sunday night, refereeing instead of spending time with his children, he sat his large ass down on the sofa and switched the TV to his channel so that he could watch soccer on TV. That my sister and me would want to watch sesame street before going to bed was not his problem. His house, his TV and his shows. My sister, mom and me were sitting huddled in front of a small screen black and white TV set while he was sitting on his backside chugging down beers while watching soccer.

    I am not advocating re-educating manly character trades out of men, I am talking about re-educating them so that they are able to negotiate, communicate and compromise to make their relationships work. Now women might also need some re-education but the biggest problem lies with men IMHO. They think they are doing enough when their wives obviously do not see it that way and in the end this will most likely kill the marriage.


    [/QUOTE]

    Yeah well, to be fair, his dad sounds like a real arse.

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