View Poll Results: Should the law develop a way of protecting whistle blowers of criminal activities?

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  • Yes, Courts could develop a doctrine

    12 66.67%
  • Absolutely not, we should prosecute aggressively

    2 11.11%
  • Other

    4 22.22%
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Thread: Should we protect whistle blowers when....

  1. #1
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    Should we protect whistle blowers when....

    The United States has been caught red handed in a web of lies, deceit and subversion of the law on a scale even the most ardent of conspiracy theorists find hard to grapple with.

    From bugging the phones of allied leaders, the embassies of friendly nations and entire populations, American leaders have been scuppering to justify there illegal and/or grossly disproportionate war on privacy by insulting the memory of the victims of 9/11 and countless terrorist attacks across the nation.

    And although blaming terrorist elements for government misbehavior has become a bit of a banality since the Arabic unrest, the federal government insists it has been pushed into a corner by radicals, that it is fighting it's corner on the behalf of liberty, and that mass surveillance is it's means.

    Edward Snowden and Julian Assange have fallen foul of the United States, as it uses it's authority to attempt to smoke them out of every nation and embassy on Earth.

    But despite arguments as to whether or not these men have endangered US lives, the question remains: Should we protect whistle blowers who reveal blatantly disproportionate and obviously criminal activities sanctioned by the US government regardless of secrecy classification (ie, a legal entitlement to whistle-blowing)? Or should Courts remain indifferent as to the content of what has been leaked and concentrate instead on whether or not it can be proved that an individual caused the leak and charge accordingly (status quo)?


    Maybe the Courts could develop a doctrine to determine what constitutes a "legal entitlement to whistle-blowing".

    Like: would a reasonable actor regard the act as disproportionate, was the act contrary to the constitution of the United States and/or it's laws, was the realization of the act required or genuinely thought to be required in giving effect to the survival of the state or it's allies?

    On the other hand, maybe aggressively pursuing whistle blowers, regardless of what it is they leaked, is the only sure way of protecting U.S national security as a way of setting a precedent that leaks of any form, which could aid enemy countries, are not tolerated?
    Last edited by kaya'08; 11-12-13 at 09:52 PM.
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    Re: Should we protect whistle blowers when....

    blatantly disproportionate and obviously criminal activities
    Who's deciding that this is what everything is? Was there a Supreme Court Trial that ruled as such?

    Until it's decided on officially - it's all subjection.
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    Re: Should we protect whistle blowers when....

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    Who's deciding that this is what everything is? Was there a Supreme Court Trial that ruled as such?

    Until it's decided on officially - it's all subjection.
    That's up to you. I proposed:

    Maybe the Courts could develop a doctrine to determine what constitutes a "legal entitlement to whistle-blowing". Like: would a reasonable actor regard the act as disproportionate, was the act contrary to the constitution of the United States and/or it's laws, was the realization of the act required/thought to be required in giving effect to the survival of the state or it's allies?
    Last edited by kaya'08; 11-12-13 at 09:50 PM.
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    Re: Should we protect whistle blowers when....

    It is not criminal activity in the US so I disagree with your basis. Even beyond that, no if they have signed a confidentiality agreement or the information is deemed protected or privileged. Beyond that, just depends.

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    Re: Should we protect whistle blowers when....

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    Who's deciding that this is what everything is? Was there a Supreme Court Trial that ruled as such?

    Until it's decided on officially - it's all subjection.
    Nope. Criminal is criminal. SCOTUS is fallible and makes mistakes... and criminal in this case goes outside the jurisdiction of the law anyway. It is morally corrupt what they are doing. Is it legally corrupt as well? I say it is and that may be determined in the courts later.
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    Re: Should we protect whistle blowers when....

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    Who's deciding that this is what everything is? Was there a Supreme Court Trial that ruled as such?

    Until it's decided on officially - it's all subjection.
    Translation: So you need a government official to tell you if another government officials behavior was improper.

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    Re: Should we protect whistle blowers when....

    Quote Originally Posted by Fisher View Post
    It is not criminal activity in the US so I disagree with your basis. Even beyond that, no if they have signed a confidentiality agreement or the information is deemed protected or privileged. Beyond that, just depends.
    I stated classified documents in my post, so that by implication means information that is deemed protected or privileged - otherwise it wouldn't be a very purposeful discussion. So yes, that is illegal in the United States, but to say it is acceptable to prosecute on this basis is more legal indifference to justice than legal formalism wouldn't you say?

    Those who believe a legal doctrine to protect whistle-blowers may think it is important because they believe a secret illegal act by gov is STILL an illegal act that, pursuant to justice, should be revealed and subject to the rule of law.

    Other's don't, but BOTH positions require elaboration.
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    Re: Should we protect whistle blowers when....

    I think whistle blowers should be protected when clear violations of the law are committed. The US government needs to screen better for people that will do anything for money and keep quiet about it.

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    Re: Should we protect whistle blowers when....

    Quote Originally Posted by kaya'08 View Post
    I stated classified documents in my post, so that by implication means information that is deemed protected or privileged - otherwise it wouldn't be a very purposeful discussion. So yes, that is illegal in the United States, but to say it is acceptable to prosecute on this basis is more legal indifference to justice than legal formalism wouldn't you say?

    Those who believe a legal doctrine to protect whistle-blowers may think it is important because they believe a secret illegal act by gov is STILL an illegal act that, pursuant to justice, should be revealed and subject to the rule of law.

    Other's don't, but BOTH positions require elaboration.
    You also cited wiretapping in your post. By the way, so far as I can tell, the FISA Court has issued blanket warrants for these things that you deem "illegal" in compliance with federal law ergo they are not "illegal in the United States." Whether or not a foreign country considers our acts illegal matters little as far as the whistleblower protections you seek.

  10. #10
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    Re: Should we protect whistle blowers when....

    Quote Originally Posted by Fisher View Post
    You also cited wiretapping in your post. By the way, so far as I can tell, the FISA Court has issued blanket warrants for these things that you deem "illegal" in compliance with federal law ergo they are not "illegal in the United States." Whether or not a foreign country considers our acts illegal matters little as far as the whistleblower protections you seek.
    I used recent events as a means of justifying my proposition of the question. It is a hypothetical completely independent of whatever Edward Snowden or Assange leaked. I am asking you to apply the question to whistle blowing of "privileged documents" in respect of illegal activities in general. That is pretty clear, as I am not asking you to adjudicate on their individual cases.
    Last edited by kaya'08; 11-12-13 at 10:28 PM.
    "If religious instruction were not allowed until the child had attained the age of reason, we would be living in quite a different world" - Christopher Hitchens
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