View Poll Results: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

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  • Yes

    42 61.76%
  • No

    12 17.65%
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    14 20.59%
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Thread: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights? [W:85]

  1. #11
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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    1.)Can you fully explain what qualifies as "gender identity"?
    2.) If one prefers not to be considered as a male, say for say purposes of getting gov't contract preferences for their "minority" owned business, must that self designation be honored?
    3.) The only problem that I have with these "non-discrimination" laws is when they mandate "remedies" such as different physical standards, like the US military based on age/gender.
    4.)I have no objection to equal treatment but not to making "accommodations" that differ based on mandates to be "more inclusive".
    1.)can "I"? no not really and its not for me to explain the medical community explains it both medical/psychological
    2.) they would have to be LEGALLY considered a female until then they are a male. This has nothing to do with the law about discrimination.

    Now having said that if they are diagnosed with gender identity issues then they can be discriminated against because of that

    3.) again this has nothing to do with the law
    nothing wrong with different standards as long as the job can be completed IMO, now if it effects job performance then i agree 100%
    4.) same as 3


    but again you would have to look that stuff up yourself
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  2. #12
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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveFagan View Post
    Just a personal note. I believe in non discrimination, but I avoid fast food restaurants with homosexuals servers. I worry about AIDS and spit in food, etc. A minimal worry statistically but a real worry.
    lol thank you for proving how severely uneducated some people are on these topics
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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    correct

    the reality is i wanted to know want people felt about non-discrimination laws but could only find polls based on them and the addition of sexual orientation

    then once i looked at them I was shocked that it was as high as it is. And that i could confirm it by other polls. Many have it at 68 and 73%, some have it as low as 59%

    but i still found that surprising since the highest polls for equal rights for gays have been 58%. Seemed odd to me. BUT thats a different topic and i dont want to derail this thread.

    For now i just want to know who supports non-discrimination laws and equal rights.
    I don't find it surprising at all. I tend to think that when it comes to issues revolving around what some see as morality concepts, a good many people can separate their personal beliefs from the legal aspects of protection of individual rights, and they favor equality under the law.
    "God is the name by which I designate all things which cross my path violently and recklessly, all things which alter my plans and intentions, and change the course of my life, for better or for worse."
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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by WorldWatcher View Post
    >


    1.)Kind of circular logic there which appears to try to elicit an emotional response. When laws are written to make an action against the law then of course they are illegal. In terms of rights there is a conflict of "rights" you assume that one individual has a right to the services and property of another private entity (to be distinguished from governmental entities). However to usurp the rights of individual private business owners their right to manage their own rights of property and freedoms of association are violated when forced to provide goods and services they don't want to provide under penalty of law.





    2.) We used to have:

    1. Areas of the country where black people couldn't rent a room for the night when traveling.

    2. Areas of the country where black people traveling couldn't buy gas from white station owners.

    3. Areas of the country where blacks couldn't eat unless they could find a black's only food establishment.

    4. And we had systematic discrimination against minorities in terms of how government functioned, such as segregated mass transit (buses, trains, etc.), schools, law enforcement, etc.


    In those days such things were commonplace, but society has changed in the last 50 years and changed a lot. There has been a "corporatisation" where you can't spit without finding a company gas station, movie theater, restaurateur, motel/hotel, etc. Just because we repeal Public Accommodation laws, doesn't mean that things are going to go back to the way they were 2 generations ago. And there are a number of factors that impact this:

    1. We are much more mobile society. People routinely travel in a manner unprecedented then, both temporary and "permanent" relocation's out of the area they grew up in.

    2. We are more informed society and information is much more available today about how a business conducts it self in term so taking care of customers we have Criag's list, Angie's list, Yelp, and a plethora of hotel, restaurant, and review sites for any type of business and it's not just the discriminated against who would choose not to associate with such a business. It includes many in the majority that would shy away from such businesses.

    3. The "corporatisation" of businesses in America watches the bottom line and having your "brand name" associated with and appearing to condone discrimination has a negative impact on the bottom line. With corporate owned "shops" and franchises who still fall under policies of the home office means that these businesses will not allow or condone what was going on prior to the 60's.


    **************************************************


    3.) So the question becomes the balance of the rights of the private business owner to manage their private property according to their desires as compared to the desires of others to have access to that private business. With the widespread discrimination 2-generations ago there may have been justification to say the rights of the property owner needed to be usurped - on a temporary basis - but those times are pretty much gone. The balance was greatly tilted toward discrimination.

