View Poll Results: Do You like this version of "America The Beautiful?"

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Thread: Your opinion on Coke's version of America The Beautiful? [W:1014]

  1. #961
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    re: Your opinion on Coke's version of America The Beautiful? [W:1014]

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Have you checked out the rates for single-parenthood among Latino's in the U.S.? Or rates of dependency on government subsidies? The idea of the "naturally conservative" hispanic immigrants is largely a myth, dude.
    "They" tend to be social conservative and economic liberal.

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    re: Your opinion on Coke's version of America The Beautiful? [W:1014]

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    We very well could see a Latino population that high in 50 years if immigration accelerates. Census demographers are assuming that Hispanic birth rates fall to the same levels of Whites and Asians in the coming decades.

    You argued that birth rates could not account for the population of Hispanics doubling in 50 years. I pointed out that they certainly could if you have a fertility rate of 2.4. Thus disproving your assertion. Which still don't seem to accept.
    My point was that immigration was the major driving force behind the Latino community's explosive population growth. That has not been disproven.

    Again, for the foreseeable future, immigration (both legal and illegal) is going to continue to account for somewhere between half and a quarter of the Latino American community's growth each year. This is going to add to the breeding population they already have, and increase their birth rates, as "off the boat" Latinos tend to have more children than the average American anyway.

    Even if my initial claim regarding the mechanics of the process was mistaken (which it probably is, if you take a more simplistic approach to the math which the census estimates clearly did not), the gist of my argument here really hasn't changed.

    All I can say is that if we return to a net increase in Hispanic immigration to the United States, then I sure hope their fertility rate declines, otherwise the environmental costs of that kind of population growth could be catastrophic.
    To be fair, we would still only have a fraction of India or China's population.

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    re: Your opinion on Coke's version of America The Beautiful? [W:1014]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gathomas88 View Post
    My point was that immigration was the major driving force behind the Latino community's explosive population growth. That has not been disproven.

    Again, for the foreseeable future, immigration (both legal and illegal) is going to continue to account for somewhere between half and a quarter of the Latino American community's growth each year. This is going to add to the breeding population they already have, and increase their birth rates, as "off the boat" Latinos tend to have more children than the average American anyway.

    Even if my initial claim regarding the mechanics of the process was mistaken (which it probably is, if you take a more simplistic approach to the math which the census estimates clearly did not), the gist of my argument here really hasn't changed.



    To be fair, we would still only have a fraction of India or China's population.
    Have you ever been to China or India? If birth rates increased even slightly across the board and immigration were to remain constant, in 100 years we would be looking at a population of at least 700 million in the continental US. We very well could have higher densities than China at that point.
    "You're the only person that decides how far you'll go and what you're capable of." - Ben Saunders (Explorer and Endurance Athlete)

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    re: Your opinion on Coke's version of America The Beautiful? [W:1014]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gathomas88 View Post
    The point here, is that there are estimated to be somewhere around 500,000 illegal Hispanic immigrants flooding into the United States each year. In addition to legal Hispanic immigration, we are very likely looking at a number closer to one million.

    Going on a fifty year model here, that would equate to a population doubling for the American Latino community in and of itself without even factoring for birth rates

    Since we're only expecting to see only a little over 100 million Latino Americans in the United States by 2050, clearly death rates must play a significant role in curbing their overall population growth.

    I never said that the Latino community could not grow of its own accord. I said that the growth in question would not be quote so explosive as what we are expecting to see if it were not for the effects of immigration.



    That seems kind of doubtful. The hipster might be an idiot, but that is only because he is deliberately choosing to behave like one.

    You are still going to have a lot more in common with an American in terms of cultural frame of reference and life experiences than you are a foreigner, and a non-English speaking one at that.
    The estimate was for 2013 somewhere around 285,000 illegal immigrants (source CNN Fact Check: Illegal border crossings at lowest levels in 40 years - CNN.com). They also catch hundreds of thousands before they cross the border and most likely also after they cross the border. So that figure of 500,000 seems way too high because most of these illegal immigrants will either leave voluntarily when they find out the grass isn't always greener on the other side of the border/they miss their families or they are caught and deported.

    Yes, the number of Hispanics will grow because they have higher birth rates compared to white caucasian people and until that stabilizes (because in time the Hispanic birth rate will also go down). And that will most likely have an effect on election results, especially if the republicans keep on having such a bad relation with Hispanics.
    Former military man (and now babysitter of Donald Trump) John Kelly, is a big loud lying empty barrel!

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    re: Your opinion on Coke's version of America The Beautiful? [W:1014]

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter King View Post
    The estimate was for 2013 somewhere around 285,000 illegal immigrants (source CNN Fact Check: Illegal border crossings at lowest levels in 40 years - CNN.com). They also catch hundreds of thousands before they cross the border and most likely also after they cross the border. So that figure of 500,000 seems way too high because most of these illegal immigrants will either leave voluntarily when they find out the grass isn't always greener on the other side of the border/they miss their families or they are caught and deported.

    Yes, the number of Hispanics will grow because they have higher birth rates compared to white caucasian people and until that stabilizes (because in time the Hispanic birth rate will also go down). And that will most likely have an effect on election results, especially if the republicans keep on having such a bad relation with Hispanics.
    True. Again, however; you cannot really deny that immigration also plays a major role in that.

