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Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights? [W:85]

Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?


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Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

ARE YOU say their is no right to association?

oh ....you better look it up!

even judges i have listen to who teach constitutional law, talk of right to association.


according to you, if someone wants to associate with me........i must do it?.......when did one citizen get the power to force another citizen to associate with them?


so your saying any citizen which engages in anything YOU disagree with, see as stupid, or hateful..........they MUST BE STOPPED by the government?...........


do i have you correct?

Reading comprehension has never been your strong suit. go back and read what I wrote then deal with what I wrote and not what you want to deal with.
 
Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

Reading comprehension has never been your strong suit. go back and read what I wrote then deal with what I wrote and not what you want to deal with.

all you have written is you don't THINK people should be able to discriminate, and that is not a basis of law.


if someone does something you disagree with, stupid, or hateful, but in preforming any of those 3 things, they do not infringe on the rights of other people [a crime] or endanger the health and safety of people or property [regulations], ...then what authority does the government have to force a person to behave in a matter you no longer disagree with, find stupid, or hateful?..........

do you think government use force on people who do things YOU disagree with, find stupid or hateful?
 
Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

all you have written is you don't THINK people should be able to discriminate, and that is not a basis of law.

What I wrote was that the policies you advocate and the rights you claim would result in people being able to legally engage in bigotry and discrimination against others when they are barred from legally doing so today. And you admitted it.

Please get it straight.
 
Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

What I wrote was that the policies you advocate and the rights you claim would result in people being able to legally engage in bigotry and discrimination against others when they are barred from legally doing so today. And you admitted it.

Please get it straight.

bigotry and discrimination........is NOT A CRIME..........when i violate a person rights.........that is a crime!

so if a person engages in bigotry and discrimination...........he is not violating anyone rights.

again---- if a person commits ........ bigotry and discrimination...which is NOT crime..........which does not violate health and saftey standards.............by what authority does government have to force me to associate with another person?

you whole argument is.... people are doing things you disagree with find stupid, and hateful.....But that does not give you any authority by law!
 
Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

When you have a business the government regulates where it can be located, the type of building you can use, the type of sign you display, how you can fire and hire people, the minimum wage, how you dispose of waste, and fire and other safety requirements. You are also required to document your income and expenses to pay your taxes and get deductions. If you have a restaurant, you will be inspected to make sure that the food is protected properly from spoilage and contamination, that the employees wash their hands and wear proper clothing and hair nets etc, that you have pests under control, provide access to the disabled, have accessible restrooms and much more.

Out of all these regulations and requirements, none of which are loved by conservatives-libertarians, the one mentioned most often as onerous and unfair is the requirement that employees and customers are not subject to racial, religious etc. discrimination by business. Ironically, while advocating for allowing discrimination in public accommodations, they also argue that such discrimination would not happen very much, if at all, because people have changed since the Jim Crow days and it would harm the business.

My opinion is that the harm from business discrimination against potential employees, employees and customers outweighs the harm from being "forced" to tolerate undesirable races, religions etc in one's business. I don't believe that such discrimination will be as rare as claimed. These days it is as likely to be directed at Muslims and gays as blacks, but the tendency to ignorantly, irrationally and/or arbitrarily discriminate has not been sufficiently eliminated yet. For evidence, just look at all the racism and bigotry expressed on this forum and other public fora.

Also, I am willing to recognize the damage that it would cause to society and vulnerable people, something the conservative-libertarians ignore or downplay. In small towns, isolated and rural areas, just one or two discriminatory businesses could keep a significant portion of the population from getting a job, shopping, getting a place to live etc. without leaving town. Businesses have the ability to oppress people in their daily lives as much or more than government, especially in these days of a handful of mega-corporations, malls and big box retail dominating retail and services. Addressing government discrimination while allowing business discrimination requires tolerating discrimination and the hardship and oppression it will impose on unpopular minorities and society as a whole.
 
Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

bigotry and discrimination........is NOT A CRIME..........when i violate a person rights.........that is a crime!

so if a person engages in bigotry and discrimination...........he is not violating anyone rights.

Are you no longer a resident of the USA?
 
Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

are you no longer a resident of the usa?



bigotry and discrimination........is not a crime..........when i violate a person rights.........that is a crime!

So if a person engages in bigotry and discrimination...........he is NOT violating anyone rights.

Again---- if a person commits ........ Bigotry and discrimination...which is not crime..........which does not violate health and saftey standards.............by what authority does government have to force me to associate with another person?

You whole argument is.... People are doing things you disagree with find stupid, and hateful.....but that does not give you any authority by law!

government is here to secure rights of the people........[criminal law] protects rights of the people, [regulations ]health and safety standards protect .....the people and property.
 
Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

government is here to secure rights of the people........[criminal law] protects rights of the people, [regulations ]health and safety standards protect .....the people and property.

just as long as you know that you are wrong and actions of bigotry and discrimination can be crimes in the USA.
 
Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

just as long as you know that you are wrong and actions of bigotry and discrimination can be crimes in the USA.

if a citizen in not violating the rights of other citizen.

if a citizen is not violating health and saftey standards.........then by what authority does government have to act on them?

or are you going to say bigotry and discrimination...is a crime, or health an saftey issue?

right to association, means i can or cannot associate with people.
 
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Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

if a citizen in not violating the rights of other citizen.

if a citizen is not violating health and saftey standards.........then by what authority does government have to act on them?

or are you going to say bigotry and discrimination...is a crime, or health an saftey issue?

right to association, , means i can or cannot associate with people.

I am saying what I have said: the ideas you advocate would make legal acts of discrimination and bigotry which are today illegal in the USA.

Got that now? :doh:roll:
 
Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

I am saying what I have said: the ideas you advocate would make legal acts of discrimination and bigotry which are today illegal in the USA.

