View Poll Results: Do You Have A Right To Buy Crap?

Voters
51. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes

    46 90.20%
  • No

    5 9.80%
Page 4 of 12 FirstFirst ... 23456 ... LastLast
Results 31 to 40 of 114

Thread: Do You Have A Right To Buy Crap?

  1. #31
    Sage
    Gaius46's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    New York
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:15 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    8,495

    Re: Do You Have A Right To Buy Crap?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Blaylock View Post
    It's probably true that more than half the population do not understand the difference between median and average.
    Damn. Open mouth insert foot.

    I actually do know the difference for whats its worth. And given the population size and the rather small range of IQ scores I'm willing to bet the mean and median are close enough to each other that for all practical purposes half the population is below the mean IQ. Doesn't excuse my misstatement.....
    Don't be a grammar nazi - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations, Book 1 #7

  2. #32
    Sage
    Gaius46's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    New York
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:15 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    8,495

    Re: Do You Have A Right To Buy Crap?

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    Experience has shown that too many people are not capable of choosing the policy that is right for them as demonstrated by the fact that an inability to pay medical bills is the leading cause of bankruptcy in the US
    I'm guessing in some of those cases (many) it's not that people are incapable as much as having their choices limited by economics.

    If getting a good policy means you can't pay for college but getting an okay policy means you can I'm guessing lots of people would roll the dice and take the latter. Especially if they figure in the worst case, if they happily live long enough to be presented with a million dollar bill, they can get the debt discharged via bankruptcy.
    Don't be a grammar nazi - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations, Book 1 #7

  3. #33
    Sage
    sangha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Lower Hudson Valley, NY
    Last Seen
    09-17-17 @ 05:48 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    59,990

    Re: Do You Have A Right To Buy Crap?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Blaylock View Post
    It's probably true that more than half the population do not understand the difference between median and average.
    In the case of IQ scores, the median is the same as the avg. The test is designed that way
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  4. #34
    Sage
    sangha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Lower Hudson Valley, NY
    Last Seen
    09-17-17 @ 05:48 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    59,990

    Re: Do You Have A Right To Buy Crap?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaius46 View Post
    I'm guessing in some of those cases (many) it's not that people are incapable as much as having their choices limited by economics.

    If getting a good policy means you can't pay for college but getting an okay policy means you can I'm guessing lots of people would roll the dice and take the latter. Especially if they figure in the worst case, if they happily live long enough to be presented with a million dollar bill, they can get the debt discharged via bankruptcy.
    Since getting a large medical bill, large enough to cause bankruptcy, is something common enough to cause 60% of all bankruptcies, then it would seem that those people are miscalculating the risks.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  5. #35
    Electrician
    Bob Blaylock's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    North 38°28′ West 121°26′
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 03:47 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    13,745

    Re: Do You Have A Right To Buy Crap?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaius46 View Post
    By definition half the population will have a below average IQ and it doesn't follow from that that simply because one has a below average IQ one is incapable of sound decision making.

    What makes for a bad insurance policy? And is the policy bad or is it that people are buying policies that are ill suited for their needs? Those are I think two completely different things.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Blaylock View Post
    It's probably true that more than half the population do not understand the difference between median and average.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gaius46 View Post
    Damn. Open mouth insert foot.

    I actually do know the difference for whats its worth. And given the population size and the rather small range of IQ scores I'm willing to bet the mean and median are close enough to each other that for all practical purposes half the population is below the mean IQ. Doesn't excuse my misstatement.....
    It may be true that half the population is below average (or mean), but you were incorrect when you said that it is true by definition.

    By definition, it is true that half the population is below the median. That's what the median is—the point that divides the top half from the bottom half. Also known as the 50th percentile. It may or may not be very close to the average/mean, but nothing about the definition of any term requires this to be so nor guarantees that it will be.
    The five great lies of the Left Wrong:
    We can be Godless and free. • “Social justice” through forced redistribution of wealth. • Silencing religious opinions counts as “diversity”. • Freedom without moral and personal responsibility. • Civilization can survive the intentional undermining of the family.

  6. #36
    Sage
    sangha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Lower Hudson Valley, NY
    Last Seen
    09-17-17 @ 05:48 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    59,990

    Re: Do You Have A Right To Buy Crap?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Blaylock View Post
    It may be true that half the population is below average (or mean), but you were incorrect when you said that it is true by definition.

    By definition, it is true that half the population is below the median. That's what the median is—the point that divides the top half from the bottom half. Also known as the 50th percentile. It may or may not be very close to the average/mean, but nothing about the definition of any term requires this to be so nor guarantees that it will be.
    It depends on what you mean by "the definition". If you're referring to the general meaning of the words mean and median, then you're right; It's not "by definition". They don't have to be the same #.

    However, if you're referring to the words as they're applied to the IQ test, then you're wrong because the IQ test is designed so that the avg is the mean *and* the median.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  7. #37
    Electrician
    Bob Blaylock's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    North 38°28′ West 121°26′
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 03:47 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    13,745

    Re: Do You Have A Right To Buy Crap?

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    In the case of IQ scores, the median is the same as the avg. The test is designed that way
    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    It depends on what you mean by "the definition". If you're referring to the general meaning of the words mean and median, then you're right; It's not "by definition". They don't have to be the same #.

    However, if you're referring to the words as they're applied to the IQ test, then you're wrong because the IQ test is designed so that the avg is the mean *and* the median.
    Not possible.

