View Poll Results: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

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  • Yes

    42 61.76%
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    12 17.65%
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    14 20.59%
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Thread: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights? [W:85]

  1. #351
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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    I have no idea what you even mean. You make no sense. You ignore the law and the power to enforce it while embracing your own standard which means nothing as to what is legal or not legal. Your silly statement is irrelevant not to mention just nonsensical in view of reality in the USA of 2014.

    You were the one who advocated changing the laws so that people could legally act upon their bigotry. Nothing I said approaches the low intelligence of that license you would give to bigots.
    really?..you saying discrimination is not legal....why?

    in order to be discriminated against.......... something must be denied to a person who is seeking something......a good or service from another person.

    if a person discriminated, does he violate another person rights........NO!.......because you have no right to be served by another person with material goods or services.

    if a person discriminated, does he violate the health and safety of another person......NO!........another person's health and saftey is not at risk.

    laws which apply to the people, should only concern rights, and the health and saftey of the people............not yours or other peoples moral values.
    Last edited by Master PO; 02-14-14 at 06:58 PM.

  2. #352
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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard Truth View Post
    All rights have limits imposed by law.

    When you have a business the government regulates where it can be located, the type of building you can use, the type of sign you display, how you can fire and hire people, the minimum wage, how you dispose of waste, and fire and other safety requirements. You are also required to document your income and expenses to pay your taxes and get deductions. If you have a restaurant, you will be inspected to make sure that the food is protected properly from spoilage and contamination, that the employees wash their hands and wear proper clothing and hair nets etc, that you have pests under control, provide access to the disabled, have accessible restrooms and much more.
    There are certainly limitations to the exercise of rights, the one natural limitation is that you may not infringe upon the rights of others in the exercise of your own.

    But you prove my point, which is that these laws can and do infringe upon the rights of the individual. Some folk are trying to make statements of absolute, they uphold ALL our rights ALL the time. But that's not true. We have made an ideal above rights, and we will infringe upon property and labor to achieve what we have envisioned as "fair".

    Health requirements, BTW, do have direct impact on health and thus life. Having a certain baker make your wedding cake does not.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  3. #353
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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    my copy states a republican form of government which is non collective, because the power is divided, ..collectivism, concentrates powers...it does not divide it.
    WOW!!!!! Did you get cheated !!!!! Now this explains everything about you ideology and beliefs.

    Return it at once and get one that starts our with the collectivist sentiment


    WE THE PEOPLE
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    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

  4. #354
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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    really?..you saying discrimination is not legal....why?

    in order to be discriminated against.......... something must be denied to a person who is seeking something......a good or service from another person.

    if a person discriminated, does he violate another person rights........NO!.......because you have no right to be served by another person with material goods or services.

    if a person discriminated, does he violate the health and safety of another person......NO!........another person's health and saftey is not at risk.

    laws which apply to the people, should only concern rights, and the health and saftey of the people............not yours or other peoples moral values.
    Its like you are reading Egyptian or something. What about this do you not comprehend?

    You were the one who advocated changing the laws so that people could legally act upon their bigotry. Nothing I said approaches the low intelligence of that license you would give to bigots.



    As to your Alice in Wonderland Mad Hatter logic..... this expresses just what I feel about it since it has nothing to do with the real USA of 2014

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PG-qCyYZRms

    You might want to watch it several times in case you fail to comprehend the central point the first time or twelve.
    __________________________________________________ _
    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    WOW!!!!! Did you get cheated !!!!! Now this explains everything about you ideology and beliefs.

    Return it at once and get one that starts our with the collectivist sentiment


    WE THE PEOPLE


    The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against Invasion; and on Application of the Legislature, or of the Executive (when the Legislature cannot be convened), against domestic Violence.


    REPUBLICAN GOVERNMENT IS NON- COLLECTIVE.

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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against Invasion; and on Application of the Legislature, or of the Executive (when the Legislature cannot be convened), against domestic Violence.


