View Poll Results: Rape and clothing correlation

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  • I suspect women are wearing revealing clothes in most rape cases

    1 0.98%
  • I suspect that a man/woman will rape regardless of the victims clothing

    28 27.45%
  • I think some women are inviting dangerous attention when wearing revealing attire

    6 5.88%
  • I don't think clothes have anything to do with rape

    56 54.90%
  • Other

    11 10.78%
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Thread: Rape and Clothing

  1. #571
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    Re: Rape and Clothing

    Quote Originally Posted by herenow1 View Post
    Still would like to know if you find what the woman above wearing is sexually provocative since she's revealing skin. I mean wouldn't this also turn a lot of men's heads?
    I know you're probably more interested in what the men have to say about it, but since they don't seem to want to comment, I will say that I think she looks just fine and there is absolutely nothing wrong with her outfit, though I think it is a lot more casual than what most women would wear out to a club.

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    Re: Rape and Clothing

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    I know you're probably more interested in what the men have to say about it, but since they don't seem to want to comment, I will say that I think she looks just fine and there is absolutely nothing wrong with her outfit, though I think it is a lot more casual than what most women would wear out to a club.
    The questions that require honesty are probably the hardest to answer, especially if it contradicts everything you say. In the summer that's how most women[that size] tend to dress, and she's showing just as much skin as a woman in a short skirt, or sketti strapped short dress.

  3. #573
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    Re: Rape and Clothing

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    Well, you're wrong. There is no evidence that clothing plays a factor in rapes, any rapes, so you are making claims that are not real.
    This actually isn't true. Studies have shown that provocatively dressed women are viewed by men and women alike as being more promiscuous.

    This would contribute to misunderstandings that could escalate into rape.

    I and plenty of my friends have worn provocative clothing and have never been raped.
    And have you not told me that some of the men you've met in bars and clubs in the past had a tendency to take it personally and get angry with you when you told them "no?"

    You've even mentioned having to be escorted out to your car on some occasions.

    Do you really think that those kind of situations do not have the potential to escalate into rape?

    If there are two women, and one is dressed provocatively but NOT drunk and another is dressed more conservatively and is passed out, the rapist is NOT going to choose the more provocatively dressed female. He is going for the easiest target.
    The conservatively dressed woman is going to be a lot less likely to wind up passed out somewhere in the first place.

    Like I said before, this might very well be a "chicken and the egg" kind of situation here, but it's hard to deny that the kinds of women who behave irresponsibly often have a tendency to dress that way as well.

    Besides, if a woman "advertising the goods" and one not doing so were both to be passed out, which do you think most men would prefer?

    Sure, in certain situations of date rape, a man might have asked out the woman to begin with because he found her attractive, but men find women attractive no matter what they are wearing, so that is just circular logic. I don't see how you can correlate these things in a rational manner.
    Yes, but again, he is going to make certain assumptions based upon clothing he perceives to be "promiscuous" that he will not make of less revealing clothing.

    This can contribute to the man feeling slighted when the woman eventually says "no," and that can make an assault more likely.

    Exactly. They had some kind of personality disorders to begin with, hence why they were "pushed over the edge" or perhaps they were drunk, but regardless these are "normal" and healthy men. These men have ISSUES, whether that be with women or with themselves.
    I never said that they didn't have "issues." However, you were implying that they must all possess a debilitating level of clinical illness.

    There's really nothing to support this conclusion where date rape is concerned. That's all I was saying.

    I NEVER said that, but what people find attractive IS variable. AND some men might find a more conservatively dressed woman to be more attractive. Maybe they would think of her as cleaner and more innocent? There are too many variables for you to draw the conclusion that dressing provocatively leads to rape. It is a ridiculous jump with no evidence to support it because their are so many different variables involved. It is much more complicated than that.
    I never said that it wasn't "complicated." I also never said that clothing was the most important factor.

    I said that the attention certain kinds of clothing tends to attract can be dangerous under some circumstances. Again, a pushy asshole who's looking to get in a woman's pants and has an ego delicate enough that he's going to get angry when not allowed entrance generally isn't going to target "clean and innocent" looking women in the first place.

    They're simply not advertising a willingness to be approached in the same way that a more provocatively dressed woman would be.

    WTH? That's only common sense! It almost sounds as if you are saying that ALL men are rapists or have the potential to be such. I certainly hope you can provide some evidence if that is the case because this is quite a SERIOUS accusation and would be a SERIOUS problem as far as men/women interacting goes.
    I don't know about "all men," but if the "25% of women will be raped before graduating college" figure feminists like to drag out when talking about date rape is even remotely accurate, a "serious problem" would appear to be exactly what we have.

