View Poll Results: Do you agree with ban on smoking inside cars with children?

Voters
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  • Yes - I like this ban

    36 38.71%
  • Yes - I like it, but age should be older than 8

    21 22.58%
  • No - I should be able to smoke wherever I want

    21 22.58%
  • other - please explain

    15 16.13%
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Thread: Smoking Illegal With Children In Car[W:501]

  1. #551
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    Re: Smoking Illegal With Children In Car[W:501]

    Quote Originally Posted by Alyssa View Post
    Happens all the time. One need only to be reported. No proof is needed, only speculation and conjecture. The state moves in and "investigates" often removing the child from the home in the process.
    Only that's not true at all. Look at all the steps needed in a liberal state like Michigan...

    Children's Protective Services Investigation Process
    Investigation

    CPS has 30 days to complete an investigation unless extenuating circumstances require an extension. A CPS investigation must begin within 24 hours and usually includes:

    Face-to-face interviews with the alleged child victim(s), the child's caretaker(s), the alleged perpetrator(s).
    Viewing the family's home.
    Reviewing any necessary documents, such as police reports, criminal history, medical reports, school reports, CPS case file, etc.
    Interviewing neighbors, friends, relatives or professionals that have had contact with the family.
    An assessment of the child's safety.
    An assessment of the child's future risk of abuse and/or neglect.
    An assessment of the family's needs and strengths.


    CPS investigator considers the following factors during the investigation:

    Are there alternative explanations to the allegations?
    What are the family dynamics and family circumstances?
    Who is making the complaint?
    Is there corroborating evidence? (For example, witness statements, findings during a home visit, etc.)
    Should there be a medical exam of the child?
    Does the child have an injury? If so:
    What is the explanation of the injury?
    Is that explanation feasible?
    Where is the injury located?
    Is there more than one injury at different stages of healing?
    What is the condition of the home? (For example, cleanliness, safety hazards, etc.)
    What is the condition of the child? (For example, appropriately dressed, cleanliness, etc.)
    Are the child's basic needs being met?
    Is there adequate supervision?
    Are the caretakers emotionally/mentally abusing the child?

    Disposition of the CPS Investigation

    Based on the review of the above factors, CPS must determine if there is a preponderance of evidence of child abuse or neglect. Preponderance of evidence means evidence which is of greater weight or more convincing than evidence which is offered in opposition to it; a 51% likelihood that abuse or neglect occurred.

    Following a completed investigation, CPS will put a case in one of the following categories:

    Category V-Cases in which CPS is unable to locate the family, no evidence of child abuse or neglect is found or the court declines to issue an order requiring family cooperation during the investigation.
    Category IV-Cases in which a preponderance of evidence of child abuse or neglect is not found. The department must assist the child's family in voluntarily participating in community-based services commensurate with risk level determined by the risk assessment (structured decision making tool).
    Category III-Cases in which the department determines that there is a preponderance of evidence of child abuse or neglect and the risk assessment indicates a low or moderate risk. A referral to community-based services must be made by CPS.
    Category II-Cases in which the department determines that there is a preponderance of evidence of child abuse or neglect and the risk assessment indicates a high or intensive risk. Services must be provided by CPS, in conjunction with community-based services.
    Category I-Cases in which the department determines that there is a preponderance of evidence of child abuse or neglect and a court petition is needed and/or required. Services must be provided by CPS (or foster care), in conjunction with community-based services.


    When a case is placed in Category II or I, the perpetrator's name is listed on the Child Abuse and Neglect Central Registry. See the Central Registry page for more information regarding central registry.

    Court Petitions

    If necessary to ensure a child's safety, CPS may file a petition with the court requesting that the court order any of the following:

    The family to cooperate with in-home services.
    Removal of the perpetrator from the home.
    Removal of the child from the home.

    CPS cannot remove a child from the home without a court order. The court may deny the petition, including the request for removal.
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  2. #552
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    Re: Smoking Illegal With Children In Car[W:501]

    Quote Originally Posted by Juanita View Post
    We are not talking monkeys here....Do I believe "all" of the hype about smoking? No, I do not...Do I think that smoking is good for you? Of course not.. Why can't you answer my question?
    Why did you put "all" in air quotes?

    Which of the health risks mentioned by the CDC do you qualify as hype?

    CDC - Overviews of Diseases/Conditions - Campaign Resources - Tips from Former Smokers - Smoking & Tobacco Use

    Or how about the Mayo Clinic?

