View Poll Results: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

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  • Yes

    42 61.76%
  • No

    12 17.65%
  • Other

    14 20.59%
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Thread: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights? [W:85]

  1. #171
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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post
    1.)I see where you're coming from.

    Like most opinions that I have, I base them off of personal experience. Sometimes that experience is limited, I'll be the first to admit. The first thing that popped in to my head was college admissions. Not sure why it did, but it did.

    Anyway, say you're a young white or asian man who wants to go to school to be an engineer. If there's a woman who has the same or slightly worse grades as you, she will be admitted ahead of you because they don't have enough female engineering students. If there's an african american with the same or slightly worse grades as you, he/she will be admitted ahead of you because they don't have enough black engineering students.

    2.)So here I am, getting the shaft in that situation. The short end of the stick. See every time you make a law to prop someone else up, it knocks someone else out. Like with college admissions, that should just go to the most qualified applicant period, who cares what gender or race they belong to. That to me seems fair.

    3.)Workplace is no different. We have a mandate to hire a certain number of female managers. Doesn't matter if they're qualified, just need to meet a quota.

    4.)That's dumb.
    1.) again what you are describing is two things

    1 its illegal
    2 its factually NOT AA/EEO no matter what anybody says
    see the case Grutter v. Bollinger where Michigan was caught having a quota and giving extra points and they lost

    the issue is some people/orgs call thier policy AA/EEO but it factually is not

    just like a woman beater says he beats his wife out of love, he says it, he probably even believes it but you are smart enough to know better


    2,) again nobody is knocked down by definition it makes the change EQUAL

    3.) then your company is BREAKING THE LAW get an official document proving your company is commuting CRIMINAL ACTS and report them here


    USDOJ: Civil Rights Division How to File a Complaint page

    4.) yes i agree its dumb and its also not AA/EO

    report them, do not let thier criminal activity slide, if you do you are empowering the exact thing you hate, you are empowering criminals
    BE PART OF THE SOLUTION . . .report them
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  2. #172
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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    I've yet to see anyone receive any benefit from AA laws for being male. Can you name me one case where a man sued for not being hired because he was male? And won?



    white man winging gender discriminant case against a black women
    Judge awards $1.18 million in discrimination lawsuit against... | www.wsbtv.com
    Judge awards $1.18 million in discrimination lawsuit against Fulton County

    heres the hooter thing happen in a couple states but it seems two lost or are in stay and one was settled out of court thats why i posted the one above

    UnderCover Waitress: Men Sue Hooters for Sex Discrimination
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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    1.) again what you are describing is two things

    1 its illegal
    2 its factually NOT AA/EEO no matter what anybody says
    see the case Grutter v. Bollinger where Michigan was caught having a quota and giving extra points and they lost

    the issue is some people/orgs call thier policy AA/EEO but it factually is not

    just like a woman beater says he beats his wife out of love, he says it, he probably even believes it but you are smart enough to know better


    2,) again nobody is knocked down by definition it makes the change EQUAL

    3.) then your company is BREAKING THE LAW get an official document proving your company is commuting CRIMINAL ACTS and report them here


    USDOJ: Civil Rights Division How to File a Complaint page

    4.) yes i agree its dumb and its also not AA/EO

    report them, do not let thier criminal activity slide, if you do you are empowering the exact thing you hate, you are empowering criminals
    BE PART OF THE SOLUTION . . .report them
    I applied for college 10 years ago so maybe it has changed, but at that time it said right on the college application form that they were looking for a diverse student body so underrepresented minorities and women would be favored in the admissions process. Maybe that has changed.

    As for my employer, I have no reason to bite the hand that feeds. However, it is a mandate from our board of directors to hire a certain quota of female managers. If that's illegal, that's the first I've ever heard of it.

  4. #174
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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights? [W:85]

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    4D.) but it does, rights and laws make it that way and it certainly isnt civil. association takes a back seat because now it infringes on ones right to not be illegally discrimination against. Not right to a job thats just made up.
    The rest of your arguement is based upon this. So, lets focus on it. What Rights exactly are we talking about here? Well...Affirmative Action Laws are all about discrimination. So...is there a Right to not be discriminated against? This doesn't seem to be possible. People discriminate every single day. Would I get in trouble if I had no black friends? No Gay friends? Of course not. As we both agreed earlier that is a rediculous notion. So obviously there is no right to not be discriminated against. Do we have a right to association? Yep, we surely do. We constantly discriminate in the process. Indeed there isn't a single person that doesn't discriminate to some degree or another while exercising this right. Which is evidence in itself that there is definitely no right to not be discriminated against.

    So....if there is no right to not be discriminated against...and there is a right to association...that would mean that AA laws are actually violating peoples rights. Not protecting any rights. Because there are no rights to not be discriminated against.
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  5. #175
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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    the OP states rights are protected by anti-discrimination laws.

    well someone please state a list of rights, please provide something of a defined list.

    because i know of no laws created by the government which grant a citizen any rights.