    At best, the test can be designed so that the average will tend to be as close as the designers of the test can get it to the median; but it will never be possible to guarantee how the data will be distributed. All it takes is enopugh excptional outliers on one side, without a corresponding weight of exceptional outliers on the other side, to skew the average away from the median.

    I recall hearing claims about the average human life expectancy at some time in the distant past being about thirty or forty years. This was probably true, but it is misleading. On would tend to take this claim to mean that a large part of the population lived until about the age of thirty or forty and then died at around that age. In fact, the average would be skewed heavily downward by a high infant mortality rate. The first year or so of one's life is the most vulnerable, and in poor conditions, many might not survive past those first few years; but if they do make it that long, they then have a good chance of living until their sixties or seventies, at least.
    Last edited by Bob Blaylock; 11-05-13 at 09:06 PM. Reason: May Laurence Tureaud have compassion toward you.
    The five great lies of the Left Wrong:
    We can be Godless and free. • “Social justice” through forced redistribution of wealth. • Silencing religious opinions counts as “diversity”. • Freedom without moral and personal responsibility. • Civilization can survive the intentional undermining of the family.

  8. #38
    Sage
    sangha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Lower Hudson Valley, NY
    Last Seen
    09-17-17 @ 05:48 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    59,990

    Re: Do You Have A Right To Buy Crap?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Blaylock View Post
    Not possible.

    At best, the test can be designed so that the average will tend to be as close as the designers of the test can get it to the median; but it will never be possible to guarantee how the data will be distributed. All it takes is enopugh excptional outliers on one side, without a corresponding weight of exceptional outliers on the other side, to skew the average away from the median.

    I recall hearing claims about the average human life expectancy at some time in the distant past being about thirty or forty years. This was probably true, but it is misleading. On would tend to take this claim to mean that a large part of the population lived until about the age of thirty or forty and then died at around that age. In fact, the average would be skewed heavily downward by a high infant mortality rate. The first year or so of one's life is the most vulnerable, and in poor conditions, many might not survive past those first few years; but if they do make it that long, they then have a good chance of living until their sixties or seventies, at least.
    You do have a point. It is probably not exactly the same. However, the test is designed to produce results that when put on a graph, the line describes a perfect bell curve. Given the #'s of people involved in taking the test, I believe they come pretty damn close. Any deviation is insignificant.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  9. #39
    Electrician
    Bob Blaylock's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    North 38°28′ West 121°26′
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 03:47 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    13,745

    Re: Do You Have A Right To Buy Crap?

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    You do have a point. It is probably not exactly the same. However, the test is designed to produce results that when put on a graph, the line describes a perfect bell curve. Given the #'s of people involved in taking the test, I believe they come pretty damn close. Any deviation is insignificant.
    That shows a serious misunderstanding of some basic principles of statistic. The bell curve isn't an artificial construct, to which statisticians try to fit their data. It's a natural phenomenon, that most natural data tend to produce, when properly analyzed. If one measures a lot of data, graphs them, and finds that the results do not appear to fit a bell curve, then one needs to take that as a sign that either one is doing something wrong, or else that there is some odd phenomenon that is causing the data to take on an unnatural distribution.


    An example of falling loose in my memory, and demanding that I use it here to illustrate the point. Ever read the book Jurassic Park? Seeing the movie doesn't count. The movie stripped too much science out in favor of entertainment.

    In the book, there's an example where they are analyzing some data pertaining to the age or size of the dinosaurs on the island, and observing how their measured data fit the bell curve. But then they realize that this represents a problem. The dinosaurs are supposedly being produced by cloning, and are supposed to be sterile—incapable of natural reproduction. Cloned dinosaurs were being produced and released in batches, and so the distribution should show peaks corresponding to the batches. That the distribution was fitting properly to a bell curve indicated that their measures to prevent it notwithstanding, the dinosaurs were, in fact, reproducing naturally, outside the control of their keepers—new dinosaurs were being created in the population all the time,by natural means, and not just when they were cloned and released.
    The five great lies of the Left Wrong:
    We can be Godless and free. • “Social justice” through forced redistribution of wealth. • Silencing religious opinions counts as “diversity”. • Freedom without moral and personal responsibility. • Civilization can survive the intentional undermining of the family.

  10. #40
    Sage
    sangha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Lower Hudson Valley, NY
    Last Seen
    09-17-17 @ 05:48 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    59,990

    Re: Do You Have A Right To Buy Crap?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Blaylock View Post
    That shows a serious misunderstanding of some basic principles of statistic. The bell curve isn't an artificial construct, to which statisticians try to fit their data. It's a natural phenomenon, that most natural data tend to produce, when properly analyzed. If one measures a lot of data, graphs them, and finds that the results do not appear to fit a bell curve, then one needs to take that as a sign that either one is doing something wrong, or else that there is some odd phenomenon that is causing the data to take on an unnatural distribution.
    I didn't say that a bell curve is an artificial construct.

    And there's nothing wrong with datasets that do not conform to a bell curve. Such non-conformance is not, in any way, a sign that the data or the process is wrong . There's nothing unnatural about it.

    Here's an example:



    However, the IQ test is designed to produce results that graph out to a bell curve based on the assumption that intelligence is distributed in a bell curve
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

Page 4 of 12 FirstFirst ... 23456 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •