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There are 36 countries with better healthcare than the USA. What needs to happen?

What needs to change in US healthcare?

  • Complete overhaul, replacing old system with European-style universal healthcare.

    Votes: 25 65.8%
  • Partial overhaul, including expansion of Medicare, reworking of profit-based insurance system.

    Votes: 7 18.4%
  • Sparse overhaul, based around getting rid of the profit-based private insurance companies.

    Votes: 4 10.5%
  • Nothing needs to change, the US system is good the way it is.

    Votes: 2 5.3%

  • Total voters
    38
i voted option one, but would compromise with option two, assuming that Medicare would cover anyone who wants it and accepting it as payment isn't optional for normal care and medicine. i'm more supportive of something like the Canadian system.
 
Actually.....

The U.N. is America. All these glorious western European utopias couldn't fund it if they had to. Useless, economically dependent countries. If Germany pulled out, the bread lines would look like highways in the rest of Europe.

I think we should pull out personally. This one government agenda is ridiculous, continually failing, accomplishing nothing aside from draining pockets of American tax payers so European leaders can feel like they still have an impact. Feel good B.S. U.N. is useless, as is NATO.

France and Britain are still in the top 10 economies in the world, as is Germany. They have two of the best militaries in the world -- most analysts put France as the third most powerful military IN THE WORLD, after the US and Russia.

The EU is the world's largest economy, the centre of Western political and philosophical thought, and the single largest: Aid donor, developer, international arbiter, economic power, and normative/social power.

The French and British invade, even in the last 50 years, more countries on average than the US, and indeed they have a better success rate in those countries. France has just recently deployed to Chad, the Central African Republic and Mali, while also maintaining a force in Afghanistan for the duration of that war, as well as troops in the Horn of Africa, Djibouti, Cote d'Ivoire, and Guyana amongst others. The allied intervention in Libya in 2011 was mainly based off of the French aircraft carrier Charles de Gaulle, which is, by the way, the only nuclear-powered aircraft carrier in the world operated by a country other than the US.

The countries of the EU, as well, fund a much larger portion of the UN than America does:

United Nations - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

All told, America funds 22% of the UN, while the EU funds more than 30% of the UN.

So, in other words, pull your colonial head out of your ass -- the facts do not agree with you.
 
There have never been more than a few real liberals in Congress and the Senate at one time, people like Tom Hayden, Barbara Lee, Bernie Sanders, Barny Frank and Ted Kennedy. The ACA was compromised to gain support from all the centrist Democrats and with the hope of getting some Republican support. ACA was supported by liberals as an improvement over doing nothing, but they have never been enthusiastic about. It was hoped it will lead to something better.

I have no problem with the continued existence of private health care systems as long as they don't threaten a public system. The two coexist in many European countries.

You have brown eyes, don't you?
 
It's no secret that the US healthcare system is a disaster, and of all developed nations, the US has some of the worst healthcare and overall health.

This Business Insider article mentions the 36 countries that have better healthcare than the US, from France in #1 to Costa Rica in #36.

My poll today is: What needs to change to bring the US closer to other developed nations in terms of healthcare quality, service and costs?

The 36 Best Healthcare Systems In The World - Business Insider

Not being in a giant culture war would help.
 
There have never been more than a few real liberals in Congress and the Senate at one time, people like Tom Hayden, Barbara Lee, Bernie Sanders, Barny Frank and Ted Kennedy. The ACA was compromised to gain support from all the centrist Democrats and with the hope of getting some Republican support. ACA was supported by liberals as an improvement over doing nothing, but they have never been enthusiastic about. It was hoped it will lead to something better.

I have no problem with the continued existence of private health care systems as long as they don't threaten a public system. The two coexist in many European countries.

Whether their commiecrats that call themselves liberal, socialist, progressive or any other than, they are still the greatest destructive force in the country.

As far as what works in Europe, most of our ancestors came here to get away from crap in Europe, not copy it.
 
Whether their commiecrats that call themselves liberal, socialist, progressive or any other than, they are still the greatest destructive force in the country.

As far as what works in Europe, most of our ancestors came here to get away from crap in Europe, not copy it.

Weird when I went to Europe it wasn't war ravaged anymore, the Berlin Wall was down, and overall they seem to have a pretty good quality of life equal to or greater than America; especially those dang Scandinavian countries. Basically all of America's fundamentals ideas and concepts came from Europe aswell.
 
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Weird when I went to Europe it wasn't war ravaged anymore, the Berlin Wall was down, and overall they seem to have a pretty good quality of life equal to or greater than America; especially those dang Scandinavian countries. Basically all of America's fundamentals ideas and concepts came from Europe aswell.

