View Poll Results: Do You like this version of "America The Beautiful?"

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Thread: Your opinion on Coke's version of America The Beautiful? [W:1014]

  1. #361
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    re: Your opinion on Coke's version of America The Beautiful? [W:1014]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gathomas88 View Post
    I'm not saying that they all are. There are plenty of hard working immigrants in this country who seem to legitimately understand how to become productive members of our society.

    Asian Americans, for instance; seem to "get" the idea behind assimilation remarkably well on average. They have prospered (some times, even to a greater degree than native born Americans) as such.

    However, you cannot really deny that there are some immigrant populations out there which seem to struggle with this concept, and that this can be a legitimate problem.

    The last thing we need to be doing right now is blatantly encouraging them to persist in such behavior.
    Exactly, they are responsible for themselves. There is no reason why we have to coddle immigrants and change our ways to make things easier for them, while at the same time making things even more difficult for ourselves. It doesn't even make sense to me that people would want a country where no one speaks the same language. How would you ever communicate with others to get anything accomplished? It would create such problems and cost so much extra money for signs in other languages, etc. It's just such a stupid suggestion.

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    re: Your opinion on Coke's version of America The Beautiful? [W:1014]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gathomas88 View Post
    Exactly. It simply isn't possible to form a meaningful sense of collective identity or purpose in such an environment.

    Instead, people tend to gravitate only to the interests of their particular ethnic group. This creates unnecessary factionalism, which can be (and often is) harmful to society as a whole if left unchecked.
    They gravitate because when they have the numbers it's just easier and less hassle than to bother with the language/culture thing. If it continues, however, it will lead to the ghettoization of that community.

  3. #363
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    re: Your opinion on Coke's version of America The Beautiful? [W:1014]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gathomas88 View Post
    Exactly. It simply isn't possible to form a meaningful sense of collective identity or purpose in such an environment.

    Instead, people tend to gravitate only to the interests of their particular ethnic group. This creates unnecessary factionalism, which can be (and often is) harmful to society as a whole if left unchecked.

    Exactly, thank you.


    It's one thing to have your own family traditions and celebrate your origins and such... nothing wrong with that.

    But when an inability to communicate with large swathes of the general population is the norm... how do you integrate? How do you establish a sense of belonging and fellow-citizenship when you can't even have a frigging conversation??



    As I said, in my own county (rural south), we have fairly substantial populations who speak Spanish, Vietnamese, Cambodian/Laotian, Korean, Chinese, Hindi and Arabic as their native tongues... can anyone seriously suggest that we accommodate ALL those languages in every gov't office? Even if we did, how do we form a community when most of the local natives can't talk to most of the Hispanics, who can't talk to the Cambodians, who can't carry on a conversation with the Hindi, etc etc... unless we pick one language as the real official language?

    Like say I dunno... English? Just a suggestion...

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    re: Your opinion on Coke's version of America The Beautiful? [W:1014]

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    Exactly, they are responsible for themselves. There is no reason why we have to coddle immigrants and change our ways to make things easier for them, while at the same time making things even more difficult for ourselves. It doesn't even make sense to me that people would want a country where no one speaks the same language. How would you ever communicate with others to get anything accomplished? It would create such problems and cost so much extra money for signs in other languages, etc. It's just such a stupid suggestion.
    It is very foolish because each ethnic community (often with sub groups such as sex, etc.) works against the other in order to advance their own group. Politicians will, of course, exploit these schisms and you will have Americans (or Canadian) vying against each other rather than cooperating for the national good.

    In fact that all sounds very familiar now.

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    re: Your opinion on Coke's version of America The Beautiful? [W:1014]

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    One of the worst possible things in a given nation is large segments of the population who are utterly unable to communicate with each other.


    Just in my county, we have a large Hispanic community, a fairly large Asian community (mostly Hmong, Cambodian and Laotian, some Korean and Chinese also), fairly decent number of Hindi and a scattering of Pakistani and etc... well, not one person in a million is enough of a polyglot to learn ALL those languages... so we need ONE common tongue everyone speaks that is the official language.

    How can people feel a fellow-citizen-connection with a community they cannot communicate with? Not easily...
    You can also promote bilingualism like we do and language differences tend to end with the first generation immigrants, the children will speak whatever language is the official/dominant language(s) in the country.