Got that now? :doh:roll:

and they are unconstitutional, when placed on citizens, but not governments.......got it!

AMENDMENT XIV

Passed by Congress June 13, 1866. Ratified July 9, 1868.

Note: Article I, section 2, of the Constitution was modified by section 2 of the 14th amendment.

Section 1.
All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
 
Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

and they are unconstitutional, when placed on citizens, but not governments.......got it!

AMENDMENT XIV

Passed by Congress June 13, 1866. Ratified July 9, 1868.

Note: Article I, section 2, of the Constitution was modified by section 2 of the 14th amendment.

Section 1.
All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

I live in reality where US law says otherwise. Enjoy your own fantasy land where you have crafted your own reality outside of USA 2014.
 
Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

What facts do you have? You have appeal to authority and propaganda. You were the one that claimed it protects everyone, I merely highlighted instances when it in fact infringed upon the rights of the individual. That's reality and you have no way to address it while keeping your propaganda together other than to try to dismiss it.

Fact, that's it. Sometimes in the exercise of nondiscrimination laws, the rights of the individual are infringed upon. That's fact.


hey look more opinions, strawmen,philosophies and deflections that change nothing lol, awesome
 
Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

hey look more opinions, strawmen,philosophies and deflections that change nothing lol, awesome

None of it in fact. You keep saying it, but only because you cannot argue against it. Pretty pathetic, lol.
 
Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

I live in reality where US law says otherwise. Enjoy your own fantasy land where you have crafted your own reality outside of USA 2014.

mister big government.

reality= not following the constitution.
 
Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

None of it in fact. You keep saying it, but only because you cannot argue against it. Pretty pathetic, lol.

nothing has changed :shrug: facts, laws and rights > than your meaningless opinion and philosophies lol
Make 50 more post they will just be further entertainment
 
Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

mister big government.

reality= not following the constitution.

According to you Herr Barkmann. Only according to you. And that means absolutely nothing compared to reality.
 
Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

nothing has changed :shrug: facts, laws and rights > than your meaningless opinion and philosophies lol
Make 50 more post they will just be further entertainment

Your appeal to authority is logical fallacy. Your ignoring the fact that exercise of nondiscriminatory laws infringe occasionally on the rights of the individual is nothing short of dishonesty. Reality crashes with the propaganda you want to exhort and that's the end of it. You're invested into the propaganda and have to continue in this dishonest argument wherein you ignore reality.

Fact is, sometimes the enforcement of the nondiscrimination laws infringe upon the rights of others. Fact, not opinion, fact. It's probably about time you learn what those words mean.
 
Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

Reality = not following the Constitution.

Would it help if I provided for you the address of the US Supreme Court in Washington? They apparently are not aware of your understanding of the facts. :roll:

Supreme Court of the United States

Address: 1 First St NE, Washington, DC 20543
Phone:(202) 479-3000
Hours: Wednesday 9:00 am – 4:30 pm -



I have no doubt you would be welcomed as the living embodiment of the spirit of Madison returning upon a white steed to save the Republic. :lamo
 
Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

Would it help if I provided for you the address of the US Supreme Court in Washington? They apparently are not aware of your understanding of the facts. :roll:

I have no doubt you would be welcomed as the living embodiment of the spirit of Madison returning upon a white steed to save the Republic. :lamo

You guys are purposefully reading past each other, it's getting annoying.

Yes, there are laws against discrimination. It is, for certain folk and certain circumstances, a crime to discriminate. Those laws, however, are not based in the universal natural rights of the individual but rather on the notion of what someone thinks is "fair". This is why when nondiscrimination laws are enforced they sometimes actually infringe upon the rights of others. Because this sense of "fair" overwrites everything and we excuse government force against the free exercise of rights to maintain it.
 
Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

You guys are purposefully reading past each other, it's getting annoying.

Yes, there are laws against discrimination. It is, for certain folk and certain circumstances, a crime to discriminate. Those laws, however, are not based in the universal natural rights of the individual but rather on the notion of what someone thinks is "fair". This is why when nondiscrimination laws are enforced they sometimes actually infringe upon the rights of others. Because this sense of "fair" overwrites everything and we excuse government force against the free exercise of rights to maintain it.

Since there are no such thing as natural rights - its fine with me.
 
Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

Since there are no such thing as natural rights - its fine with me.

That's fine, don't mean they do not exist, but hey some people think some humans are just inherently better than others. I don't, which is why I accept natural rights, but I can't speak for everyone. Hahah.
 
Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

Your appeal to authority is logical fallacy. Your ignoring the fact that exercise of nondiscriminatory laws infringe occasionally on the rights of the individual is nothing short of dishonesty. Reality crashes with the propaganda you want to exhort and that's the end of it. You're invested into the propaganda and have to continue in this dishonest argument wherein you ignore reality.

Fact is, sometimes the enforcement of the nondiscrimination laws infringe upon the rights of others. Fact, not opinion, fact. It's probably about time you learn what those words mean.
transltion: you wil deflect, back pedal, post opinion and fantasy and again nobody cares lmao. Ill stick with Facts rights and law. I know post it again maybe with your NEXT post ill care about your opinion.
 
Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

Would it help if I provided for you the address of the US Supreme Court in Washington? They apparently are not aware of your understanding of the facts. :roll:

Supreme Court of the United States

Address: 1 First St NE, Washington, DC 20543
Phone:(202) 479-3000
Hours: Wednesday 9:00 am – 4:30 pm -



I have no doubt you would be welcomed as the living embodiment of the spirit of Madison returning upon a white steed to save the Republic. :lamo

to your ,no right to association


Freedom of Association and Assembly legal definition of Freedom of Association and Assembly. Freedom of Association and Assembly synonyms by the Free Online Law Dictionary.
 
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