And how much of the **** they have is reliant upon us, that being the US. They have a low enough population that their oil sales cover their expenses. Take a look a Mexico and Venezuela, both get their money the same way but due to much greater populations, they suck.

So don't be feeding us a line about how well reliant socialism works there when your trying to kill off the ones they are reliant upon and their system has proven to be futile and down right idiotic for larger populations.

Also, if you and others like that **** so well, guess what, there are boats and airplanes headed that way everyday, don't let the door hit you on the ass on your way out and don't expect us to miss you. If you think it is so good the, fine move instead of trying to **** **** up for the rest of us.
 
Weird when I went to Europe it wasn't war ravaged anymore, the Berlin Wall was down, and overall they seem to have a pretty good quality of life equal to or greater than America; especially those dang Scandinavian countries.

Despite the impression one might get from the 'patriotic' Americans on this, and other, boards, that is the sort of thing all my RL American friends say. But then they, like yourself, are perceptive, educated, and well travelled people, who forget to pack their "Go USA!" blinkers. :D
 
There are certainly problems with the American system. It is too expensive, for instance. But it is not so straightforward what "better" means.
When you sight the European countries, I know some of the systems quite well. If I consider the German, the only thing that is better is that it takes less of GDP. But most of the better doctors or dentists are American trained. If you don't have private insurance you get less good treatment . The quality ofpublic coverage has come down and is deteriorating. The frequency of hospital infection of MFSR is so high that you are refused admittance in Dutch hospitals coming from a German hospital etc.

Also don't forget that most medicine is developed for the American market and the quality of treatment in other countries is thus only possible because of the state of US health care
.

The last paragraph above is a huge unintended consequence of Obamacare. Much of the worlds improvement in life span, cure of diseases, and overall health is due to research by companies for the American market. Simply, the first pill costs millions, the second a few cents. Without a profit incentive, who will find the next polio cure?
 
And how much of the **** they have is reliant upon us, that being the US. They have a low enough population that their oil sales cover their expenses. Take a look a Mexico and Venezuela, both get their money the same way but due to much greater populations, they suck.

So don't be feeding us a line about how well reliant socialism works there when your trying to kill off the ones they are reliant upon and their system has proven to be futile and down right idiotic for larger populations.

Also, if you and others like that **** so well, guess what, there are boats and airplanes headed that way everyday, don't let the door hit you on the ass on your way out and don't expect us to miss you. If you think it is so good the, fine move instead of trying to **** **** up for the rest of us.

I'm quite happy sitting above your country with my socialized medicine. There are also larger countries with socialized medicine, Japan being the main example.
 
I'm quite happy sitting above your country with my socialized medicine. There are also larger countries with socialized medicine, Japan being the main example.

And how much would you have without us?

Look, your in a low population, marginally influential country that is not the leader of much of anything. The US is the most innovative, influential country in the world. We are only a little over 300 million, but we are overwhelmingly the major source of innovation and all the rest of the around 7 billion people in the world are reliant upon us. We pay for the drugs people get, we pay for the technology, we create the procedures and we are the ones that in the end, pay for and provide so the rest can have it.

Face it, economically, politically, socially and medically, Canada and all the Scandinavian countries could fall of the face of the earth tomorrow and very little if anything in the world, other than the ocean levels, would change and the percentage of the world that would care is measured to the right of the decimal point of 1% with a lot of leading zeros.

When you become top dog, then you tell us something, until then, we are the top dog and you are just a fringe hanger on to the pack.
 
Basically all of America's fundamentals ideas and concepts came from Europe aswell.

Free speech and guns (which are not widely accepted over there anymore)?
 
And how much would you have without us?

Look, your in a low population, marginally influential country that is not the leader of much of anything. The US is the most innovative, influential country in the world. We are only a little over 300 million, but we are overwhelmingly the major source of innovation and all the rest of the around 7 billion people in the world are reliant upon us. We pay for the drugs people get, we pay for the technology, we create the procedures and we are the ones that in the end, pay for and provide so the rest can have it.

Face it, economically, politically, socially and medically, Canada and all the Scandinavian countries could fall of the face of the earth tomorrow and very little if anything in the world, other than the ocean levels, would change and the percentage of the world that would care is measured to the right of the decimal point of 1% with a lot of leading zeros.

When you become top dog, then you tell us something, until then, we are the top dog and you are just a fringe hanger on to the pack.

None of that would change with single payer. If Canada dropped off the face of the Earth the U.S. would plunge into economic catastrophe as you would lose most of your oil. Canada and the Scandinavian countries are doing far better economically, our governments actually function and we have faith in them, socially we are also much better off as Canada is a multicultural success story and has simply a better quality of life and social services.
 
