View Poll Results: Should we tax religious institutions?

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  • yes

    32 57.14%
  • no

    24 42.86%
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Thread: Should we tax religious institutions?

  1. #91
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    Re: Should we tax religious institutions?

    Quote Originally Posted by point1percent View Post
    Taxing the rich is a common theme these days, but there is no talk of taxing religion. Why is that? The Catholic Church has a combined wealth that is near impossible to calculate, but rest assured it makes Bill Gates look like just another poor guy. They pay no taxes but rake in billions. Where does all that money go? Do you really think it is making its way back to the people, especially the poor? And why does God need money? Surely anyone who can create a universe doesn't need money. Seems like organized religion is a goldmine that could be used to save the poor and the middle class.
    So why not leave the money with organized religion to use for the poor and middle class? And why should it be anybody else's business, most especially the federal government, what happens to the money that the religious voluntarily contribute to a religious organization?

    There is no way that the federal government can tax religious organizations without violating provisions of the First Amendment at face value.
    "I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it." --Benjamin Franklin 1776

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    Re: Should we tax religious institutions?

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    Actually the law says they cant be substantially invloved in political campaigns for office. They, and all 501c's can be as political as they want.
    According to the official IRS rules, that's not true:

    Exemption Requirements - Section 501(c)(3) Organizations
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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    Re: Should we tax religious institutions?

    Quote Originally Posted by point1percent View Post
    Taxing the rich is a common theme these days, but there is no talk of taxing religion. Why is that? The Catholic Church has a combined wealth that is near impossible to calculate, but rest assured it makes Bill Gates look like just another poor guy. They pay no taxes but rake in billions. Where does all that money go? Do you really think it is making its way back to the people, especially the poor? And why does God need money? Surely anyone who can create a universe doesn't need money. Seems like organized religion is a goldmine that could be used to save the poor and the middle class.
    What would you tax? There is no income. It is just a large group of people pooling their money together. You could tax their property. I'm cool with that. What type of tax would the Catholic Church pay if it wasn't tax exempt?

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    Re: Should we tax religious institutions?

    Quote Originally Posted by point1percent View Post
    You speak like it hasn't happened yet. In fact, the cozy relationship between church and state is getting old and no longer brings much benefit, to the rich, to the right, or to the people in general, IMO. I'll be blunt and to the point. Maybe the people should stop putting their faith, and money, in organized religion and instead put their faith in their own abilities and take care of themselves for a change. Then, instead of giving their money to those shysters of organized religion, they could invest it in education and skills that make them more productive.
    The threat of revoking tax-exempt status is what keeps churches out of politics. Recall the Church at Pierce Creek in Binghamton, NY, which had placed an advertisement in USA Today and the Washington Times rebuking Bill Clinton four days before the 1992 presidential election.

    Yes we're basically paying the church to stay out of politics by giving them various exemptions. It's expensive because it's worth it. Have a look at Catholic Church controlled Ireland and Brazil: Do you like their laws on abortion?

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    Re: Should we tax religious institutions?

    Quote Originally Posted by RabidAlpaca View Post
    Definitely taxed. They are a private organization that makes profits.
    Enlightment to what a profit is.

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    Re: Should we tax religious institutions?

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    It could backfire if they came out in the open and competed like the rest.Churches are very numerous and many of them have a lot of money. If you did a google map search on a large city in the US and church it would look like one of those very complicated connect the dot pictures.
    That wealth is gathered with charity is it not? Can the money gathered from charity be used for political campaigns?
    Quote Originally Posted by poweRob View Post
    Stats come out and always show life getting better. News makes money in making you think its not.
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    Re: Should we tax religious institutions?

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    So why not leave the money with organized religion to use for the poor and middle class? And why should it be anybody else's business, most especially the federal government, what happens to the money that the religious voluntarily contribute to a religious organization?