  6. #176
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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post
    1.)I applied for college 10 years ago so maybe it has changed, but at that time it said right on the college application form that they were looking for a diverse student body so underrepresented minorities and women would be favored in the admissions process. Maybe that has changed.

    2.)As for my employer, I have no reason to bite the hand that feeds. However, it is a mandate from our board of directors to hire a certain quota of female managers.

    3.)If that's illegal, that's the first I've ever heard of it.
    1.) actually yes that case was in 2003 or so i thing and before that they used to get away with criminal activity much more
    2.) well thats your choice and yours alone but know they are breaking the law and NOT practicing AA/EEO

    I get the hand that fees you thing and thats how MANY people feel its not until somebody gets burnt that they report the crime or like you they dont even know the law protects them

    3.) yes it is if it can be proven. Memo from from the board? email from a manager/HR. etc
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  7. #177
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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    the OP states rights are protected by anti-discrimination laws.

    well someone please state a list of rights, please provide something of a defined list.

    because i know of no laws created by the government which grant a citizen any rights.
    The OP states a lot of things that don't make sense.

    The poll is poor, it only makes sense if you agree that you have a right to make a business give you custom or a right to be employed somewhere.

    If you don't agree with that premise in the first place, then you can't vote on it without ignoring part of the question ("that protect our rights?").

    If you DO agree with the premise, that these things ARE rights, then logically you would have to vote yes, as governments are supposed to protect rights, and they do this with laws.

  8. #178
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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights? [W:85]

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    1.)The rest of your arguement is based upon this.
    2.)So, lets focus on it. What Rights exactly are we talking about here?
    3.) Well...Affirmative Action Laws are all about discrimination. So...is there a Right to not be discriminated against? This doesn't seem to be possible.
    4.) People discriminate every single day.
    5.)Would I get in trouble if I had no black friends? No Gay friends? Of course not.
    6.) As we both agreed earlier that is a rediculous notion.
    7.) So obviously there is no right to not be discriminated against.
    8.) Do we have a right to association? Yep, we surely do.
    9.) We constantly discriminate in the process. Indeed there isn't a single person that doesn't discriminate to some degree or another while exercising this right.
    10.)Which is evidence in itself that there is definitely no right to not be discriminated against.
    11.)So....if there is no right to not be discriminated against...and there is a right to association...that would mean that AA laws are actually violating peoples rights. Not protecting any rights. Because there are no rights to not be discriminated against.
    1.) OK
    2.) civil rights
    3.) yes according to law but its only the discrimination that the law defines like civil rights
    4.) true but it has to be illegal discrimination. People have sex everyday to, some of it is a crime some of it is a felony
    5.) again this has nothing to do withh AA/EEO or civil rights or illegal discrimination. Your right to associate is preserved because it doesnt infringe on rights
    6.) yes your example is because it doesnt apply
    7.) false as i already pointed out and this isnt my opinion this is what the law and rights set up. Im only going by what they say.

    now we could disagree with them but they still make it currently true

    8.) yes and this is why you dont have to have a black "friend" lol

    9.) yes LEGAL discrimination just like legal sex or legal labor we provide etc

    you cant use blanket statments

    driving CAN be illegal
    killing CAN be illegal
    sex CAN be illegal

    but because theres cases where its not that doesn't make it always true

    i have the right to walk freely in public but i cant walk over you cause you are in my way and claim, "HEY you infringed on my freedom and liberty to walk" simple doesnt work that way

    10.) now you know this has been debunked and facts, laws and rights prove otherwise
    11.) see above this already doesnt line up

    aa/eeo protects rights that already been proven, we cant magically erase laws and rights
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  9. #179
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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by JayDubya View Post
    The OP states a lot of things that don't make sense.

    The poll is poor, it only makes sense if you agree that you have a right to make a business give you custom or a right to be employed somewhere.

    If you don't agree with that premise in the first place, then you can't vote on it without ignoring part of the question ("that protect our rights?").

    If you DO agree with the premise, that these things ARE rights, then logically you would have to vote yes, as governments are supposed to protect rights, and they do this with laws.
    the poll is based off of facts you cant change this
    if you disagree simply try, you will fail and fact, laws and rights will win based on their verbiage ad the fact the exist.
    disagree? then post the fats that make it wrong, id love to read them
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  10. #180
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    Re: Do you support non-discrimination laws that protect our rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    1.) actually yes that case was in 2003 or so i thing and before that they used to get away with criminal activity much more
    2.) well thats your choice and yours alone but know they are breaking the law and NOT practicing AA/EEO

    I get the hand that fees you thing and thats how MANY people feel its not until somebody gets burnt that they report the crime or like you they dont even know the law protects them

    3.) yes it is if it can be proven. Memo from from the board? email from a manager/HR. etc

    Well cool I learned something today. Thanks.

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