Free speech and guns (which are not widely accepted over there anymore)?

Ever been to Switzerland? Free speech exists in Europe aswell but they also recognize reasonable limits like Canada, if you do not have limits it leads to abuse. People can hunt if they want in Europe and thus own guns.
 
France and Britain are still in the top 10 economies in the world, as is Germany. They have two of the best militaries in the world -- most analysts put France as the third most powerful military IN THE WORLD, after the US and Russia.

The EU is the world's largest economy, the centre of Western political and philosophical thought, and the single largest: Aid donor, developer, international arbiter, economic power, and normative/social power.

The French and British invade, even in the last 50 years, more countries on average than the US, and indeed they have a better success rate in those countries. France has just recently deployed to Chad, the Central African Republic and Mali, while also maintaining a force in Afghanistan for the duration of that war, as well as troops in the Horn of Africa, Djibouti, Cote d'Ivoire, and Guyana amongst others. The allied intervention in Libya in 2011 was mainly based off of the French aircraft carrier Charles de Gaulle, which is, by the way, the only nuclear-powered aircraft carrier in the world operated by a country other than the US.

The countries of the EU, as well, fund a much larger portion of the UN than America does:

United Nations - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

All told, America funds 22% of the UN, while the EU funds more than 30% of the UN.

So, in other words, pull your colonial head out of your ass -- the facts do not agree with you.

Militaryies? What do you know about militaries. The US is more than capable of defeating conventionally the entire combined military forces of the rest of the world if the British and British Commonwealth states stay neutral. Britain (commonwealth countries included here), Israel and possibly japan are the only two countries that even come close to developing the quality of US equipment and troops. Can we exert control over all those populations, no, could we defeat them in a stand up fight, no problem at all, just might take a bit of time.

EU is not the most political or economically influential. If given a choice between the EU and the US in a trade war, there would be very few who followed the EU. And military force = Political influence when all is said and done.

BTW, in Afghanistan, it was the French, who retreated in the face of odds faced regularly by US and the British forces that allowed the insurgents to get such a strong foot hold in Afghanistan today. The only problem defeating French troops is where to put and how to feed all the surrender monkies.
 
Militaryies? What do you know about militaries. The US is more than capable of defeating conventionally the entire combined military forces of the rest of the world if the British and British Commonwealth states stay neutral. Britain (commonwealth countries included here), Israel and possibly japan are the only two countries that even come close to developing the quality of US equipment and troops. Can we exert control over all those populations, no, could we defeat them in a stand up fight, no problem at all, just might take a bit of time.

EU is not the most political or economically influential. If given a choice between the EU and the US in a trade war, there would be very few who followed the EU. And military force = Political influence when all is said and done.

BTW, in Afghanistan, it was the French, who retreated in the face of odds faced regularly by US and the British forces that allowed the insurgents to get such a strong foot hold in Afghanistan today. The only problem defeating French troops is where to put and how to feed all the surrender monkies.

I probably know more about militaries than you do -- and not just because I can see you know little at all from your post.

Britain and the British Commonwealth, including India, South Africa, Australia, New Zealand, Canada, and half of Africa staying neutral is, firstly, a huge, huge condition for victory.

Secondly, you're full of ****. The US spends a lot on its military, but the idea that it could defeat the rest of the world in a conventional fight is utter ludicrous -- mere population would disagree. Secondly, you might note that for all the US's military might, it has failed time and time again to defeat smaller, poorer countries ranging from the Middle East to Asia to Europe.

French and British troops are amongst the most highly trained in the world, and the French Foreign Legion is unequivocally and absolutely one of the most effective military tools in the world today -- interventions across Asia and Africa that have been quick, successful and well-executed, where American troops have been bogged down, are par for the course for the Legion.

I would also like a single source that says that the French military fleeing in Afghanistan resulted in Taliban control -- because that's pure and blatant bull****. Some uneducated Americans like to propagate this 'French surrender monkey' (spelled monkey, not monkie, by the way) myth, but I challenge you to open your eyes and look at the facts:

French troops since the turn of the millennia have been in: Cote d'Ivoire, Mali, Guyana, Djibouti, the Central African Republic, Kosovo, Afghanistan, Chad and Somalia. American troops have undertaken operations in: Iraq, Afghanistan, Somalia.

That's funny -- it looks like the French list was a lot longer! How bizarre, everyone knows the French never engage in military operations, being of course cheese-eating surrender monkeys.

Or maybe that title should go to the Americans?

