View Poll Results: Do you believe in seat belt laws?

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  • Yes

    74 62.18%
  • No

    45 37.82%
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Thread: Do you believe in seat belt laws for consenting adults?

  1. #501
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    Re: Do you believe in seat belt laws for consenting adults?

    Quote Originally Posted by year2late View Post
    Where football is concerned, you have two groups that have mutually accepted risks - and the injuries are clearly not as routinely acutely devastating as in a major car wreck.

    And do they not routinely wear helmets to minimize damage?
    Quote Originally Posted by MoSurveyor View Post
    Everyone who plays football (well, real football, not that flag-tag wimpy stuff) uses a helmet. Over time those safety devices have gotten better and better and the number of injuries has gone down considerably. What you're doing by not wearing seat belts is worse than playing football without a helmet.
    You are both actually missing the point of what I responded to. Remember that I support the seat belt laws because of how they will aid the driver in not causing injuries to others by keeping them in the seat and providing a higher chance of, if not getting the vehicle under control, providing purposeful direction. But once we put aside the issue of potential injury to others, do we make a law that removes a freedom simply under the concept of "saving the taxpayers a chunk of change"? Football was just the example that came off the top of my head that was comparable to motorcycle helmet law intent.
    Bi, Poly, Switch. I'm not indecisive, I'm greedy!

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    Re: Do you believe in seat belt laws for consenting adults?

    Quote Originally Posted by maquiscat View Post
    But once we put aside the issue of potential injury to others, do we make a law that removes a freedom simply under the concept of "saving the taxpayers a chunk of change"?
    If driving were a right I would say no, we shouldn't.

    But driving is not a right, and now taxpayers will be paying for individual's injuries through ObamaCare, so I say yes, we should remove the freedom to drive without a seat-belt.

  3. #503
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    Re: Do you believe in seat belt laws for consenting adults?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    If driving were a right I would say no, we shouldn't.

    But driving is not a right, and now taxpayers will be paying for individual's injuries through ObamaCare, so I say yes, we should remove the freedom to drive without a seat-belt.
    Are you that dishonest in your post that you have to change what I said?
    Bi, Poly, Switch. I'm not indecisive, I'm greedy!

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    Re: Do you believe in seat belt laws for consenting adults?

    Quote Originally Posted by maquiscat View Post
    Are you that dishonest in your post that you have to change what I said?
    Are you that dishonest in your post that you have to accuse me of changing what you said?

  5. #505
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    Re: Do you believe in seat belt laws for consenting adults?

    Quote Originally Posted by maquiscat View Post
    You are both actually missing the point of what I responded to. Remember that I support the seat belt laws because of how they will aid the driver in not causing injuries to others by keeping them in the seat and providing a higher chance of, if not getting the vehicle under control, providing purposeful direction. But once we put aside the issue of potential injury to others, do we make a law that removes a freedom simply under the concept of "saving the taxpayers a chunk of change"? Football was just the example that came off the top of my head that was comparable to motorcycle helmet law intent.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    If driving were a right I would say no, we shouldn't.

    But driving is not a right, and now taxpayers will be paying for individual's injuries through ObamaCare, so I say yes, we should remove the freedom to drive without a seat-belt.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Are you that dishonest in your post that you have to accuse me of changing what you said?
    I'm honest enough to say that you did. I noted that the seat belt laws were not on the same level as the helmet laws because helmets don't help you maintain your seat and have better chances of controlling/regaining control of your vehicle. My whole question was based upon the premise that since helmets did not perform the same function of reducing the odds of the person not using it in not harming others should we reduce the freedom of choice on the premise previously quoted? And then you say that we should remove the freedom to drive without seat belts. You are shifting the subject since I was talking about helmets.
    Bi, Poly, Switch. I'm not indecisive, I'm greedy!

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    Re: Do you believe in seat belt laws for consenting adults?