    Secondhand smoke: Avoid dangers in the air - Mayo Clinic

  3. #553
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    Re: Smoking Illegal With Children In Car[W:501]

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    Why did you put "all" in air quotes?

    Which of the health risks mentioned by the CDC do you qualify as hype?

    CDC - Overviews of Diseases/Conditions - Campaign Resources - Tips from Former Smokers - Smoking & Tobacco Use

    Or how about the Mayo Clinic?

    Secondhand smoke: Avoid dangers in the air - Mayo Clinic
    There is a difference between second hand smoke in an inclosed with limited air circulation (no one is arguing against this BTW) and smoking while driving with a cracked window, which delivers significant air circulation, and air evacuation out the window actually.

    You just seem to continue to want to gloss over that difference.

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    Re: Smoking Illegal With Children In Car[W:501]

    Quote Originally Posted by eohrnberger View Post
    There is a difference between second hand smoke in an inclosed with limited air circulation (no one is arguing against this BTW) and smoking while driving with a cracked window, which delivers significant air circulation, and air evacuation out the window actually.

    You just seem to continue to want to gloss over that difference.
    That dead horse has been whipped, beaten, sexually violated and had its mother insulted.

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    Re: Smoking Illegal With Children In Car[W:501]

    Quote Originally Posted by eohrnberger View Post
    My thinking exactly.

    Just how much government intervention and interdiction in our lives are we suppose to tolerate? Gotta draw a line someplace that the government can't cross.

    Meanwhile, in California, I think it's illegal to smoke in your own backyard. So much for your house being your castle.
    Who cares about the law...what about your children's health?

  6. #556
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    Re: Smoking Illegal With Children In Car[W:501]

    Quote Originally Posted by eohrnberger View Post
    There is a difference between second hand smoke in an inclosed with limited air circulation (no one is arguing against this BTW) and smoking while driving with a cracked window, which delivers significant air circulation, and air evacuation out the window actually.

    You just seem to continue to want to gloss over that difference.
    Cars are not in constant motion. Stop lights. Stop signs. Traffic. There's not a constant strong vacuum out a cracked window.

    Again - take some windex and a white paper towel and go clean the back windows of a smokers car.

    It's all right there in it's gross brownish-yellow glory.

    An adult smoking in a car is effectively MAKING a child smoke too.

    It's really THAT simple.

    Would you walk into your child's bedroom while they're sleeping, close the door, and light up a cigarette?
    Is that reasonable behavior for an adult?

  7. #557
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    Re: Smoking Illegal With Children In Car[W:501]

    I've finally come up with a work around that should please everyone.

    We all know that smoke rises, so have the children lie down on the floor of the backseat with their breathing holes close to the floor. The Cops are happy because they can't see the children in your car while you are smoking. The smokers get to smoke, and the children get to breathe the cleanest air in the car.

    Another good idea would be to dress appropriately for the climate and roll all of the windows completely down whenever children are in the car.

    Those of you with roof luggage racks could put the children up there in a comfortable custom made box. Others could simply put the kids in the trunk.

    There's quite a few ways to accomplish the child clean air act without legislation.

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    Re: Smoking Illegal With Children In Car[W:501]

    Quote Originally Posted by Dragonfly View Post
    Would you walk into your child's bedroom while they're sleeping, close the door, and light up a cigarette?
    Is that reasonable behavior for an adult?
    As long at they open a window first, I bet some will reason.
    I call my own shots, largely based on an accumulation of data, and everyone knows it.
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  9. #559
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    Re: Smoking Illegal With Children In Car[W:501]

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Only that's not true at all. Look at all the steps needed in a liberal state like Michigan...
    Those are the legal steps.

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    Re: Smoking Illegal With Children In Car[W:501]

    Quote Originally Posted by d0gbreath View Post
    I've finally come up with a work around that should please everyone.

    We all know that smoke rises, so have the children lie down on the floor of the backseat with their breathing holes close to the floor. The Cops are happy because they can't see the children in your car while you are smoking. The smokers get to smoke, and the children get to breathe the cleanest air in the car.

    Another good idea would be to dress appropriately for the climate and roll all of the windows completely down whenever children are in the car.

    Those of you with roof luggage racks could put the children up there in a comfortable custom made box. Others could simply put the kids in the trunk.

    There's quite a few ways to accomplish the child clean air act without legislation.
    How about a limo? The adults can roll up the glass partition and smoke away and the kids can travel in style.
    I call my own shots, largely based on an accumulation of data, and everyone knows it.
    _____________________________________________

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