View Poll Results: should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason

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  • yes

    75 52.45%
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Thread: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish[W:126]

  1. #521
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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    That's clearly not the case though since any supposed right that is proposed can be easily violated. If a right to life were inviolable, I couldn't put a gun to your head and pull the trigger. Clearly that's wrong.
    That's what I'm saying though - a truly inalienable right could not actually be violated whatever happened.

    Perhaps the only one that comes close would be "freedom of thought" or something - until someone develops mind control or the like.
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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish[W:126]

    Quote Originally Posted by danielpalos View Post
    Why don't we measure unemployment by the amount of people on unemployment compensation?
    Because not everyone is eligible, especially new entrants and re-entrants. But also voluntary quits, and those fired for misconduct, or those who hand' t worked at a job long enough.
    Therefore, since the world has still/Much good, but much less good than ill,
    And while the sun and moon endure/Luck's a chance, but trouble's sure,
    I'd face it as a wise man would,/And train for ill and not for good.

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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish[W:126]

    Isn't that the point? There shouldn't be any denial or disparagement of those civil rights in any at-will employment State since an employee is equally free to quit on an at-will basis without legal repercussion.

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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    That's what I'm saying though - a truly inalienable right could not actually be violated whatever happened.

    Perhaps the only one that comes close would be "freedom of thought" or something - until someone develops mind control or the like.
    Then there's no such thing as a truly inalienable right and people ought to stop pretending there are and get on with reality.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish

    I think humanity's history with discrimination of pretty much everyone makes it necessary for there to be laws which protect citizens of a state against it. While I have no problem with employees firing people who do not conform with malleable aesthetics. Those characteristics which can't be changed or would cause undue hardship on the individual if he/she was asked to change should be protected (this involves belief in X god, political affiliation etc).
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

  6. #526
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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish

    Quote Originally Posted by scatt View Post
    So maximizing profit is not the only concern?
    Are you unable to answer my question?
    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    Sorry but I said absolutely nothing about people in the discussion of property. That YOU interpreted property as being people says a lot, however. Again you totally missed the point. But oh well. I am beginning to see that as your stock in trade here and rather suspect you do it deliberately. I won't respond further if you insist on continuing to twist what I post to serve your own agenda. Again I wish you a good day.
    But you did. You said employers should be able to do whatever they wish with their "property and possessions". That's exactly what you said. I really don't see why you are acting indignant because of your own words.

    You want employers to control their employees like they are their possessions, free to hire and fire absent any regulation by the government. That's exactly what you said and it's exactly what you've been arguing.
    Quote Originally Posted by DA60 View Post
    And finally, what good does the law do here?
    Protects employees and their families.

    Would you want to work for a guy that wants you to sleep with him and expects you to do so for the pay you are receiving...even though you don't want to?

    I certainly wouldn't.
    It doesn't matter, you should never have to choose between your sexual dignity and providing for your family.

    If it sounds like I've said this before, it's because I have...multiple times.

    But you want a law that allows her to stay in that ridiculous job?
    I want a law which prevents the employee from ever being put in a situation where she has to choose.

    Besides, if he wants her gone, he will just makeup an excuse to fire her
    Circular argument. Remember the point of this thread and the position I'm arguing.

    It would be far better for her just to be fired because she would not sleep with him and use that as the official reason.
    Or she could not be fired at all and/or be able to sue her employer for being fired for refusing sex and get paid far more than she would have working there.

    It will tell other potential bosses 'hands off' and it will warn other candidates what the guy really wants.
    No it won't. Very few people know when they apply for a job why the job is available.

    Your entire logic is unrealistic.

  7. #527
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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish

    Quote Originally Posted by Slyfox696 View Post
    Are you unable to answer my question?

    But you did. You said employers should be able to do whatever they wish with their "property and possessions". That's exactly what you said. I really don't see why you are acting indignant because of your own words.

    You want employers to control their employees like they are their possessions, free to hire and fire absent any regulation by the government. That's exactly what you said and it's exactly what you've been arguing.
    Protects employees and their families.

    It doesn't matter, you should never have to choose between your sexual dignity and providing for your family.

    If it sounds like I've said this before, it's because I have...multiple times.

    I want a law which prevents the employee from ever being put in a situation where she has to choose.

    Circular argument. Remember the point of this thread and the position I'm arguing.

    Or she could not be fired at all and/or be able to sue her employer for being fired for refusing sex and get paid far more than she would have working there.

    No it won't. Very few people know when they apply for a job why the job is available.

    Your entire logic is unrealistic.
    Whatever pal, I didn't even bother to read your reply...I am tired of wasting time on you. You don't honestly debate, you just virtually ignore what people type if you don't like it and say the same thing over and over.

    People like you want a law that forces people to employ people they don't want, so that these employee's can do jobs they don't like...it's moronic....and it's wrong.

    Private companies are PRIVATE. The government has no business telling them who they can employ.

    You don't agree...guess how much I care?

    And yes, the question is rhetorical...because I don't even care much what your guess is.

    We are done on this.

    Good day.

  8. #528
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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish

    I believe labor should be able to apply for unemployment compensation just because they don't like a job and don't want to have to lie to an employer about it nor waste that employer's time and money just because labor may need money in our Institution of money based markets and form of Capitalism.

  9. #529
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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish

    Quote Originally Posted by Slyfox696 View Post
    Are you unable to answer my question?

    But you did. You said employers should be able to do whatever they wish with their "property and possessions". That's exactly what you said. I really don't see why you are acting indignant because of your own words.

    You want employers to control their employees like they are their possessions, free to hire and fire absent any regulation by the government. That's exactly what you said and it's exactly what you've been arguing.
    Protects employees and their families.
    Sorry but that is not what I have said nor what I have been arguing and it is entirely disingenuous to accuse me of that. I have been very clear that the employer has absolutely no right to anything the employee has, including his/her labor, other than what is agreed between the employer and employee. What part of 'agreed' do you not understand? How can I put the term 'agreement' into words small enough to understand that it implies voluntary consent?

    Nor does the employee have any right of any kind to what the employer has lawfully and ethically acquired other than what is agreed between the employer and employee.

    My argument is that both have unalienable rights that neither should be able to infringe. If there is liberty, then the employee can quit his/her job at any time that he/she wants. And the employer can fire an employee any time that he/she wants. Any other policy is involuntary servitude.
    "I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it." --Benjamin Franklin 1776

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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish[W:126]

    Quote Originally Posted by danielpalos View Post
    Why shouldn't employees be able to quit and collect unemployment compensation in any at-will employment State?
    An employee can quit and still be eligible for unemployment, but only in certain fact specific cases.

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