As for the EU -- it is the largest economy in the world. There is no debate. Its GDP, GNP and PPP are all higher than that of the United States, and, as I mentioned, it is the world's largest aid donor, humanitarian developer, normative power and international arbiter.

It is also the largest collection of G8 states, and it holds two seats on the UN Security Council to America's one. The EU is the largest and most powerful political bloc in the world.

In short, you are wrong, and bigoted. You believe that America is the best at everything purely because you were born there, but the facts do not hold up. Your place in the world is not where you think it is.
 
Speech is suppressed in Europe.

Don't be absurd. We have all of the free speech rights that you do. In fact, we have plenty of rights that Americans don't, leading me to think that Western European nations are a lot more free than America. The right to healthcare, for one -- it is indeed nice that we don't starve or die of our illness when we fall sick. That's a right. The right to a minimum wage! That's a good one too. Waiters and waitresses in the US are paid under minimum wage, which is pathetic -- in Britain and France, everyone, and I mean everyone, is paid at least minimum wage or more. Or the freedom to travel to Cuba, our governments haven't taken that from us like yours has.

Or, the freedom to not be shot in one of the tens of thousands of shootings that occur in the US every year -- in Britain, there were 64 last year.

Yeah, I think we're a lot more free than you are.
 
Ridicule, hate, contempt, and blasphemy speech. Especially in England, with jail for tweeting.

Don't be disingenuous -- you have the same laws. You are similarly not allowed to incite hatred, nor are you able to shout 'fire!' in a movie theatre. You'll get arrested in the US for going to a NAACP meeting and screaming racial epithets and urging people to kill black people, just the same as if you were in Britain.
 
Don't be disingenuous -- you have the same laws.

Absolutely not. All four of the ones mentioned are not just allowed, the state is banned from punishing them.
 
Show me the laws. I know for a fact people have been prosecuted for just those things

First amendment.

Check SCOTUS cases: Snyder v. Phelps (protects "outrageous" speech), United States v. Alvarez (protects false speech), and of course a very important part of free speech which is the state cannot decide which words are bannable with Near v. Minnesota.
 
France and Britain are still in the top 10 economies in the world, as is Germany. They have two of the best militaries in the world -- most analysts put France as the third most powerful military IN THE WORLD, after the US and Russia. I can hear it now, 'we're number 3! we're number 3!

The EU is the world's largest economy, the centre of Western political and philosophical thought, and the single largest: Aid donor, developer, international arbiter, economic power, and normative/social power.
It's the center of failed western political ideology, a failed social experiment, and is being held together by one country (it was two, but France just chased out it's top earners with their new 75% tax, well done by the way). Isn't the Euro about to collapse anyways? How many countries have been bailed out? I think Greece is going on round 2.

The French and British invade, even in the last 50 years, more countries on average than the US, and indeed they have a better success rate in those countries. France has just recently deployed to Chad, the Central African Republic and Mali, while also maintaining a force in Afghanistan for the duration of that war, as well as troops in the Horn of Africa, Djibouti, Cote d'Ivoire, and Guyana amongst others. The allied intervention in Libya in 2011 was mainly based off of the French aircraft carrier Charles de Gaulle, which is, by the way, the only nuclear-powered aircraft carrier in the world operated by a country other than the US.
Congratulations. America doesn't care.

The countries of the EU, as well, fund a much larger portion of the UN than America does:

United Nations - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

All told, America funds 22% of the UN, while the EU funds more than 30% of the UN.

So, you mean to tell me all of the countries in the EU managed, TOGETHER, to pay only 8% more than a single country? This isn't something to be proud of.

So, in other words, pull your colonial head out of your ass -- the facts do not agree with you.

America, once again, could care less about Europe, nor should we. They are proving to be our downfall, influencing us and attempting to ratify law by foreign decree. The day UN troops are on US soil, I assure you, target practice on blue helmets commences. I think we should return to our isolationist policies with the old policy of trade with all, ally with none, avoid war, everyone can do what they want. We don't want to be part of this failed globalist experiment. We don't want this utopia being offered. We don't want social enlightenment in the form of western european idealism. We don't want bottom up social justice or wealth redistribution. The EU is a drag on the worlds economy, and if Germany (and formerly France) didn't hold it together, you'd all be bankrupt (not that Italy, Portugal, Spain, Greece, etc aren't on their way or already there). You were better off before this desire for an unattainable system. Kick the UN to the curb, drop the EU, and be your own people again. Globalism does not work. It never will.

The thousands of years of feudal rule and being subjects of the government...I can understand the indoctrinated beliefs.
 
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