    But in general the widespread issues from 50 years ago have been resolved by fundamental shifts in society. Sure there will be isolated instances, that the price of liberty and dealing with your own issues. A burger joint says - I won't serve a black? OK, walk across the street to Applebee's. A photographer doesn't want to shoot a same-sex wedding? OK, Google or Angie's List other photographers in the area.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm all FOR keeping Public Accommodation laws in force in terms of the functioning of government but that is because citizens have an inherent right to equal treatment by the government. There is no such right to equal treatment by other individuals.


    **************************************************

    4.)There is a newer movement afoot, to allow people to discriminate based on religious bias. In other words if a person claims their motivation to discriminate was based on religion - then they get special treatment and are exempt from anti-discrimination laws.

    I don't support such measures, I think Public Accommodation laws in general should be repealed as they apply to private business entities.



    >>>>
    1.) can only go by how the law is written, theres no attempt for emotion its the verbiage of the laws and polls and articles concerning these issues.
    "I" personally dont assume anything i go by the law and how rights take precedence.

    2.) i never suggested anywhere that everything would magically convert back but it still exists today so id rather have our rights being protected, not has often as then but still common

    3.) again its still to common for civility IMO so i want our rights protected.

    I mean how long have we gone without hearing about discrimination like this, REAL cases also not just claims? a month? 6 months? a year?

    still way to much

    4.) i would never support that crap and i say that as a christian, religion was tried to be used before to discriminate and it failed because it was stupid reasons then and the same remains true today
    Last edited by AGENT J; 02-10-14 at 10:50 AM.
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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    I support no discrimination.

    No discrimination based on gender, race, religion, political views, etc from a govt standpoint. However... this means both positive and negative discrimination. Positive discrimination is just as bad as negative discrimination. Egalitarian society = no discrimination of any kind.

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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    lol thank you for proving how severely uneducated some people are on these topics
    Non discrimination applies ONLY to your perspective on how the govt should operate i.e. how laws should be made and how govt institutions should function.
    It doesn't extend to what peoples' personal preferences are and one can never be too careful in regards to his own personal well-being and health especially regarding an incurable disease. The government can't get AIDS, a person can.

    The one thing Dave is wrong on is not that he avoids fast food places with gay servers, is that he goes to fast food places to begin with. That's where he's wrong.

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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by lizzie View Post
    I don't find it surprising at all. I tend to think that when it comes to issues revolving around what some see as morality concepts, a good many people can separate their personal beliefs from the legal aspects of protection of individual rights, and they favor equality under the law.
    well see that i agree with but thats EXACTLY my point

    why is support for non-discrimination to work, get hired and equality under the law so high but for marriage so much lower? why do so many obviously view them different when they are the same

    that was my point

    I do agree with you though most people can separate thier feelings at least sound mind honest adults
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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rainman05 View Post
    Non discrimination applies ONLY to your perspective on how the govt should operate i.e. how laws should be made and how govt institutions should function.
    It doesn't extend to what peoples' personal preferences are and one can never be too careful in regards to his own personal well-being and health especially regarding an incurable disease. The government can't get AIDS, a person can.

    The one thing Dave is wrong on is not that he avoids fast food places with gay servers, is that he goes to fast food places to begin with. That's where he's wrong.
    i have no idea how any of that has anything to do with my post lol
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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    well see that i agree with but thats EXACTLY my point

    why is support for non-discrimination to work, get hired and equality under the law so high but for marriage so much lower? why do so many obviously view them different when they are the same
    My guess is that it's probably because they don't view it as a legal issue, as much as a personal morality issue.
    It gets cast into the relationshp bin, rather than the legality bin. When I have an intimate relationship with someone, the questions of law don't even occur to me.
    "God is the name by which I designate all things which cross my path violently and recklessly, all things which alter my plans and intentions, and change the course of my life, for better or for worse."
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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    This thread title seems a little vague to me.

    If the question is strictly about work discrimination?

    Then no, I do not support laws that allows the state to force private employers to hire and fire people as the state says.

    These are private companies and they should - no matter how deplorable - be able to pay anyone whatever they wish and fire anyone for whatever reason they wish. Employees can quit for any reason...employers should be able to fire them for any reason.

    Employers do not owe people jobs.

    If the employees don't like working for some jerk that discriminates against them...then quit.

    Thanks to the extensive welfare available in America, it's not like anyone needs to work to survive any more.
    Last edited by DA60; 02-10-14 at 11:09 AM.

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