View Poll Results: What is your view on climate change?

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  • It occurs naturally regardless of how severe or minute those changes are.

    20 31.75%
  • It occurs naturally with small and severe changes, some of it is anthropogenic.

    28 44.44%
  • It occurs naturally with small changes,but severe changes are anthropogenic.

    8 12.70%
  • It does not occur naturally, any changes we have now are anthropogenic.

    3 4.76%
  • Climate change does not occur.There is no global warming or cooling.

    0 0%
  • I do not know/other.

    4 6.35%
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Thread: What is your view on climate change?

  1. #71
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    Re: What is your view on climate change?

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveFagan View Post
    The atmosphere of the planet Earth is only 4 miles or less high, for the purposes of human and other organisms. Calculate what the volume and weight of that atmosphere and then consider if 6 or 7 billion polluters on the planet could generate a cause and effect relationship on that atmosphere. There really isn't too much atmosphere to work with. In a fantasy world, we could pretend that we aren't polluting or you can look at the smoker next to you or hold your hand over the end of the tailpipe of a running auto or truck if you want a reality check. Then there is water. Maybe a trip to the huge Ocean "dead zones" could cause a synaptic trigger to initiate a thought that perhaps, collectively, we are rapidly screwing up this planet. I know we personally will be dead before the effects are dramatic, and that would just emphasize our collective lack of responsibility. Like it or lump it, we need to adjust our lifestyles to nearly Amish sensibilities. We must establish a natural relationship with the Planet.


    It must be so, therefore we must live the Amish? Live like that Amish? HELL NO!

    The lower atmosphere is a volume of over 800,000,000 cubic MILES of air. A cubic mile of air is a lot of air.

  2. #72
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    Re: What is your view on climate change?

    I heard that temperatures have dropped severely up to -50C causing 20 thousand life losses in USA! If it is anthropogenic I think you ought to quite emitting green house gasses for climate is targeting you more than us. To the contrary we are having easier times here. Never seen winters this warm before!
    Quote Originally Posted by poweRob View Post
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    Re: What is your view on climate change?

    On problem I think I see (from many people, whatever they believe about the climate change bit) is this idea that it will cause noticeable changes in temperature as opposed to previous years.

    As I understand the idea, it's a much more gradual thing, possibly to such a degree (heh) that it would take a decade or more (even a century?) to change average temperatures noticeably (using "I feel warmer/colder" as a gauge here, not any scientific instrument). Personally, I think a lot (or all?) of the weather people blame on "climate change" these days is actually just natural fluctuations (perhaps with an added pinch of anthro?).
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  4. #74
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    Re: What is your view on climate change?

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post


    It must be so, therefore we must live the Amish? Live like that Amish? HELL NO!

    The lower atmosphere is a volume of over 800,000,000 cubic MILES of air. A cubic mile of air is a lot of air.
    I don't see you suggesting any alternatives. If denial fits you like a glove, wear it proudly. OTOH, some people acknowledge a problem, study the problem and either piss and moan about it, or offer a solution. By the way, how many cubic miles of air do 7 billion humans and many more non-humans breathe annually?

  5. #75
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    Re: What is your view on climate change?

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    Those issues should be pursued on their own merits instead of slapping on the man made global warming issue to it. For example stopping water pollution should be pursued because polluted water is harmful to humans and lifeforms.Slapping the al gore oh my god the world is going to warm is just going to turn people away and make it seem its more about global warming than fighting water pollution.
    I've been struggling to come up with a response and all I can think of is what difference does it make? Even if Reagan was dead wrong, although I think he made an excellent point, the net effect of refusing to take any steps toward freeing ourselves of Middle Eastern economic enslavement, geo-political entanglement and our own complicity in efforts to destroy our country by people who hate us so much they're willing to die if they get to kill Americans in the process as all the horrific things advance along because its more important to some that Al Gore and the greenie community be resisted at all costs.

    I don't support Cap and Trade or holding America to international standards on co2 emissions from which China is exempted. At the same time I support electric cars, wind and solar electric with the understanding Morse Law and the Silicon Valley Business Model apply that says once on the market, these new innovations will experience rapid technological improvements and deep cost reductions just like digital cameras, cell phones, HDTVs and PCs did. However, as long as we wait around for it to "catch up" while not on the market, it will never develop.

    The urgency of self-defensive measures in our post 9/11 wake up call in my opinion trumps the luxury of domestic bickering between ideological camps and also in my humble opinion gives the American and freedom loving people everywhere the imperative to work together at least on the things with which we can agree, despite our differing motives. Remember, people want us dead and we're paying them to finance that objective.