    I'm honestly not sure if I believe that. However, either way, it would probably be in a woman's best interests not to assume that the kind of man who would rape her can be so easily "profiled" as you're suggesting here.

    The FACT is I searched for some valid data about this, and there is NOTHING to suggest that the instances of rape among strippers is higher than the regular population. That is NOT the case with prostitutes though.
    The Glamorous Life of the Stripper

    In the second phase of her survey, Kelly found that:

    •100% of the women reported physical abuse in the club.


    •100% of the women reported sexual abuse in the club.


    •100% of the women reported verbal harassment in the club.


    •100% of the women reported being propositioned for prostitution in the club.


    •100% of women also witnessed these things happening to other strippers in the club.


    Customers committed the overwhelming majority of violent acts.

    Club owners, managers, assistant managers, bartenders, music programmers or DJs, bouncers, security guards, floorwalkers, doormen, and valets were guilty to a lesser extent.
    I would assume this was common sense, but studies on the subject do show that stripping tends to be a somewhat dangerous line of work.

    Proof?
    See above.

    Most of the links you post about rape are shady to say the least, and they jump to a LOT of unfounded conclusions.
    It was a valid study.

    Pretty people tend to have more sex. You would think that was common sense.

    and beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
    To the contrary, at least where male lust is concerned, beauty tends to be rather generic.

    The vast majority of men will find themselves aroused by an attractive body even if the woman is not strictly "their type." Men's standards also tend to drop through the floor when looking for a non-serious sexual fling anyway.

    And what you are referring to above is a behavior. You can dress provocatively and NOT act slutty. And most of the women I see when I'm out are not taking things to the extremes that you are suggesting. There are always a couple of weirdos in any crowd.
    This tends to be rather rare. Again, the kind of person who dresses in an overtly provocative manner in the first place likely isn't doing so for no reason.

    Again, there are plenty of men who are turned off by those kinds of women, so it is completely subjective on what would "attract" a rapist.
    It attracts the kind of men who are looking for "easy" women. I can just about guarantee you that they intersect with the "potential date rapist" crowd quite often.

    Your standards are far from being common sense. You place too much importance on the small details that are too variable to draw definitive conclusions from, and you don't pay enough attention to the bigger picture.
    Again, if someone were to try and tell me that there was "no evidence" wearing assless chaps to a gay club, or a tuxedo in a bad neighborhood, would result in an increased likelihood of my getting into trouble, I would laugh them out of the room.

    Simple common sense dictates otherwise.

    Frankly, even if they were correct (which I doubt), why would any responsible person take that risk at all?

    I really fail to see how this is a hard concept.
    Last edited by Gathomas88; 02-20-14 at 12:29 PM.

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    Re: Rape and Clothing

    Quote Originally Posted by rocket88 View Post
    You know what, rape is not OK. Just deal with that.
    I think I am dealing with it pretty good. What makes you think I am having trouble dealing with it?

  5. #575
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    Re: Rape and Clothing

    CHRIS,

    Maybe you can ask Gath our questions since he only seems to be responding to you

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    Re: Rape and Clothing

    It's ludicrous that some men try to hold onto the former "right" to act like total dogs. The world has changed. Bearing some skin in the summer or on a night out is within the law. Raping a woman...isn't.

    I can wear whatever I want within the law.

    Grow up?

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    Re: Rape and Clothing

    Quote Originally Posted by herenow1 View Post
    Still would like to know if you find what the woman above wearing is sexually provocative since she's revealing skin. I mean wouldn't this also turn a lot of men's heads?
    Quote Originally Posted by herenow1 View Post
    CHRIS,

    Maybe you can ask Gath our questions since he only seems to be responding to you
    My apologies. I'm responding to like three different people at the same time here, and responses take time.

    Quote Originally Posted by herenow1 View Post
    Ok Gath, since your focus right now seems to be on date rape and college campuses, please tell me if you think this pic is provocative. The picture below is how most college and high school girls dress to parties. They are not wearing the type of bikini pic you posted, and that pic is not realistic unless the woman was on the boardwalk or the beach. If your gf went out with the girls, would you tell her to change b/c she might attract rapists?

    Attachment 67162347
    I didn't say that all or even most women did dress in a particularly dangerous manner. I said that some did, and that they should be aware of the impact such clothing can have on how men perceive them.

    It simply draws the attention of the wrong kinds of men, for the wrong kinds of reasons. Some of those men are inevitably going to be creeps who might not handle rejection very well if they get the impression that the girl in question was "leading them on."

    As such, if a woman isn't actually looking for sex, dressing like she is tends to be a bad idea.

    In all likelihood, it won't be the deciding factor in whether she winds up becoming a victim or not, but that does not make it any less of a "bad idea."