    There is no way that the federal government can tax religious organizations without violating provisions of the First Amendment at face value.
    Because that money does not end up in the hands of the poor and middle class. If organized religion were run as a charity I would have no problem, but the fact that it is a big business that does relatively little charity is a problem. I argue that they do just enough charity to keep up the appearance, that's it. If you don't believe that organized religion is just big business, ask yourself why the Vatican needs a bank. And don't get me started on that. The Vatican is more corrupt than the mafia it launders money for.


    Quote Originally Posted by vasuderatorrent View Post
    What would you tax? There is no income. It is just a large group of people pooling their money together. You could tax their property. I'm cool with that. What type of tax would the Catholic Church pay if it wasn't tax exempt?
    Call it donations, or charity or anything you like, but it is income for that business. And not the only source, as people give them many other assets, like homes, property, stocks and bonds, and more. They use that income to buy influence and political control, with a small dose of charity to maintain the illusion.


    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    The threat of revoking tax-exempt status is what keeps churches out of politics. Recall the Church at Pierce Creek in Binghamton, NY, which had placed an advertisement in USA Today and the Washington Times rebuking Bill Clinton four days before the 1992 presidential election.

    Yes we're basically paying the church to stay out of politics by giving them various exemptions. It's expensive because it's worth it. Have a look at Catholic Church controlled Ireland and Brazil: Do you like their laws on abortion?
    Last I saw organized religion is very active in politics. Just go to any political fundraiser, then hop over to Capitol Hill and watch all the religious lobbies walk by. And then there's the mother of all organized religion, the Catholic Church. Yeah, they keep their nose out of politics. The Italian govt. doesn't sneeze without asking the pope's blessing first.


    What I think I sense is the stout conservatives here getting scared of cracking down on organized religion because it is a key source of votes. I make the argument that by carrying these two-faced nutjobs along for extra votes does more damage than it does good. It smears the image of the party. Instead of pandering to the religious, why can't we find someone who has a real pair of balls that outlines a new game plan to make this country great again without having to put all our faith in God and government to achieve that? Something everybody, including those on the left, can believe in?

  8. #98
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    Re: Should we tax religious institutions?

    Quote Originally Posted by DDD View Post
    That wealth is gathered with charity is it not? Can the money gathered from charity be used for political campaigns?
    Workers Unions,Gay,Lesbian & Tranny organizations, planned parenthood, Brady Campaign,NRA,GOA and other groups use their money to donate to and or promote candidates sympathetic to their causes. Why wouldn't churches do the same,especially if they had to pay taxes?
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

  9. #99
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    Re: Should we tax religious institutions?

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    And they arent really competing. They dont sell or produce things generally. They exist off donations, and the donations are spent on prostelitizing, cemetaries, teachers, buildings, etc, tools they need to serve their religion.
    They might want to add promoting candidates sympathetic to their causes to that list.A candidate sympathetic to their cause could be one of the tools needed to serve their religion.

    For the sake of argument, Im ignoring those megachurches that might very well just be money making schemes for the owners. Thats more the exception that the rule. Most 501c churches are local, exisiting almost entirely off donations, not revenue from selling things.
    That might be true with small non-denominational churches. However many of those churches are part of a larger organizations.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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    Re: Should we tax religious institutions?

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    Workers Unions,Gay,Lesbian & Tranny organizations, planned parenthood, Brady Campaign,NRA,GOA and other groups use their money to donate to and or promote candidates sympathetic to their causes. Why wouldn't churches do the same,especially if they had to pay taxes?
    Was a question for I do not reside in USA.

    If that is the case then rather then accumulating the donations they should spend it like the rest of us in campaigns. Rich or not it is time to treat them like any other political party that they have always been hiding in a rogue manner till today!
    Quote Originally Posted by poweRob View Post
    Stats come out and always show life getting better. News makes money in making you think its not.
    The Republic of Dardania is the proper name for: http://www.debatepolitics.com/europe...ification.html

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