View Poll Results: should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason

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  • yes

    75 52.45%
  • no

    68 47.55%
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Thread: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish[W:126]

  1. #51
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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish

    I voted "no" because there are too many reasons you could get fired simply because the boss doesn't like you.

    I am actually a little worried about this right now, for my daughter. She just got this great new job, but the assistant manager doesn't like her. She doesn't like my daughter because she strongly dislikes the girlfriend of the manager, and the girlfriend of the manager is a close family friend. So she is pretty rough on my daughter at work, when no one else is there. Guilt by association, I guess.

    Well the manager is watching over things, making sure that nothing happens to my daughter, telling her if she has a problem to come to him. Well we found out yesterday that there's a strong possibility that he's moving to Miami, and she might get the promotion. If that happens, my daughter is history.

  2. #52
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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    Sans contract, that's the way it is. Works for me.

    Edit: The German has reminded me that various state and federal civil rights laws prohibit discrimination. I should say that I agree with these laws.
    Hard to enforce, but no one should be fired for being gay, pregnant, black, Muslim, etc.



    Anyone who hires or fires anyone in violation of the 1964 Civil Rights Act May have a problem with the USA's Justice Department.

  3. #53
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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Someone who fires a pregnant woman because she is pregnant should be prevented from doing so by the law.
    On the other hand, an employer should be allowed to ask if a potential employee intends to get pregnant. work schedules and production require a reliable and consistent performance of labor. A pregnant laborer interrupts the flow resulting in lower production and increased costs. There are definitely two sides to this debate.

  4. #54
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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish

    In our current model, other than some reasonable discriminatory, blackmail, extortion, etc., requirements, yes.
    Similarly employees can leave for any reason, and can often go to a competitor, or the customer you assigned them to, and other shenanigans.

    With regards to pregnant women, any employer who doesn't plan for this shouldn't be an employer. Women may get pregnant, have reduced work hours or need long stretches of time off, and they may benefit from part-time work for a while. accommodating that helps everyone, and an employer may be surprised to find someone working only 30 hours a week who is excited about "getting out of the house" may boost productivity. Not all jobs are suitable for this, but many are, especially anything that involves a team of more than one person.
    Last edited by Mach; 01-23-14 at 11:59 AM.

  5. #55
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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveFagan View Post
    On the other hand, an employer should be allowed to ask if a potential employee intends to get pregnant. work schedules and production require a reliable and consistent performance of labor. A pregnant laborer interrupts the flow resulting in lower production and increased costs. There is definitely two sides to this debate.
    Agree with that. I used to run a collision department, and was fired because I was pregnant, because of the chemicals.

  6. #56
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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish

    Quote Originally Posted by eohrnberger View Post
    Don't most of us work in 'At Will' states? This means that employees can be fired for any reason or no reason,unless there's a claim of some sort of discrimination, but it also means that the employee can quit with no notice either, so it's a 2 way street.
    I worked for a sorry company that had a policy of if the employee quits without a 2 week notice, if they are making more than minimum wage, it will be reduced to that for doing do. If they wanted it even, what gave them the right to do that?

  7. #57
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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish

    Quote Originally Posted by Slyfox696
    If you listen hard enough, you can probably hear me roll my eyes.
    They make eye drops for that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Slyfox696
    But they ARE forced to work in SOME industry or business.
    Every person on the face of the planet must choose to provide for themselves and their family or to allow them to die. Perhaps this is a harsh and unfair condition, but it is the reality in which we live. Furthermore, every person has the capacity to attain the necessary means to satisfy their ends in a variety of ways. Wage earning is simply one method. Again, not everyone is born into a fantastically rich family, but not everyone is born with two legs and ten fingers either. Nature finds it necessary to bestow each person with a different set of attributes which includes strengths and weaknesses. It is up to each individual to determine how best to provide themselves with a rich and full life, not society.

