• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

What is a "liveable wage"?

What is a "liveable wage"?

  • Cold beans and a roach motel

    Votes: 4 11.8%

  • Bunkin with 2-3 friends and take-out

    Votes: 7 20.6%

  • Living alone in my own place, new car, new iphone

    Votes: 3 8.8%

  • Who cares, I just want to soak the rich.

    Votes: 1 2.9%

  • There is no such thing as "liveable wage".

    Votes: 19 55.9%
  • Total voters
    34
:ranton: Probably my biggest issue with DP is the constant hyperbole comparisons to Hitler, Stalin, the Gestapo, etc...

For the love of all you hold dear... STOP... JUST STOP

/rant :soap:
 
Goshin said:
My point was that pretty much nobody gets to choose what they make.
Click to expand...

Only because they have to agree with the person with money to trade in exchange for the job's tasks. It shares this feature with all other types of trades -- both parties have to agree to the terms.

The best they can do is try to get into a career that makes good money, hope their employer actually pays them good money, and hope their career doesn't become technologically obsolete or outsourced or otherwise vanish like smoke thru no fault of their own.
Click to expand...

They can do more than just hope about things that are outside their control. They can actively seek out other job opportunities (continuously) to see what qualifications similar or next-step-up jobs are seeking, find ways to gain that knowledge and/or experience, and apply for more advanced jobs as they arise.

Perhaps most importantly, they can also choose living standards that allow them to save money and/or pay down debts more rapidly, which improves their financial standing continuously.
 
Neomalthusian said:
Only because they have to agree with the person with money to trade in exchange for the job's tasks. It shares this feature with all other types of trades -- both parties have to agree to the terms.



They can do more than just hope about things that are outside their control. They can actively seek out other job opportunities (continuously) to see what qualifications similar or next-step-up jobs are seeking, find ways to gain that knowledge and/or experience, and apply for more advanced jobs as they arise.

Perhaps most importantly, they can also choose living standards that allow them to save money and/or pay down debts more rapidly, which improves their financial standing continuously.
Click to expand...



I know. I was addressing a broad generalization the other poster made, which sounded as if you get to choose how much you make... and my point was that no, you don't. Not in the real world.
 
Gipper said:
Breathing in and out 15-20 times a minute, heartbeat between 70 and 90 beats a minute, function without internal injuries, able to move without assistance, etc.
Click to expand...

It appears that activity is now deemed worthy of gov't funded compensation by some. ;)
 
Chiefgator said:
:ranton: Probably my biggest issue with DP is the constant hyperbole comparisons to Hitler, Stalin, the Gestapo, etc...

For the love of all you hold dear... STOP... JUST STOP

/rant :soap:
Click to expand...

if living means breathing to you :lol:
 
Medusa said:
if living means breathing to you :lol:
Click to expand...

I know you live in Turkey and things may be different there... but in the US, a person making minimum wage is not even in the same discussion as a slave labor camp with the possibility of dieing on the job.
 
Chiefgator said:
I know you live in Turkey and things may be different there... but in the US, a person making minimum wage is not even in the same discussion as a slave labor camp with the possibility of dieing on the job.
Click to expand...

tell it to many other americans who agree with me
 
No such thing as an absolute ideal. We could estimate what it takes to live at a certain standard, but whose to say what standard makes one whole. Some people feel a living wage is whatever it takes to be without want; some just want to get their next hit on a crack pipe...
 
Gipper said:
This is why I phrased it by percentages and related it to consumer items. Do you think a full-time worker at Wal-mart should be able to have an iPhone or a GS4 or whatever the next big thing in the phone world is? What about a newer car? Do you think that they should be able to trade in that 2009 Chevrolet because it's getting a tad old? Should they be able to go out to Red Lobster once a week because "they deserve it"?

People can make it on minimum wage in most places if they really want to (with obvious reflections for areas with high COL, adjusted accordingly). I'm just wondering what all you think they "deserve", because it sounds as if you're wanting the uneducated, unskilled worker to have a LOT more than the "basics".
Click to expand...

The funny thing is that all those things are possible for the low wage worker, if their expenses are low. Some people own a small home with no mortgage and a low tax burden. I work hard to not buy anything on credit so that a low income is sufficient. I even paid cash for my 4 year degree that took better than 6 years. This is why it is extremely important to keep property tax low and dis allow other taxes on assets. Family wealth or at least generational stability can be handed to ones progeny.
 
Sounds like one of those terms that means something different for everyone. The automaker CEOs who flew in private jets to ask for bailouts would probably say that $400k/year is not a liveable wage. The dude from "Into the Wild" would say we can work at McD's a few weeks to buy a plane ticket to alaska and then live off the land. Others will say they have $400/mo in student loan debt, so minimum wage ain't gonna cut it.
 
I collect old cars so my livable wage wqould be much higher tan many other people.

Old cars are worse than a drug habit.
 
TheNextEra said:
The question was asked to define what a liveable wage is. Like I said, the definition doesn't allow a "set" amount to be set because everyone's "liveable" wage is different was the point I was trying to make. You can't have a set amount on liveable.