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    re: Your opinion on Coke's version of America The Beautiful? [W:1014]

    Quote Originally Posted by Carjosse View Post
    You can also promote bilingualism like we do and language differences tend to end with the first generation immigrants, the children will speak whatever language is the official/dominant language(s) in the country.


    I've already pointed out that it isn't merely a question of bilingualism. In my rural southern county we've got substantial populations that speak Spanish, Vietnamese, Cambodian/Laotian, Chinese, Korean, Hindi dialects and Arabic.

    You can't accommodate ALL those languages in all ways.... and again, this is a semi-rural county, many places have FAR more diverse populations.

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    re: Your opinion on Coke's version of America The Beautiful? [W:1014]

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    I've already pointed out that it isn't merely a question of bilingualism. In my rural southern county we've got substantial populations that speak Spanish, Vietnamese, Cambodian/Laotian, Chinese, Korean, Hindi dialects and Arabic.

    You can't accommodate ALL those languages in all ways.... and again, this is a semi-rural county, many places have FAR more diverse populations.
    Give it a generation, all of the children will be speaking English and the parents will have to be able to speak somewhat well.

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    re: Your opinion on Coke's version of America The Beautiful? [W:1014]

    Quote Originally Posted by Carjosse View Post
    Give it a generation, all of the children will be speaking English and the parents will have to be able to speak somewhat well.


    That's part of the problem: some people seem to think we're being horrific terrible bigots if we expect them to learn to speak English.

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    re: Your opinion on Coke's version of America The Beautiful? [W:1014]

    Quote Originally Posted by opendebate View Post
    What does making an effort mean
    what does one do when they behave like one
    what qualifies someone to be classified as a contributing member
    I refer you here to the response I made when Superfly asked the same question.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gathomas88 View Post
    They speak our language. They obey our laws. They make an effort to ingratiate themselves with the people living here before they arrived and contribute something to the collective whole of our society as a whole.

    They don't saunter in like they own the place, and demand that everyone else change to accommodate them. Such people are not behaving like potential citizens, with an interest in becoming a part of our greater culture, but arrogant tourists.

    They should be treated as such.
    If someone wants to be a part of our community, they are going to have to be wiling to "play the game." It's as simple as that.

    The basic problems with these is that you, typically, offer a very narrow definition that really only works as long as you're the one making the rules.
    It's our country. If a given individual doesn't like the way we happen to do things, they don't have to live here.

    "In Rome, do as the Romans do."

    For some people learning a second language is very difficult and they never master it. It does not mean the should be excluded from being considered an American
    They don't have to "master" anything. A basic level of competency should suffice.

    Frankly, if the immigrant in question is too dense to handle even that, what on Earth would we want them for anyway?

    The United States isn't a non-profit charity. We need people who are actually going to contribute to making this country better, not hold it back.

    Frankly that last part makes it sound like they would fit right in.
    That's not a good thing.

    That's about as fundamentally an UnAmerican thing as I've heard anyone say. Please go back to your homeland.
    It's the truth.

    Someone who "brings something to the table" will always be worth more than someone who has nothing to offer.

    Besides, something tells me that "not speaking english" creates an unwelcome burden for anyone immigrating here that I am sure they would rather not have.
    They apparently keep coming anyway regardless.

    You tell me why.

    As long as they are exactly like you?
    As long as they make an attempt to transition themselves into our society as large.

    WTH does that even mean???!!!
    It means that when you come to this nation, you cease being whatever you were before, and become an "American" instead.

    There is a difference between being an "American" and a Mexican, Canadian, or etca who simply happens to be living "in America."

    If a person is not willing to commit themselves to this nation or its common cultural identity (language being one aspect of that), they frankly have no business being here.

    You are being superficial. It got to the very heart of what we have in common. Speaking a different language is not an indicator of what country you are loyal too.
    It certainly isn't an indicator of loyalty to this one.
    Last edited by Gathomas88; 02-04-14 at 10:02 PM.

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    re: Your opinion on Coke's version of America The Beautiful? [W:1014]

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    That's part of the problem: some people seem to think we're being horrific terrible bigots if we expect them to learn to speak English.
    Where is the Spanish translation of your post at?

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