    Quote Originally Posted by Slyfox696
    Or they can send those jobs overseas to China where they can pay employees $.15 an hour with no bathroom break.
    You would prefer that Chinese workers toil in the fields for $.05 an hour? Sweatshop Blues

    Quote Originally Posted by Slyfox696
    Explain Wal-Mart then. Poorly compensated, unhelpful workers and it's easily the largest supermarket chain in America.
    Many people boycott Walmart because of perceived injustices it commits against its workers and suppliers. Many more do not hold this belief.
    Making Change at Walmart
    Boycott Walmart Facebook Page
    Boycott Walmart

    Quote Originally Posted by Slyfox696
    And in many places, refusing to hire black people will boost their business with those who are racist.
    The opposite is true as well. Hobby Lobby has publicly taken a very pro-Christian stance and has likely enhanced its image with similar ideological customers while losing a few anti-Christian customers. Does this action fall in your definition of unacceptable? Christian book stores stock, oddly enough, Christian books. Is this discriminatory? Jewish Temples only hire Jews. Discriminatory? Yes. Should it be prohibited? You seem to think so.

    Quote Originally Posted by Slyfox696
    Granting all power in a job relationship to the employer is not freedom, it's oppression of the employee.
    If you owned a business you would quickly realize that employers by no means have all the power. The act of hiring competent employees is damn near impossible. So many people today believe that having a job is a right so they give very little productive effort. Even the workers who have a decent work ethic do not put forth even remotely as much effort as the owners because they are guaranteed a paycheck. The owners must assume all of the risk and hope for a profit, but the employees simply have to show up and not screw up enough to get fired. People like you want to encourage this behavior.

    As someone mentioned previously, it is neither enjoyable nor efficient to fire an employee. However little productive labor was obtained will suddenly be lost. Production schedules need to be adjusted. Output is affected which changes customer attitude. Time needs to be diverted from productive labor to searching for a replacement employee. More time needs to be diverted to training. All in the hopes that the person who probably lied through his teeth during his interview will turn out to enjoy the job enough that he won’t quit within a week or two.

    Yet the employer has all of the power? Incredible!

    An employee shows up, clocks in, and lollygags for a couple minutes while slowly getting into the day’s routine. Takes a break or two. BSs with his coworkers. Takes a nice long lunch. And finally goes home at an established time. Perhaps he is “unlucky” enough to work overtime and get time and a half. But at the end of the pay period, whether the business made a profit or not, he gets a paycheck. Perhaps after work he goes to school and looks for a better job. Then one day he gives his two week notice (if the employer is lucky) and off he goes to a better job.

    Woe is me! Poor employee!

    The simple truth is that the employee is at the mercy of the employer while the employer is at the mercy of the employee. It is a symbiotic relationship which is completely unsustainable without both parties. Power is shared between the two of them and bickering about who has more or less power is nothing more than an act of cutting hairs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Slyfox696
    So...making sure people are treated equally is tyrannical?
    People are not equal! Attempting to make them so is tyrannical because you have to forcefully pull some down to push others up.

  8. #58
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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish

    Quote Originally Posted by lawboy View Post
    I worked for a sorry company that had a policy of if the employee quits without a 2 week notice, if they are making more than minimum wage, it will be reduced to that for doing do. If they wanted it even, what gave them the right to do that?
    Why would you not extend a two weeks notice to an employer? They would likely just fire you on the spot if they could, but they have to pay unemployment as forced by the state/federal government if they do that. So their hands are tied, reducing your pay to min legal is still a net-benefit compared to what they would without market distortion in favor of employees.

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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish

    Quote Originally Posted by Mach View Post
    Why would you not extend a two weeks notice to an employer? They would likely just fire you on the spot if they could, but they have to pay unemployment as forced by the state/federal government if they do that.

    IF the employee is fired with cause, and it is determined to be, then unemployment will be denied. If the employer does not wish to pay out, then do not fire the employee without cause, period.

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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish

    Quote Originally Posted by lawboy View Post
    I worked for a sorry company that had a policy of if the employee quits without a 2 week notice, if they are making more than minimum wage, it will be reduced to that for doing do. If they wanted it even, what gave them the right to do that?
    This strikes me as some sort of violation of law and common decency.
    However, chances are, that with the amount in question, it'd not be pursued legally, as it wouldn't be worth it. But that doesn't make it any more the 'correct' or 'right' thing to do.

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