View Poll Results: Should cigarette smoking be allowed in some bars & restaurants?

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  • I think ALL smoking restrictions should be lifted.

    26 20.80%
  • Yes, some bars/restaurants should be set aside to allow smoking.

    37 29.60%
  • No, keep it is it is now.

    51 40.80%
  • Other

    11 8.80%
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Thread: Should cigarette smoking be allowed in some bars & restaurants?

  1. #371
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    Re: Should cigarette smoking be allowed in some bars & restaurants?

    Quote Originally Posted by paddymcdougall View Post
    Businesses can't serve drinks to underage patrons
    No one can legally provide alcohol to underaged individuals, so businesses are not isolated in this aspect as they are in smoking.

    Businesses can't refuse to serve someone because of their ethnic background
    Actually that also falls under the same arguments as are being presented here and there is also currently another thread dealing with this issue more specificly.

    Businesses have to maintain a certain standard of cleanliness in the kitchen
    That falls under the normal limits of freedoms insofar as since one can't know what goes on in the kitchen one can't make an informed decision. This same reasoning cannot be made for smoking since it's pretty much an either or issue. Either smoking is allowed and you are aware of the danger of second hand smoke or it's not and you know you are safe.

    Businesses have to collect sales taxes
    Only if they are in a state with sales taxes.

    AND - businesses can't allow smoking indoors because of the impact of second hand smoke.
    Which is what we are discussing as to whether or not it is an overreaching restriction. The impact of second hand smoke is something that each individual controls. No one can be exposed to second hand smoke against their will within a building environment, short of a rules violation against the owner's wishes. If you know smoking is allowed then you are choosing to expose yourself to second hand smoke if you enter the building.

    I don't know why anyone has a problem with this. Or maybe you also think the other restrictions are unreasonable as well?
    There are many unreasonable restrictions, especially when it comes to businesses. At some point in this country we have decided that private businesses are no longer private. At that point why not just make them all government run?

    re what car you can drive - the cars you drive have to pass certain safety standards; the car companies can't sell you an unsafe car. Is this an unreasonable restriction on their private business? I don't think so. Some of you might.

    There is no inherent right to own a business; you have to follow the rules.
    Actually there is. It's part of your inherent right to do with your property, time and life what you wish, so long as it does not infringe upon the rights and freedoms of others. Hence where the rules come in. The rules are to protect us from one another violating rights and freedoms.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    That is what I meant. Outside the stadium or in the lobbies is fine. There were times when some person would light up in the stands as we were warming up or competing. That was not acceptable.
    I'm still for allowing it in the stadium, just not right near the players. Now this runs a very fine line with me and I would prefer it if it was a stadium owner who made such rules. But sports players are somewhat unique insofar as how they are considered employees. They don't get to fully choose where they work. If you had one team where the home stadium was smoke free, you'd still have to worry about the stadiums you visit. Additionally, a player can be traded and end up in a smoking stadium. Thus the limit in the immediate vicinity. However, higher up in the stands, if the owner allows it, light 'em up!

  2. #372
    Educator Amandi's Avatar
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    Re: Should cigarette smoking be allowed in some bars & restaurants?

    Quote Originally Posted by maquiscat View Post
    Smoking only affects others when they are near it. Because you don't want to have to take the time and effort to be informed if it is occurring in a business or because you want to shop somewhere where it is occurring, you (this is the generalized you of the anti-smoking crowd) instead get laws passed to impose on other people's rights to do as they wish with their private businesses. It's really that simple.
    And I know my motivation is to help other people, especially the children (see, I played the children card).

  3. #373
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    Re: Should cigarette smoking be allowed in some bars & restaurants?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kreton View Post
    A business should be allowed to choose what they allow in their establishment. If people dont like it, they dont have to shop their. Consumers influence will drive what is important to people. If most Americans are offended by smoking and refuse to shop at my store simply because of that, I am likely to make changes. Allowing the government to state that severely limits freedoms. Because it is best for society should the government be allowed to tell you what church to go to? What foods you can eat? What car you can drive? Do you think that you should be allowed to make any decisions of your own?
    What church you go to doesnt affect others around you. What foods you eat dont affect others around you. You shouldnt be allowed to make a decision that affects those around you.

  4. #374
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    Re: Should cigarette smoking be allowed in some bars & restaurants?

    Quote Originally Posted by Amandi View Post
    And I know my motivation is to help other people, especially the children (see, I played the children card).
    Yeah, but that's usually just used by people with no other arguments and an immense desire to use government against the free exercise of another's rights.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  5. #375
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    Re: Should cigarette smoking be allowed in some bars & restaurants?

    Quote Originally Posted by Amandi View Post
    What church you go to doesnt affect others around you. What foods you eat dont affect others around you. You shouldnt be allowed to make a decision that affects those around you.
    Some religions teach incredible intolerance and harassment, occasionally spilling over into violent crime. Or those Christian Scientists who let their kids die cause they don't like medical care. Eating poorly costs us all money when you need to go to the emergency room or causes insurance companies to increase overall premiums to cover additional costs.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Should cigarette smoking be allowed in some bars & restaurants?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Some religions teach incredible intolerance and harassment, occasionally spilling over into violent crime. Or those Christian Scientists who let their kids die cause they don't like medical care. Eating poorly costs us all money when you need to go to the emergency room or causes insurance companies to increase overall premiums to cover additional costs.
    If an individuals action leads to violence then that individual should be held responsible.

  7. #377
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    Re: Should cigarette smoking be allowed in some bars & restaurants?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Yeah, but that's usually just used by people with no other arguments and an immense desire to use government against the free exercise of another's rights.
    Or used by us that actually believe it.

  8. #378
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    Re: Should cigarette smoking be allowed in some bars & restaurants?

    Quote Originally Posted by Amandi View Post
    Or used by us that actually believe it.
    You taking your kids to bars?
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Should cigarette smoking be allowed in some bars & restaurants?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    You taking your kids to bars?
    I only know a few bars in this area that doesnt serve food and children cant go into. There was nothing in this thread that said it was bars only.

  10. #380
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    Re: Should cigarette smoking be allowed in some bars & restaurants?

    Quote Originally Posted by Amandi View Post
    I only know a few bars in this area that doesnt serve food and children cant go into. There was nothing in this thread that said it was bars only.
    I'm just wondering where this care of the children ends. Strip clubs, taking your kids there too?
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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