Not sure why the hostile response to what I said, but whatever floats your boat. You seem to want to put words in my mouth as to what I was saying, and what you are saying is simple not true to what I want. Try again.
Click to expand...

If what you say is true, then a business could never pay a livable wage because it does vary.

If a business is made to pay what each employee needs to survive, then only teenagers living at home will get hired for the fast food and other similar industries.
 
This thread restores some faith in humanity. There are fewer illiterates kicking around that term now.
 
Eating food, drinking water and breathing air is what is all that is needed to survive. The rest is just fun and games. Is $2 a day fair?
 
CalGun said:
For where? A live able wage in San Francisco is far different then my home in Denio Junction where I can live on $750 a month and save for retirement.

Also is every job required to pay a living wage? Why? Why do that to an entry level opportunity for teens and what impacts would such a decision have on the fixed income masses who won't get cost of living increases fast enough to stay up with the inflation of higher mandated wages. I personally think a man should be free to work for what he wants how ever high or low that May be.
Click to expand...

This always pissed me off. If you can't make enough to survive in San Francisco.... MOVE!!

Not San Francisco per se, but just as an example.

Or take all those yoyo's in Detroit. The auto industry up and left you? Out of work? MOVE!! I could rattle off a thousand places where a low skilled worker (or a highly skilled one in the case of detroit) can go and get a job tomorrow. San Fran and Detroit are very expensive cities.

The worst of all HAS TO BE new york, new york though. Oh my god that just blows my goddamn mind right out. HOW can you have poor people in New York? How can they afford to stay?? Jumpin applejacks, just look at the property values of pretty much anything around there.

I'll tell you how, they get handouts. If you didn't have that, the entire NYC would be upscale.
 
Peter Grimm said:
This always pissed me off. If you can't make enough to survive in San Francisco.... MOVE!!

Not San Francisco per se, but just as an example.

Or take all those yoyo's in Detroit. The auto industry up and left you? Out of work? MOVE!! I could rattle off a thousand places where a low skilled worker (or a highly skilled one in the case of detroit) can go and get a job tomorrow. San Fran and Detroit are very expensive cities.
Click to expand...

Ironically, broke hipsters are leaving places like San Francisco and Portland and taking up residence in the ruins of Detroit. Portland and SF are for cliche poser hipsters now. The real hipsters are in places like Detroit and Pittsburgh.

The worst of all HAS TO BE new york, new york though. Oh my god that just blows my goddamn mind right out. HOW can you have poor people in New York? How can they afford to stay?? Jumpin applejacks, just look at the property values of pretty much anything around there.

I'll tell you how, they get handouts. If you didn't have that, the entire NYC would be upscale.
Click to expand...

The real thing that blows my mind is why the poor live in ANY city. Why aren't they in rural places with fertile soil doing the homesteading thing? Not enough liquor stores and drug dealers nearby?
 
Neomalthusian said:
Ironically, broke hipsters are leaving places like San Francisco and Portland and taking up residence in the ruins of Detroit. Portland and SF are for cliche poser hipsters now. The real hipsters are in places like Detroit and Pittsburgh.



The real thing that blows my mind is why the poor live in ANY city. Why aren't they in rural places with fertile soil doing the homesteading thing? Not enough liquor stores and drug dealers nearby?
Click to expand...

I just started another thread about this, I'm with you 100%. What ever happened to the time honored tradition of following the jobs? That's how most of us got to this country to begin with. Auto jobs in detroit left you? Pack up and move to Tennessee where the factory opened up. That's how it happens.

Damn people with unrealistic expectations, thinking jobs are gonna just fall in their laps wherever they happen to be.

But forgetting all that for a second, how can these people afford to stay in the city is my question. Why haven't property values in San Fran, say, been driven up so high that they can no longer afford to live there? You would think property near city center would be valuable.
 
vasuderatorrent said:
Eating food, drinking water and breathing air is what is all that is needed to survive. The rest is just fun and games. Is $2 a day fair?
Click to expand...

That's communist talk. What if their labor isn't worth $2/day?
 
Neomalthusian said:
The real thing that blows my mind is why the poor live in ANY city. Why aren't they in rural places with fertile soil doing the homesteading thing? Not enough liquor stores and drug dealers nearby?
Click to expand...

Finding a job in a rural area is even harder than in a large city. There are also plenty of liquor stores and drug dealers in rural areas.
 
Carjosse said:
Finding a job in a rural area is even harder than in a large city.
Click to expand...

Biologically, it is harder to survive in crowded areas with infertile or inaccessible soil than it is in spacious areas with fertile soil.

There are also plenty of liquor stores and drug dealers in rural areas.
Click to expand...

What do you want to bet there are more in urban areas than there are in rural areas?
 
Gipper said:
I'll tackle this:



Poverty In America: Cellphones, TVs, Refrigerators And Microwave Ovens : Personal Liberty

b2575_chart1600px.ashx


What is Poverty in the United States: Air Conditioning, Cable TV and an Xbox
Click to expand...

Maybe I'm missing something, but when did nearly 10% of US households get photocopiers?
 
EdwinWillers said:
aka printers probably
Click to expand...

That definitely makes more sense. I sat about for 10 mins trying to figure out which of my friends had photocopiers.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom