View Poll Results: should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason

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  • yes

    75 52.45%
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Thread: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish[W:126]

  1. #461
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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish[W:126]

    Quote Originally Posted by pinqy View Post
    No it doesn't. A reason is the WHY someone quites. Timing is WHEN.
    That is contradictory, period.

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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish[W:126]

    Quote Originally Posted by lawboy View Post
    Thankfully, that is not how the system works, so it would be fruitless for me to give examples, as you would disagree with them.

    I don't disagree with bonafide examples because they are what they are. I will reject non sequitur examples that do not relate to the principle being discussed. And if the system does not work in a way that recognizes the unalienable right of a person to use his/her legally and ethically acquired property and resources in his/her own interests, then none of us can say we own anything and there are no unalienable rights for anybody. None of us would have any rights other than what the government decided we would have on any given day.

    Personal agreements or what the codified/common LAW allows?
    What the law allows is immaterial to the principle I am citing. Obviously, if I have no legal standing, then I will not be successful in a lawsuit. But the law should not allow me to demand from an employer any more than what the employer and I agreed; nor should the employer be able to deny me what was agreed so long as I hold up my end of whatever bargain we make. But no employer with any sense is going to guarantee the new hire a lifetime job or income. Not unless he is a philanthropist who has decided to make somebody his heir.
    "I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it." --Benjamin Franklin 1776

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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish[W:126]

    Quote Originally Posted by lawboy View Post
    That is contradictory, period.
    How on earth is that contradictory? I quit my job last year to take a better position with higher salary. I think we can agree that that is not an objectionable reason. Now, let's say that there were two basic times I could have quit: Without warning during a work shift, causing harm to others, or giving advance notice so that my employer could make arrangements to cover my work.

    The reason for quitting would be the same, but the timing would be different. I'm at a loss how you could say it would be two different reasons depending on timing.
    Therefore, since the world has still/Much good, but much less good than ill,
    And while the sun and moon endure/Luck's a chance, but trouble's sure,
    I'd face it as a wise man would,/And train for ill and not for good.

  4. #464
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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish[W:126]

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    What the law allows is immaterial to the principle I am citing.
    What about employment references? Should you as an employee be subjected to blackballing? I am your former employer, every potential employer that calls me for a reference I say you stole 1,000.00 from me, when it is a lie! Is that okay? This has to do with law, not any agreement.
    Last edited by lawboy; 02-03-14 at 02:41 PM.

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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish[W:126]

    Quote Originally Posted by pinqy View Post
    How on earth is that contradictory? I quit my job last year to take a better position with higher salary. I think we can agree that that is not an objectionable reason. Now, let's say that there were two basic times I could have quit: Without warning during a work shift, causing harm to others, or giving advance notice so that my employer could make arrangements to cover my work.

    The reason for quitting would be the same, but the timing would be different. I'm at a loss how you could say it would be two different reasons depending on timing.
    Do you not understand what the word ANY means in legal terms?

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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish[W:126]

    Quote Originally Posted by lawboy View Post
    Do you not understand what the word ANY means in legal terms?
    Since it doesn't appear as a seperate entry in any legal dictionary, I would assume it means the same in ordinary language.

    Do you understand what the words "why" and "when" mean? they're not the synonyms you're claiming. The reason someone quits is why they quit..the thing that causes them to quit. When thy choose to actually quit is an entirely seperate matter.

    I note you dodged my question about different times making different reasons.
    Therefore, since the world has still/Much good, but much less good than ill,
    And while the sun and moon endure/Luck's a chance, but trouble's sure,
    I'd face it as a wise man would,/And train for ill and not for good.

  7. #467
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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish[W:126]

    Quote Originally Posted by pinqy View Post
    I note you dodged my question about different times making different reasons.
    I did not dodge any such thing, again, you do NOT understand the legal points here, how a layman interprets a Clause/word may be, and is different here, to your understanding.

    edit; Pay a visit to a law library where they have your state jurisprudence volumes, find the EMPLOYMENT volumes, read and learn.

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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish[W:126]

    Quote Originally Posted by lawboy View Post
    What about employment references? Should you as an employee be subjected to blackballing? I am your former employer, every potential employer that calls me for a reference I say you stole 1,000.00 from me, when it is a lie! Is that okay? This has to do with law, not any agreement.
    There are reasonable laws against libel and slander. If your employer accuses you of stealing in a way that damages you in any material way, and you didn't steal, you do have legal recourse against that employer. If you did steal, certainly the law should allow references to include information to the new employer that you are a thief.

    But this anecdotal side issue still has nothing whatsoever to do with what should be an employee's right to quit a job he does not want to do any more, or what should be the employer's right to fire an employee he does not want or need anymore.
    "I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it." --Benjamin Franklin 1776

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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish[W:126]

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    There are reasonable laws against libel and slander. If your employer accuses you of stealing in a way that damages you in any material way, and you didn't steal, you do have legal recourse against that employer. If you did steal, certainly the law should allow references to include information to the new employer that you are a thief.
    Just seeing where you stand, so you agree with that law, but not other employment laws!

    You said you were fired before, for what?

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    Re: Should employers have the freedom to hire/fire for any reason they wish[W:126]

    Quote Originally Posted by Kreton View Post
    Title kind of sums it up.
    I vote 'no' because there should be some minimal restrictions against discrimination.

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