View Poll Results: Rape and clothing correlation

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  • I suspect women are wearing revealing clothes in most rape cases

    1 0.98%
  • I suspect that a man/woman will rape regardless of the victims clothing

    28 27.45%
  • I think some women are inviting dangerous attention when wearing revealing attire

    6 5.88%
  • I don't think clothes have anything to do with rape

    56 54.90%
  • Other

    11 10.78%
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Thread: Rape and Clothing

  1. #421
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    Re: Rape and Clothing

    Quote Originally Posted by Commie View Post
    True! And I'm reminded of a notorious case of a serial killer husband & wife, who just happen to live on the same street as a close friend of mine back 20 to 25 years ago. The wife was for the most part - the enabler, while the husband picked most of his victims - schoolgirls on their way home after school, at random...just based on an opportunity presenting itself to him. He kept a bottle of chloroform and duct tape in his glove compartment, so he would be ready whenever an opportunity for another abduction presented itself. One of the girls he abducted and took home for fun and games before killing her - he noticed while driving home from work late at night. The girl had been trying to sneak back home without waking her parents....possibly trying to figure a way to climb in through a window. He offered to help her...then drugged and abducted her...the rest is tragic history...but it was just a case of another victim being in the wrong place at the wrong time! She was 15 years old at the time, and just happened to match the profile of his favorite victims.....nothing to do with what she was wearing...case closed!
    There are a lot of tragic stories like that, I took criminal justice classes to satisfy behaviorals requirements in school and it was very interesting, I got the bug to study criminal pathologies like serial killers and other types of predators ever since.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

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  2. #422
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    Re: Rape and Clothing

    Quote Originally Posted by NoC_T View Post
    They've 'proven' no such thing. Only the physical aspect isn't interpretative. This isn't empiricism.

    I refer you to my earlier post.
    This comes from compilations of interviews among the convicted. It's a power play, it's forcing of one's will on someone and not gratification. Even the more passive types of rape have a power component to them.

    Think about it, the little weasel type of guy who doesn't want to risk rejection from the woman he has his eye on but also doesn't have the nerve to forcibly rape her would put something in her drink or wait till she had too much. At the point that she can't say no and can't fight back he still has the power, he just went the other way with it and incapacitated her with substances rather than brute force. In either scenario the ability to refuse was taken away from the victim, their choice was taken away, their power over the situation.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

  3. #423
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    Re: Rape and Clothing

    Quote Originally Posted by NoC_T View Post
    Again, here you're applying an arbitrary scale of suffering. There must be any number of ways in which someone's sense of self may be violated, to whatever degree, and with no necessity of physical intervention whatsoever. There's no baseline.
    Actually, I'm going off of years of reading up on it. A person is much more likely to get over getting a severe beating than a rape. There is an entire psychology behind the rapes that a lot of warlords in third world countries have their soldiers commit, those rapes are about power, and also about humiliating the men within their opposition.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

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  4. #424
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    Re: Rape and Clothing

    Quote Originally Posted by Gathomas88 View Post
    Absolutely. I was never trying to imply otherwise.

    I was simply saying that it's not particularly hard to visualize how these kinds of crimes wind up going down sometimes.

    Misunderstandings arise on the bar and club scene all the time. Where most men (myself included, as should go without saying) aren't terrible human beings and will simply take "no" for an answer and move on, under just the wrong circumstances (the wrong guy with the wrong personality, the wrong environment, the wrong level of intoxication, the wrong level of flirtation before hand, etca), it is possible for such misunderstandings to escalate into something far worse.

    That doesn't make it any less wrong. The man in question is still rapist scum.

    I'm simply acknowledging that this is a risk women face, and saying that they should plan around it.
    That's a respectable position. My main concern is that there is a blame the victim mentality amongst some and that is completely unfair, even if a woman is a prostitute and has sex professionally(and dresses the part) she has the right to say no at any time she chooses. I'll give you an example, I was a power drinker in my younger days and found that there is a certain point in a good drinking night where one isn't out cold, but they aren't exactly functional on their feet and one is pretty much running on primal impulses.