    At least a quarter of Hispanic population growth each year is going to be due to immigration for the foreseeable future, and fresh arrivals also have higher birth rates than more native population groups.

    It also looks like illegals might be trending upwards again.

    Number of Illegal Immigrants in U.S. May Be on Rise Again, Estimates Say
    Last edited by Gathomas88; 02-07-14 at 02:17 PM.

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    re: Your opinion on Coke's version of America The Beautiful? [W:1014]

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    Have you ever been to China or India?
    I've been all over asia. However, I also pay attention to demographics, which is why I know that:

    If birth rates increased even slightly across the board and immigration were to remain constant, in 100 years we would be looking at a population of at least 700 million in the continental US. We very well could have higher densities than China at that point.
    The worries about overpopulation are... implausible at this point. We are currently at "peak child" in the world, China and Japan both have massive demographic problems where they have failed to reproduce their populace in sufficient numbers to take care of older generations. The global population is currently slated to peak in about the mid-2050s, at which point it will begin declining; a problem that will be one of the defining challenges of the middle two halves of the twenty first century (how to handle a surplus of elderly relative to workers, and then how to handle a shrinking populace).

    The movement among modernized nations is almost uniformly towards reducing birthrates, meaning that the populaces that will relatively dominate the future compared to their present position will be those who are least modernized. This is largely the result of social and economic drivers that do not tweak in the opposite direction; the best we can hope for is to continue to break even as a birthrate.

    Now, mind you, we might hit 700 million in a century - who knows. But that will be immigration-driven, not birth rate driven, our birth-rates are already below replacement level.

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    re: Your opinion on Coke's version of America The Beautiful? [W:1014]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gathomas88 View Post
    Because it isn't true, obviously. Your "calculations" are flawed.

    I don't think you understand, Sangha. I only bothered trying to reason with you as a formality.

    The fact that immigration will soon be the primary source of US population growth is common knowledge.

    Immigration Will Fuel Future Population Growth, Census Says
    So you can't prove all the other inane claims you made, so now you're going to make another claim, which BTW is based on the most extreme of their projections.

    The Latino community simply happens to be one of the groups most strongly benefiting from this fact.
    It sounds like you're really bothered by the fact that someone other than white people are going to benefit.

    Nothing bigoted about that.


    Nope. American culture has been the mainstream since after the Mexican American War.
    And has been, and continues to be, strongly influence by Latino culture. Always has, and always will

    Spouting blatant nonsense does not make it true.
    Then stop doing it and recognize that Latino culture is a part of american culture



    Nonsense. Prove it.
    Prove that Mexicans have always been in Texas and California, which was a part of Mexico?

    That's hilarious!


    To the point of not even speaking the same primary languages or considering themselves to be primarily "American?"

    Again, Sangha, spouting nonsense as if it were a fact does not make it one.
    Then stop spouting nonsense about how Latinos don't speak English. They do



    And? Look at the difference they make.

    Again, black population growth without the influence of immigration is relatively stable. Latino population growth with the addition of immigration is explosive.
    Because their birth rate is much higher

    That was my point all along. Keep up.
    No, you've tried to make many points. You can't prove any of them.

    And you can't even admit that you were wrong when you claimed that the black and Latino birth rates were similar.
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    re: Your opinion on Coke's version of America The Beautiful? [W:1014]

    Quote Originally Posted by americanwoman View Post
    ^^ this.

    I was going to say something similar to this --- what is being assimilated to 'american culture' because we as a country are very different culturaly. If you put a northerner down south, must they adapt to southern living to assimilate themselves? If not, why don't they have the same expectations?
    He's operating under the delusion that there's one american culture, presumably white.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    re: Your opinion on Coke's version of America The Beautiful? [W:1014]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gathomas88 View Post
    They were isolated from one another, and from their homelands.

    Modern Latino immigrants are not, by and large.
    Chinese immigrants back then were not isolated from one another. They lived in the same areas and interacted with each other daily.


    I thought you just claimed that "Mexican culture" has always existed in the US?

    That wouldn't be "assimilation."
    Sure it is.




    Prove that you factored in death rates. I want to see the calculations.

    Going off of your logic here, and the fact that Latino immigration is expected to remain more or less constant, their population growth would be massively over 100 million.
    You're making up #'s again.


    I've traveled and I've met people from all over. None of them are more "alien" than a non-English speaking immigrant.
    And there are relatively few Latinos who do not speak English. They're not alien.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    re: Your opinion on Coke's version of America The Beautiful? [W:1014]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gathomas88 View Post
    True, but I think religion plays heavily into upbringing and environment in the first place.

    The overall importance of religion to our society has greatly declined over the course of the last century or so, and this has served to make both the general cultural environment and standards of upbringing a lot more morally relaxed.

    This has pretty strongly correlated with an increase in the prevalency of things like single motherhood and divorce.
    I think education plays a bigger role than religion. These girls need to realize that being a teen mother is very difficult and taxing. It's not like babysitting. They also need to be made to realize that these cute little babies grow up into actual children and then teenagers. I also think that there are a lot of situations where nothing may work at all because some of these girls probably come from broken homes, abusive parents, etc. I think that if you have parents that raise their daughter(s) to be happy and confident as well as educated, then that can work too.

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