    Quote Originally Posted by maquiscat View Post
    You are both actually missing the point of what I responded to. Remember that I support the seat belt laws because of how they will aid the driver in not causing injuries to others by keeping them in the seat and providing a higher chance of, if not getting the vehicle under control, providing purposeful direction. But once we put aside the issue of potential injury to others, do we make a law that removes a freedom simply under the concept of "saving the taxpayers a chunk of change"? Football was just the example that came off the top of my head that was comparable to motorcycle helmet law intent.
    Your point is not lost on me, let us just call it a two-fer.

    The side of the law that saves us a chunk of change should appeal to the fiscal conservatives, the part of the law that saves a life (in theory) should appeal to prolifers, the part of the law that saves someone a whole lotta pain should appeal to the rational.

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    Re: Do you believe in seat belt laws for consenting adults?

    Quote Originally Posted by maquiscat View Post
    I'm honest enough to say that you did. I noted that the seat belt laws were not on the same level as the helmet laws because helmets don't help you maintain your seat and have better chances of controlling/regaining control of your vehicle. My whole question was based upon the premise that since helmets did not perform the same function of reducing the odds of the person not using it in not harming others should we reduce the freedom of choice on the premise previously quoted? And then you say that we should remove the freedom to drive without seat belts. You are shifting the subject since I was talking about helmets.
    I made a statement about my own opinion. I said nothing about what you said, your opinions, your argument, and I certainly didn't change anything.

  8. #508
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    Re: Do you believe in seat belt laws for consenting adults?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    I made a statement about my own opinion. I said nothing about what you said, your opinions, your argument, and I certainly didn't change anything.
    By quoting my post regarding helmets you imply that you are responding to such. If you are not then you need to make it clear that you are shifting the subject. Either be honest enough to do so when you post or be man enough to admit that you had failed to see where I had made my focus on helmets

    Quote Originally Posted by year2late View Post
    Your point is not lost on me, let us just call it a two-fer.

    The side of the law that saves us a chunk of change should appeal to the fiscal conservatives, the part of the law that saves a life (in theory) should appeal to prolifers, the part of the law that saves someone a whole lotta pain should appeal to the rational.
    But where is the line? Do we remove the ability to jump out of perfectly good airplanes (skydiving) to save potential pain, life and money on injuries?
    Bi, Poly, Switch. I'm not indecisive, I'm greedy!

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    Re: Do you believe in seat belt laws for consenting adults?

    Quote Originally Posted by maquiscat View Post
    By quoting my post regarding helmets you imply that you are responding to such. If you are not then you need to make it clear that you are shifting the subject. Either be honest enough to do so when you post or be man enough to admit that you had failed to see where I had made my focus on helmets
    Note that what I actually quoted of your post contains nothing about helmets. I key'd in on your question about denying a freedom to save money, and that's the only part of what you said I was responding to. All that bull**** about football doesn't even belong in this thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by maquiscat View Post
    But where is the line?
    There is no line, actual or proverbial. The law has never been consistent or rational across the spectrum of topics. It never will be.

  10. #510
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    Re: Do you believe in seat belt laws for consenting adults?

    Quote Originally Posted by maquiscat View Post
    By quoting my post regarding helmets you imply that you are responding to such. If you are not then you need to make it clear that you are shifting the subject. Either be honest enough to do so when you post or be man enough to admit that you had failed to see where I had made my focus on helmets



    But where is the line? Do we remove the ability to jump out of perfectly good airplanes (skydiving) to save potential pain, life and money on injuries?
    Well, to me the line is a greater good. How many people who recreationally skydive clog up ERs half dead leaving children and widows in the lurch......or left so catastrophically injured that the state will have to pitch in for the remaining decades of his life to keep him afloat?

    I think that is the difference. Seatbelts make a huge difference in the survivalbility of an accident and the severity of the injuries. GIven that most Americans find themselves in a car and rarely jumping out of a plane makes the greater good difference.

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