    Anyway, one night during those years I was in that state and this unbelievably gorgeous lady was walking down the street with an outfit that was only 1 or 2 mm away from indecent exposure and at least DDD breasts. Let's just say that instinct to look took over and there wasn't exactly enough consciousness left to avoid getting caught staring and she called me out on it. I apologized, then she made a rude comment, so I returned the favor, she blushed, my friends laughed and that was that. She really was amazing and trust me there was definitely a sexual desire on my part but the difference between a rapist and a human being is that when it was obvious she wasn't interested then a normal person moves on. If someone had harmed that woman and blamed the way she dressed it would have been just an excuse, because if she had consented I would have found a room on the spot...............trust me.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

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    Re: Rape and Clothing

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    Also, they might think, Oh look, there's a girl passed out, and it really doesn't matter at that point what she's wearing. She is an opportune victim at that point.
    Yep, they are looking at the risk/reward aspect and figure they have a free pass. It's sick.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

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    Re: Rape and Clothing

    Easier to flip up a skirt than take off jeans. Just sayin'.

  7. #427
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    Re: Rape and Clothing

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    My point is that even if a woman is wearing a one-piece pantsuit, if she goes off with a strange man THAT would be putting herself at risk. Meanwhile, the girl dressed provocatively could be behaving in a much more safe manner, so it has much more to do with behavior than clothing. Putting yourself in risky situations and being unaware of your surroundings is the contributing factor IMO and it has very little to do with clothing. And even if a woman does happen to find herself in a risky situation and the victim of a crime, I still don't hold HER responsible for others taking advantage of her in that way. Perhaps she is just naive.
    And someone wearing a one-piece pantsuit and acting in a safe manner would be safer than both of them. Just sayin'.
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  8. #428
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    Re: Rape and Clothing

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    And someone wearing a one-piece pantsuit and acting in a safe manner would be safer than both of them. Just sayin'.
    The key is the "acting in a safe manner" part though more than anything she might be wearing that makes the situation "safer". For instance, not going out alone, not looking vulnerable (if at all possible), paying attention to your surroundings, etc.
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  9. #429
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    Re: Rape and Clothing

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    The key is the "acting in a safe manner" part though more than anything she might be wearing that makes the situation "safer". For instance, not going out alone, not looking vulnerable (if at all possible), paying attention to your surroundings, etc.
    It's all part of acting in a safe manner. It's not bringing attention to yourself. It's staying out of dangerous situations. It's not placing yourself into a position where you are at risk. Sometimes, you have no idea where you are at risk, but your own behavior is always under your control. It's like women who go out in skimpy outfits to boisterous bars and get drunk and then can't understand why they get raped or attacked or mugged or whatever. Well duh, look at the position you put yourself in!
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  10. #430
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    Re: Rape and Clothing

    Quote Originally Posted by rocket88 View Post
    The point I'm making is that people will rationalize it like "Well, she's dressed like a slut, she was asking for it." It's not a valid rationalization. Yes, nothings going to stop you if that's what you're going to do (you in general, not you personally I hope), but then "asking for it" still doesn't matter because it wasn't about what she was wearing.
    If a person leaves $500 on top of their car in a high crime neighborhood and his money gets stolen, that person did not commit a crime. Was that person being stupid? Yes. Does the person stealing the money deserve to go to prison? Yes. Does the person having the money stolen deserve to go to prison? No. Does the person having the money stolen deserve to have their money stolen? Yes.

    Getting a ten year prison sentence is not the same as an asshole saying, "She was asking for it."

    Laws are usually made based upon what works to increase safety. Laws aren't made so that politicians can prove how nice they sound when giving a speech. Requiring all people to speak nicely is a pointless goal. It accomplishes two things. Jack and squat.

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