    Quote Originally Posted by herenow1 View Post
    ~Most rapists aren't sociopaths, they just got carried away
    Clinical "sociopathy" is a very specific term. It cannot simply be tossed around carelessly.

    While I don't doubt that pretty much all rapists are going to carry some anti-social tendencies, most non-serial rapists are probably only going to be only borderline cases. There is really no evidence to suggest that most date rapes result from a "pathological" need to rape on the part of the perpetrator, or even that many of these men deliberately target women for rape ahead of time.

    According to some figures, the rape rate for women graduating college might very well be 25% or higher.

    While I am somewhat skeptical of that claim, if it were true, it would have to imply either that are a lot of male sociopaths out there (10% to 15% of the population at least), or that strict sociopathy probably isn't required to be a rapist in the first place. The latter seems more likely.

    ~Conservative women(dressed) are the least likely to be raped
    I don't know about being "least likely." Environment and behavior ultimately play a larger role. However, dressing with some degree of discretion certainly wouldn't hurt their chances.

    ~Men will look for the female that's dressed the most promiscous for sex-are you assuming that he won't stop if she says stop/no?
    ~If a woman dresses provocative she is signaling that she wants sex
    Women who dress promiscuously are perceived to be promiscuous. In a lot of cases, they even are.

    Frankly, even the ones who are not are still looking for male attention when they dress that way.

    You do know that even conservative women have put on some heels and a nice skirt before right? Women don't just dress one way all the time. You may go out and see a lady wearing pants and a shirt one week, run into her a month later and she's wearing a short form fitting dress. Many times women dress how they feel. If it's a Sat night and a woman who normally dresses more conservative, decides to dress a tad more revealing, it shouldn't be a cue that she's on the prowl. Even if a woman is single and dresses sexy to get the attention of a man, it doesn't mean she wants to have sex that night!
    A lot of men aren't going to make the distinction between "looking for attention," and "looking for sex."

    The kind of man who might take offense to a woman who says "no," or who might take advantage of a girl who has passed out, certainly won't. They are also going to overwhelmingly gravitate towards women they perceive as being more likely to "put out" in the first place.

    It should also be noted that I'm not talking about any kind of suggestive clothing here anyway. It is perfectly possible to appear attractive without appearing "easy."
    Last edited by Gathomas88; 02-20-14 at 01:22 PM.

  8. #578
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    Re: Rape and Clothing

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    It can be discounted.
    vs
    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL
    The only kind of rape I could see where clothing would play any factor whatsoever is date rape.
    If it can play a factor, then it cannot be discounted.
    If it can be discounted, it cannot play a factor.

    This can only be resolved by you ChrisL, Gathomas88 cannot but point out the contradiction above.

    The very first page he claimed it generally was not a factor, and that in NO case is would it justify rape.

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    Re: Rape and Clothing

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    Basically Gathomas, I could easily say that a woman who accepts a date from any man is technically putting herself at risk. On that note, perhaps people should have chaperons or something. Really that makes as much sense as the things you are suggesting.
    It would, which is exactly why people have done things that way for most of human history. As I said before, date rape has only really become a major problem since our society began encouraging more generally "loose" sexual behavior in the post 1960s era anyway.

    Does this mean that we have to go back to doing things the way they were before? No.

    It simply means that women are going to have to put in the extra effort necessary to keep themselves safe in the new and significantly more dangerous sexual environment the modern world has created.

    Rape is never the victim's fault or responsibility because, more so than ANYTHING she does, it is the rapist's mentality and just being in the wrong place at the wrong time, and the existence of men who have the mentality that allows them to rape women that is the biggest contributing factor.
    I never denied that.

    However, this doesn't change the fact that there are certain things women can do to avoid making themselves obvious targets.

  10. #580
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    Re: Rape and Clothing

    It seems people are attributing rape to a "one size fits all" profile. Though there are more common reasons of anger, control and repression, there are also instances of misinterpretation. Those types typically don't lead to full on rape, though they can instigate sexual assaults.

    For instance; horny guy being playfully, teased by inebriated female. She doesn't really want to go all the way, while he's thinking her signaling of "NO", now means "Oh Yes, bring it on!" In her state of increasing intoxication, she's semi unconscious of what's occurring and wakes later, wishing, it hadn't happened and thinks she was raped. Often it amounts to a sexually aggressive male (young) being frustrated and not knowing when to stop.

    My point is, females dressing provocatively will get you hit on more often but probably not raped. The amount of rapes occurring on women for their clothing styles are probably a very low percentage. The amount of sexual assaults on younger females for being inexperienced and putting themselves in bad situations, is much more common.
    Einstein, "science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."

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