    One thing that I find disheartening in contemporary politics is the idea that if some group isn't fully in our ideological camp, the goal isn't to find common ground and at least advance the issues we can come to agreement on but rather our political opposition is "the enemy" (a designation I'd prefer to see reserved for people like Al Qaeda) and any and everything the opposition supports we must utterly oppose including the things we are okay with unless its repackaged as an "our side" agenda item. I don't think Reagan or Clinton had that mentality. A house divided against....
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  6. #76
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    Re: What is your view on climate change?

    Generally, scientific issues are hashed out in scientific journals. And its pretty clear that the overwhelming consensus among scientists is that global warming caused by CO2 is real. If this wasnt the case, we'd see more controversy about it in the scientific literature.

    What is your view on climate change?-powell-science-pie-chart-jpg

    Oh. And James Lawrence Powell expanded on that recently to cover the literature from the last year or two. Same thing.

    What is your view on climate change?-powell-pie-chart-2-jpg
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  7. #77
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    Re: What is your view on climate change?

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    The lower atmosphere is a volume of over 800,000,000 cubic MILES of air. A cubic mile of air is a lot of air.
    A good way to understand how much C02 we are putting into the atmosphere is for every one pound of garbage we make, 40 pounds of CO2 is produced.

    Most of us fill up a trash can once a week. If we had to dispose of our CO2 the same way, that would be almost 6 garbage trucks coming by every day, seven days a week.

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    Re: What is your view on climate change?

    Quote Originally Posted by Threegoofs View Post
    Generally, scientific issues are hashed out in scientific journals. And its pretty clear that the overwhelming consensus among scientists is that global warming caused by CO2 is real. If this wasnt the case, we'd see more controversy about it in the scientific literature.

    What is your view on climate change?-powell-science-pie-chart-jpg

    Oh. And James Lawrence Powell expanded on that recently to cover the literature from the last year or two. Same thing.

    What is your view on climate change?-powell-pie-chart-2-jpg
    Obviously it must mean there's a massive conspiracy to promote the cause of anthropogenic climate change.....





































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    Sometimes I think we're alone. Sometimes I think we're not. In either case, the thought is staggering. ~ R. Buckminster Fuller

  9. #79
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    Re: What is your view on climate change?

    Quote Originally Posted by Threegoofs View Post
    Generally, scientific issues are hashed out in scientific journals. And its pretty clear that the overwhelming consensus among scientists is that global warming caused by CO2 is real. If this wasnt the case, we'd see more controversy about it in the scientific literature.

    What is your view on climate change?-powell-science-pie-chart-jpg

    Oh. And James Lawrence Powell expanded on that recently to cover the literature from the last year or two. Same thing.

    What is your view on climate change?-powell-pie-chart-2-jpg
    Well there it is, we're either cooling, warming, or changing. Consensus!
    Who chimes "No Absolutes!" chimes absolutely.

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  10. #80
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    Re: What is your view on climate change?

    my field is molecular / microbiology, not climatology, but i've read a bit on it. my opinion is that some of it is natural, and some is caused by humans. we are burning a ton of fossil fuels, and the byproducts trap heat.

    a lot of the CO2 is going to get absorbed into the ocean, masking some of the effect. for example, at work, we use tissue culture media that turns purplish when basic and more orange as it gets acidic. it has a natural tendency to turn basic as the bottle gets more empty and the media absorbs air, and sensitive cells need it closer to pH 7. to get the media back to pH7, we generally loosen the lid of the bottle and put it in an incubator with CO2. in an hour or so, the media absorbs the CO2 and is closer to pH7 again. the ocean will do the same thing, and this would be extraordinarily bad for sea life.

    it's also my opinion that a lot of the wacky weather everywhere is tied to the ocean warming and the normal currents getting screwed up.

    independent of the warming debate, we can and should cut out the use of fossil fuels. surely we can come up with something else; fossil fuel technology is hundreds of years old. the byproducts are dirty, and we're really pissing in our own pool here. once the third world starts driving buicks, it's going to be CO2 overload. not to mention that our kids will be fighting wars over diminishing resources. i don't want that. i love my car and motorcycle, but this is the most obvious narrative in the history of everything, and it has been intuitively obvious since the 70s that this energy model is not sustainable.

    will cutting out CO2 emissions from fossil fuels result in a nice happy and stable environment forever and ever? certainly not. will it fix or prevent warming in the short to mid term? i guess that also remains to be seen, but i doubt it will have as much effect as some say that it will. it will prevent a lot of pollution and a couple wars, though, and that's good enough for me.

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