View Poll Results: Would you support a single-payer system funded by raising taxes on the very wealthy.

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  • Yes, it would be good and they can afford it.

    12 27.91%
  • No, I don't feel it would be good or fair.

    31 72.09%
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Thread: Single payer system funded by raising taxes on the richest 1%.

  1. #51
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    Re: Single payer system funded by raising taxes on the richest 1%.

    Quote Originally Posted by Morality Games View Post
    ... doing what the rich do doesn't seem that challenging when the government backs them up whenever they fail or are simply incapable of adjusting or expanding fast enough to be globally competitive.
    Yeah, huh? All you have to do is get rich and the government will bail you out no matter what you do. And on the same planet where that's true, you can flap your arms really fast and fly around the room, too. It's probably something in the water there.
    You can't reason anyone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into in the first place.

  2. #52
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    Re: Single payer system funded by raising taxes on the richest 1%.

    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    Yeah, huh? All you have to do is get rich and the government will bail you out no matter what you do. And on the same planet where that's true, you can flap your arms really fast and fly around the room, too. It's probably something in the water there.
    Strawman.
    If you notice something good in yourself, give credit to God, not to yourself, but be certain the evil you commit is always your own and yours to acknowledge.

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  3. #53
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    Re: Single payer system funded by raising taxes on the richest 1%.

    Quote Originally Posted by Morality Games View Post
    Strawman.
    I thought my strawman could play with your bullspit. Perfect barnyard combination. If you don't have to worry about failing when your rich because the government backs you up, then you can fly around the room like a little hummingbird just by flapping your arms really fast. If (a) then (b).

    Since (a) is bullspit, then (b) has to be something that's bullspit, too.

    See how that works?
    You can't reason anyone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into in the first place.

  4. #54
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    Re: Single payer system funded by raising taxes on the richest 1%.

    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    I thought my strawman could play with your bullhit. Perfect barnyard combination. If you don't have to worry about failing when your rich because the government backs you up, then you can fly around the room like a little hummingbird just by flapping your arms really fast. If (a) then (b).

    Since (a) is bullspit, then (b) has to be something that's bullspit, too.

    See how that works?
    A strawman is a strawman specifically because it creates a misleading interpretation of the opponent's argument. Admitting that you created a misleading interpretation of my argument while also claiming you hit my argument on the nose doesn't make sense.

    Do you have a real objection or not?
    If you notice something good in yourself, give credit to God, not to yourself, but be certain the evil you commit is always your own and yours to acknowledge.

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  5. #55
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    Re: Single payer system funded by raising taxes on the richest 1%.

    Oh boy, here we go... the next several pages will be arguments about strawmen and fallacies and levels of individual comprehension.
    If you claim sexual harassment to be wrong, yet you defend anyone on your side for any reason,
    then you are a hypocrite and everything you say on the matter is just babble.

  6. #56
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    Re: Single payer system funded by raising taxes on the richest 1%.

    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    Oh boy, here we go... the next several pages will be arguments about strawmen and fallacies and levels of individual comprehension.
    No, it won't. Either he has an objection or he doesn't. If not, then I'll go post somewhere else because there's no argument going on here.
    If you notice something good in yourself, give credit to God, not to yourself, but be certain the evil you commit is always your own and yours to acknowledge.

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  7. #57
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    Re: Single payer system funded by raising taxes on the richest 1%.

    Quote Originally Posted by Morality Games View Post
    A strawman is a strawman specifically because it creates a misleading interpretation of the opponent's argument. Admitting that you created a misleading interpretation of my argument while also claiming you hit my argument on the nose doesn't make sense.

    Do you have a real objection or not?
    It wasn't a misleading interpretation of your argument. You didn't have an argument. You had bullspit drivel that anyone with enough brain energy to find the "on" switch of a computer would recognize to be false at face value. Bailouts have happened but if someone is stupid enough to think that the government will bail them out if they fail then they're too stupid to be rich in the first place. I didn't like bailouts, either, but to pretend they're common place and done just to prop up the rich is ridiculous. You know better.

    I don't need a strawman to ridicule your statements. Ridicule is the natural result of making ridiculous statements.
    You can't reason anyone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into in the first place.

  8. #58
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    Re: Single payer system funded by raising taxes on the richest 1%.

    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    It wasn't a misleading interpretation of your argument. You didn't have an argument. You had bullspit drivel that anyone with enough brain energy to find the "on" switch of a computer would recognize to be false at face value. Bailouts have happened but if someone is stupid enough to think that the government will bail them out if they fail then they're too stupid to be rich in the first place. I didn't like bailouts, either, but to pretend they're common place and done just to prop up the rich is ridiculous. You know better.

    I don't need a strawman to ridicule your statements. Ridicule is the natural result of making ridiculous statements.
    Government "back up" isn't limited to bailouts, although relevant industries receive more than indicated by the attention grabbing 2008 recession.

    A few years ago the European Union was going to initiate a policy to wean themselves off their historical dependence on foreign financing and crediting companies, a policy that would adversely affect companies like Visa in the United States because it would lose them European markets while sponsoring an international, European-based competitor in developing Asian, South American, and African markets (the places where long term financing is most lucrative). Also, places where European nations would develop an advantage thanks to pre-existing historical, political, and economic ties. The United States government lobbied them to stop that from happening, to ensure that international financing remains centered in Wall Street.

    Or, the Canadian and American governments signed decades spanning trade agreements so that American pharmaceutics supplied Canada with cheap products in exchange for acknowledging American drug licenses in Canada so that Canadian pharmaceutics wouldn't develop as competitors in the North American market. They THEN outlawed importing medicine into the United States so that cash strapped Americans could enjoy the same medication at a cheaper price. This is the pretty much the same thing as saying that only rich people are legally allowed to enjoy the benefits of globalism. Pharmaceuticals can take advantage of the international jobs market, but Americans can't take advantage of the international health care market.

    For that matter, globalism itself only works because the United States invests trillions of dollars into maintaining international security. We keep other regions of the world at peace, but only the rich receive an economic benefit from that; whatever stingy benefits the middle class receives are lost in the expense while bleeding jobs and wages.

    Or the airlines, or subsidies, or whatever.

    All of these things cost money and put economic strain on ordinary Americans.
    Last edited by Morality Games; 11-18-13 at 07:29 PM.
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  9. #59
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    Re: Single payer system funded by raising taxes on the richest 1%.

    Quote Originally Posted by Morality Games View Post
    Government "back up" isn't limited to bailouts, although relevant industries receive more than indicated by the attention grabbing 2008 recession.
    I see an endless pissing match coming over this and I'll just bow out because we both know it's bullspit to assert that the government bails out the rich and I'm sure as hell not interested in refuting an endless fount of specious argumentation over it.
    You can't reason anyone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into in the first place.

  10. #60
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    Re: Single payer system funded by raising taxes on the richest 1%.

    The poll question is too vague to be answered. What kind of single-payer system? Who are supposed to be those "very wealthy"? How are these taxes to be structured?

    Depending on details, the answer can be "Hell, absolutely no" or "Okay, this sounds like an acceptable compromise", or anywhere in between.

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