View Poll Results: What should we do with the Guantanamo prisoners?

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  • Release them.

    5 9.09%
  • Move them to US facilities and try them.

    17 30.91%
  • Continue to detain then indefinitely.

    8 14.55%
  • Something else.

    25 45.45%
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Thread: What should we do with the Guantanamo prisoners?

  1. #181
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    Re: What should we do with the Guantanamo prisoners?

    Quote Originally Posted by DA60 View Post
    So it's better to keep innocent people locked up indefinitely just in case they might retaliate if they are released?

    What a cowardly thing to believe.
    It goes against everything that our society is supposed to hold dear. How can we prattle on to the rest of the world about fairness and justice when we won't even do it ourselves?
    If you claim sexual harassment to be wrong, yet you defend anyone on your side for any reason,
    then you are a hypocrite and everything you say on the matter is just babble.

  2. #182
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    Re: What should we do with the Guantanamo prisoners?

    Quote Originally Posted by DA60 View Post
    To me, the ends NEVER justify the means.
    So.... you do nothing?

  3. #183
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    Re: What should we do with the Guantanamo prisoners?

    Quote Originally Posted by americanwoman View Post
    Give them trials so we can release them or give them a proper sentence for whatever crime they did.
    Exactly right.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  4. #184
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    Re: What should we do with the Guantanamo prisoners?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    So.... you do nothing?
    No, you do the right thing.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  5. #185
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    Re: What should we do with the Guantanamo prisoners?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    No, you do the right thing.
    He said the means NEVER justify the ends.

    Which means, for example, that driving (which places others at risk) is not justified by the need to get to work.

    Waging defensive war (in which people will die) is not justified by an attack.

    Having a police force (which inevitably will result in harm to an innocent) is not justified even by violent crime.

    Membership in this form (when your time could be spent elsewhere) is not justified by the desire to participate.



    And so forth. Saying that "The Ends Never Justify The Means" is basically a way of saying "I Refuse To Make Cost Benefit Analysis".

  6. #186
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    Re: What should we do with the Guantanamo prisoners?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    He said the means NEVER justify the ends.

    Which means, for example, that driving (which places others at risk) is not justified by the need to get to work.

    Waging defensive war (in which people will die) is not justified by an attack.

    Having a police force (which inevitably will result in harm to an innocent) is not justified even by violent crime.

    Membership in this form (when your time could be spent elsewhere) is not justified by the desire to participate.



    And so forth. Saying that "The Ends Never Justify The Means" is basically a way of saying "I Refuse To Make Cost Benefit Analysis".
    I think you miss the point if the comment. Immoral and illegal means are never justified no matter the ends. You're playing a semantic game in order to avoid the point. Common sayings have a context.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  7. #187
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    Re: What should we do with the Guantanamo prisoners?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I think you miss the point if the comment. Immoral and illegal means are never justified no matter the ends.
    Illegal means can indeed be justified by the ends. As a single example, emergency responders are allowed to flout traffic laws. We recognize that the potential to save lives (the ends) is more important than disobeying speed limits and traffic lights (the means). As another example, today we recognize that Civil Rights Protesters engaging in Civil Disobedience were justified, despite the illegality of their actions, because the end they were pursuing was worth that means.

    However, his comment didn't say I don't believe that illegal or immoral means are not justified by any ends, he said the ends never justified the means.

    You're playing a semantic game in order to avoid the point. Common sayings have a context.
    Saying that the ends do not justify the means is a saying that is directed at specific situations; not used in the general.
    Last edited by cpwill; 12-28-13 at 01:24 AM.

  8. #188
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    Re: What should we do with the Guantanamo prisoners?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Illegal means can indeed be justified by the ends. As a single example, emergency responders are allowed to flout traffic laws. We recognize that the potential to save lives is more important than obedience to speed limits and traffic lights.

    However, his comment didn't say I don't believe that illegal or immoral means are not justified by any ends, he said the ends never justified the means.



    Saying that the ends do not justify the means is a saying that is directed at specific situations; not used in the general.
    No, the law allows for emergency vehicles. No one flaunts the law.

    And nd the common phrase is enough to know the meaning. It carries a general understanding.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  9. #189
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    Re: What should we do with the Guantanamo prisoners?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    No, the law allows for emergency vehicles. No one flaunts the law.
    As I understand it, that is not always the case.

    However, to be clear, you believe that Civil Disobedience is never justified?

    And nd the common phrase is enough to know the meaning. It carries a general understanding.
    Ah. A magical general understanding that does not require us to apply actual logic. When he said "never" what he meant was "in some particular cases, and not in others, defined by nothing in particular". Hotcha.

  10. #190
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    Re: What should we do with the Guantanamo prisoners?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    As I understand it, that is not always the case.

    However, to be clear, you believe that Civil Disobedience is never justified?



    Ah. A magical general understanding that does not require us to apply actual logic. When he said "never" what he meant was "in some particular cases, and not in others, defined by nothing in particular". Hotcha.
    Civil disobedience comes with consequences. People are arrested, charged, and sentenced. The idea is to change the course, not sidestep the law.

    I drove ambulance for sometime. The law accounts for their proper actions.

    And there's nothing magical. The phrases come complete with societal context.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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