    REPUBLICAN GOVERNMENT IS NON- COLLECTIVE.
    talk to Mr. Meaney

    Kevin Meaney's (I Don't Care Song) - YouTube

    he says all that needs to be said about your beliefs
    __________________________________________________ _
    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

  7. #357
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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    its like you are reading egyptian or something. What about this do you not comprehend?

    you were the one who advocated changing the laws so that people could legally act upon their bigotry. Nothing i said approaches the low intelligence of that license you would give to bigots.



    as to your alice in wonderland mad hatter logic..... This expresses just what i feel about it since it has nothing to do with the real usa of 2014

    YouTube

    you might want to watch it several times in case you fail to comprehend the central point the first time or twelve.
    what is illegal about discrimination?

    What am i doing to making it unlawful?

    Am i violating rights or health and safety?.......please answer!
    Last edited by Master PO; 02-14-14 at 07:32 PM.

  8. #358
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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    talk to mr. Meaney

    kevin meaney's (i don't care song) - youtube

    he says all that needs to be said about your beliefs
    deflection by you...means you have no argument....to save face!

  9. #359
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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    please explain to me.....why the government should create a law on the people...........if that law, does not secure rights of the people, or protect the health and safety of the people.

    Discrimination laws....do not secure rights, and they do not protect the health and safety of the people.

    So why are discrimination laws created for?
    There is widespread consensus that there is no right to not be offended. That is the only so-called "right" infringed upon when a business is "forced" to serve someone with the wrong skin color or accent.

    Anti-discrimination laws secure individual's right to be treated as an equal human being who is judged by his/her behavior, not by an irrational prejudice. They prevent the harm from business discrimination against potential employees, employees and customers, which significantly outweighs the harm from being "forced" to tolerate undesirable races, religions etc in one's business.

    Racial, religious etc. discrimination harms society and vulnerable people. In small towns, isolated and rural areas, just one or two discriminatory businesses could keep a significant portion of the population from getting a job, shopping, getting a place to live etc. without leaving town. Even in a more urban environment, discrimination can force poor people to unnecessary waste time and money searching for a business that will accept their money in exchange for goods or services. Businesses have the ability to oppress people in their daily lives as much or more than government, especially in these days of a handful of mega-corporations, malls and big box retail dominating retail and services. Addressing government discrimination while allowing business discrimination requires tolerating discrimination and the hardship and oppression it will impose on unpopular minorities and society as a whole.

    The business owner who doesn't like serving a customer because of their race, religion, gender etc is harmed much less when forced to serve that person than the would-be customer who has to find another place that will serve him/her is harmed. When a person can't get a job or a home because of race, religion, gender etc discrimination they suffer far more than the employer or landlord will suffer from being forced to treat that person as an equal. In addition, society as a whole is harmed by the impact of discrimination based on prejudice and hate.

    Discrimination harms society by maintaining an impoverished underclass living with all the ill effects of poverty and oppression, effects which can impact everyone in the form of blight, large numbers of beggars, disease, crime, violence, rebellion and revenge.

    Past experiences and the experiences of other places show us what happens when discrimination is allowed. Jim Crow laws existed during my lifetime and the negative effects from them still impacts life today. I don't believe that such discrimination will be as rare as claimed. These days it is as likely to be directed at Muslims and gays as blacks, but the tendency to ignorantly, irrationally and/or arbitrarily discriminate has not been sufficiently eliminated yet. For evidence, just look at all the racism and bigotry expressed on this forum and other public fora.
    Last edited by Hard Truth; 02-14-14 at 08:12 PM.

  10. #360
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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard Truth View Post
    Anti-discrimination laws secure individual's right to be treated as an equal human being who is judged by his/her behavior, not by an irrational prejudice. They prevent the harm from business discrimination against potential employees, employees and customers, which significantly outweighs the harm from being "forced" to tolerate undesirable races, religions etc in one's business.
    A cupcake is not on the level of Jim Crow laws, so that's a bit ridiculous.

    But in the end, you don't own another man's property or labor. You have no right to another man's property or labor. That's the fundamental. There are varying degrees to which refusal of service can have a real and negative impact on the rights of another, and those are cases that can certainly be considered; but there are other cases in which no right is infringed upon, and those should be dismissed.

    Can't make everyone think and feel uniformly, and in a free society with large enough population, you will realize the full statistical distribution of actions.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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