View Poll Results: Can a man be criminally/legally charged with raping his wife?

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  • Yes. Absolutely.

    60 68.18%
  • No. Definitely not.

    5 5.68%
  • Case-by-case basis. Not that black & white.

    21 23.86%
  • Other- please explain

    2 2.27%
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Thread: Spousal Rape - Crime of Rape, or Not ?????

  1. #91
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    Re: Spousal Rape - Crime of Rape, or Not ?????

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    I didn't ask for reasons for divorce. There are many... I asked where in the marriage contract does it state that you have to have sex with your spouse. That is the first step. If you can't show that then you can't make any valid claim that raping your spouse is not illegal.

    ...and your link doesn't even talk about withholding affection. It talks about "No Fault Divorce" meaning that you don't even need a reason to get a divorce anymore.
    I understand the question, you failed to understand the answer. There is no marriage contract you sign, what you sign is a license. One of the obligations of that license are that you comply with state law on the matter of marriage. While all states now allow No Fault divorces many do still have At Fault divorces to address when a spouse violates the terms set in law of said license.

    Further you show you don't read very well (from the link):

    Assigning Blame
    Sometimes, a spouse will choose to pursue a "fault" divorce to expose egregious conduct or to influence child custody or support issues. Traditional fault grounds for divorce include abandonment -- and withholding affection can be argued to constitute abandonment. It might be wise, however, to obtain legal advice before filing a divorce on these charges.

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    Re: Spousal Rape - Crime of Rape, or Not ?????

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    And how does that imply that sex is mandatory and that if sex is not given consensually it can be taken by force, exactly?
    No one said it could be taken by force. We said it was an obligation to give freely, and if not given freely, that's grounds for divorce.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    It doesn't need to any more than it doesn't say anywhere in the marriage contract did it say you weren't allowed to murder your wife.

    Now, why is that Jerry?
    I actually pulled out my old marriage certificate, and it doesn't actually list any applicable laws at all. It lists our vital information and a statement that we're married. Does your marriage certificate actually list all applicable laws? What happens when a law is changed, do you have to get a new updated certificate?

    Pulling out my driver's license (a civil contract with the state to drive) and it doesn't list applicable laws, either. Does your drivers license list all applicable laws?

    Hey what about my Concealed Carry Permits from a few states......nope, those don't list applicable laws either. Does your weapons license list applicable laws?

  3. #93
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    Re: Spousal Rape - Crime of Rape, or Not ?????

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    I understand the question, you failed to understand the answer. There is no marriage contract you sign, what you sign is a license. One of the obligations of that license are that you comply with state law on the matter of marriage. While all states now allow No Fault divorces many do still have At Fault divorces to address when a spouse violates the terms set in law of said license.

    Further you show you don't read very well (from the link):
    You are dancing... rape is illegal. Show where being in a marriage allows rape to be legal.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have pooped in public, even in public neighborhoods.
    Quote Originally Posted by OldFatGuy View Post
    Usually a gag for wise mouthed insulting little girls. Then some good nylon rope so I can tie them up, toss them in the trunk of my car and forget about them.

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    Re: Spousal Rape - Crime of Rape, or Not ?????

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    No one said it could be taken by force. We said it was an obligation to give freely, and if not given freely, that's grounds for divorce.
    I have no problem with that...
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have pooped in public, even in public neighborhoods.
    Quote Originally Posted by OldFatGuy View Post
    Usually a gag for wise mouthed insulting little girls. Then some good nylon rope so I can tie them up, toss them in the trunk of my car and forget about them.

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    Re: Spousal Rape - Crime of Rape, or Not ?????

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    I have no problem with that...
    You seem to think that a contract has to list all applicable laws in order for those laws to apply. If you look at either the license or the application, one or both will just have a statement of understanding that it's your responsibility to know and comply with the law, and that you agree to do so as a condition of the license.

    So when you ask something stupid like "where in the contract does it say X"...well the contract itself probably doesn't say "X". It's understood that the contract complies with the law and it's up to you to know the law and know if "X" is allowed or not.

  6. #96
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    Re: Spousal Rape - Crime of Rape, or Not ?????

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    No one said it could be taken by force. We said it was an obligation to give freely, and if not given freely, that's grounds for divorce.
    Obligated to give freely?
    How in the hell is something given freely if it's an obligation?

    A couple sets up their expectations for a marriage before they marry (or they should) - a violation of their 'marital vows' or what have you is established when they marry and set forward their own expectations, needs, and wants.

    It's different for everyone.

    We've discussed this before.
    A screaming comes across the sky.
    It has happened before, but there is nothing to compare it to now.
    Pynchon - Gravity's Rainbow

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    Re: Spousal Rape - Crime of Rape, or Not ?????

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    You seem to think that a contract has to list all applicable laws in order for those laws to apply. If you look at either the license or the application, one or both will just have a statement of understanding that it's your responsibility to know and comply with the law, and that you agree to do so as a condition of the license.

    So when you ask something stupid like "where in the contract does it say X"...well the contract itself probably doesn't say anything. It's understood that the contract complies with the law and it's up to you to know the law.
    I was asking for a different reason... thus making the question decidedly, "not stupid". As to the rest? I agreed with you. Talk about stupid.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have pooped in public, even in public neighborhoods.
    Quote Originally Posted by OldFatGuy View Post
    Usually a gag for wise mouthed insulting little girls. Then some good nylon rope so I can tie them up, toss them in the trunk of my car and forget about them.

  8. #98
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    Re: Spousal Rape - Crime of Rape, or Not ?????

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    You are dancing... rape is illegal. Show where being in a marriage allows rape to be legal.
    Once again there is a legal obligation to have sex with your spouse. The license can be withdrawn if you don't and you would be at fault. It's part of deal, don't like it, don't get married. Now, does this mean you can't rape your spouse? That's still a debatable legal point and in effect the law is all over the map and unevenly applied because it's a rock and/or hard place question.

    However, assault is clearly illegal and carries the same potential for penalty without the rape question even being necessary.

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    Re: Spousal Rape - Crime of Rape, or Not ?????

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    Obligated to give freely?
    How in the hell is something given freely if it's an obligation?
    At-will marriage, similar to at-will employment. While doing the job, you have duties and obligations, but you can quit any time you like. If you don't want to have sex with your spouse, then imo you should leave the marriage.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    A couple sets up their expectations for a marriage before they marry (or they should) - a violation of their 'marital vows' or what have you is established when they marry and set forward their own expectations, needs, and wants.

    It's different for everyone.
    These laws are for when the couple does not agree. Remember we're talking about spousal rape, meaning one party wants sex and the other party does not. If you marry under the auspice that you would give yourselves to each-other, and then one person changes their mind, the law allows this to be grounds to terminate the marriage.
    Last edited by Jerry; 01-17-14 at 08:11 PM.

  10. #100
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    Re: Spousal Rape - Crime of Rape, or Not ?????

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    What marraige contract did you sign because mine says nothing about having sex... period. Care to provide a link?
    The only people I know who have a signed marriage contract is my wife and I. It is long and sex is one of the topics. There are people who sign pre-marriage contracts called "pre-nuptial agreements" generally only concerning economic matters.

    We did our own marriage vows, which were unusual. Mine was all but exclusively about sex and her's much longer on the topic. Some jaws probably fell at the church. However, I could be argued that the stated contract of "to have and to hold" for as long as we both shall live" or "forevermore" could constitute consent. With saying "no" then break that marriage contract?

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