View Poll Results: If you were guaranteed a $25,000 income would you quit your job and stay unemployed?

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  • Yes

    17 13.71%
  • No

    90 72.58%
  • I don't have a job

    13 10.48%
  • I don't know

    4 3.23%
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Thread: Would you quit your job?

  1. #181
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    Re: Would you quit your job?

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Changes the goalposts. It is pretty obvious from the spirit of the OP that this is a singular situation. It's either/or. Every time you add a "loophole" you change the goalposts.
    On the contrary, I would argue that the spirit of the OP is pretty clearly describing "unemployment" as it is used to access government benefits. It is no loophole, but sticking to the original language. Unlike your later claim that cohabitation would violate the OP, which was an addition.

  2. #182
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    Re: Would you quit your job?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    It seems to rather implicitly require remaining in a recognized status of unemployment as a requirement for receiving government benefit. In that way, we can assess that it is similar to current "unemployed" individuals who nonetheless do other labor for which they get money. When you help out Bob down the street by getting your cousin to pay him $150 to help him clear out a tree that fell in his yard? That's cash under-the-table employment, and Bob remains unemployed. He has no steady job. He doesn't fall out of an unemployed status for 8 hours and then fall back into it, and his benefits reflect that lack of change in status, as they are not pro-rated.
    Irrelevant. The OP is an either/or situation. You add loopholes, as money under the table is, then you change the goalposts of the OP.

    people would. Especially given that, with a very few simple steps (such as cohabitation) you can live very comfortably on such a policy. It would be socially destructive as hell, mind you, as it would likely come with a $25k marriage penalty for our poorest population, but that doesn't mean that people wouldn't take up that offer. As evidence by inverse, consider the effects of adding a job requirement in the welfare reform of the 90s - people went out and got jobs. Presumably, they could have gotten them prior to that date, and did not do so because the effort of working and loss of time at home was not worth the marginal gain in income.
    Perhaps a better and more accurate OP question, based on many of the responses, would have been "Under what conditions would you quit your job and remain unemployed if you were guaranteed a $25,000 income from the government?" This would allow all the loopholes that are being mentioned to be accounted for.
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  3. #183
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    Re: Would you quit your job?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    On the contrary, I would argue that the spirit of the OP is pretty clearly describing "unemployment" as it is used to access government benefits. It is no loophole, but sticking to the original language. Unlike your later claim that cohabitation would violate the OP, which was an addition.
    You could argue that, but you'd be wrong. ANY loophole violates the either/or description of the OP. This included cohabitation.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  4. #184
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    Re: Would you quit your job?

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Nope. Employed is employed. You make money from a job and the goalposts are changed.
    Unemployment as determined by the government to give out benefits (such as a minimum income of $25,000, annual) remains unemployment as determined by the government as pertains to access to government benefits. The goalpost remains precisely where the OP put it.

    Actually it doesn't since it changes the goalposts.
    The only goalpost that the OP outlined is A) you quit your current employment (whatever it is) B) you remain in an unemployed status and C) you get precisely $25,000. Nothing whatsoever was said about your living standards, up, down, or the same. Nothing was said about living in the same place, with the same number of people under your roof, etc. A=B=C, and that was it. No other qualifiers.

    So, how would someone make that decision? Not in a vacuum. They would assess pluses and minuses for both options. For most, and the poll demonstrates this, a major factor in the decision would be whether or not one's lifestyle would be significantly altered.
    ....Such as, for example, this. Now in reality, certainly people would make decisions.... roughly in this manner (I am not so convinced that people are that rational); however, whether or not people make this switch without effecting (or only through lowering) their standard of living was not a premise or a requirement of the question in the OP. Which makes my point that for some their standard of living would not be significantly altered or even improved both relevant according to your own reasoning and not an instance of moving the goalposts, as no goalposts were moved, but rather the process through which people might arrive at a "yes" decision was described.

    This is a reasonable variable in making this decision and one that most see could not be attained, hence the "no" vote.
    Indeed - that and pride. However:

    A. Posters on DP are hardly representative.

    B. Even if they were, 14.77% of the American populace is a little more than 45 million people. That is about 93% of the current population on food stamps.

  5. #185
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    Re: Would you quit your job?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    what I described was someone working their butt off, as he said. He forgot to add you need a truck, and plenty of gas and a cooler of water.
    $47,000 might be out of the question. The lawn care industry has brutal competition in my area.

    I know a lady with a huge yard. She hires a landscaping company to mow her grass for $30. They never come back again. Then she calls another landscaping to mow her grass for $30. They never come back again. She repeats this process for the whole mowing season. Assuming no expenses, these jerks are only making $15 an hour. That equates to $18,600 for the whole mowing season.

    Welcome to reality. Hard work doesn't always pay off. It's a nice bed time story but your kids will catch on when they grow up.




    Reality. Hello. Over here.

  6. #186
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    Re: Would you quit your job?

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    You could argue that, but you'd be wrong. ANY loophole violates the either/or description of the OP. This included cohabitation.
    No, it doesn't. The OP makes no requirement for behavior other than A) you quit your current job and B) remain in an unemployed status. Saying "well if you co-habitate, that's a loophole" is as reason-less as claiming "well, if you decide to reduce your expenses, or if you decide to order cheeseburgers instead of chicken sandwhiches, that's not covered under the OP. Of course it's not covered under the OP - the universe of potential human actions is impossible to describe, which is why the OP only limited required actions to qualify to two: quit your current job, and remain in an unemployed status. Anything else you would do is (by the laws imposed by the OP) completely up to you.

  7. #187
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    Re: Would you quit your job?

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    And I'd still like to understand the motivation of folks arguing for taking the money. Something feels suspicious about it.
    I thought it was kind of your job to figure that stuff out on your own?

  8. #188
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    Re: Would you quit your job?

    Quote Originally Posted by vasuderatorrent View Post
    $47,000 might be out of the question. The lawn care industry has brutal competition in my area.

    I know a lady with a huge yard. She hires a landscaping company to mow her grass for $30. They never come back again. Then she calls another landscaping to mow her grass for $30. They never come back again. She repeats this process for the whole mowing season. Assuming no expenses, these jerks are only making $15 an hour. That equates to $18,600 for the whole mowing season.

    I was mowing lawns back in 00-03, and a two-hour yard was going to costs you around $50-$60; and I was a kid with a truck. And your lady is hardly the typical consumer of law care services.

    Welcome to reality. Hard work doesn't always pay off. It's a nice bed time story but your kids will catch on when they grow up.

    Reality. Hello. Over here.
    sure, hard work doesn't always pay off. If you pour yourself every day into selling really, really, really well-crafted mud-pies with little smiley faces drawn in them, well, you are probably going to fail. However, as far as it is concerned, hard work is the best single cause, and the one everyone can bring to the table, for success.

  9. #189
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    Re: Would you quit your job?

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Irrelevant. The OP is an either/or situation. You add loopholes, as money under the table is, then you change the goalposts of the OP.
    No loopholes have been added. I have simply described how people can make the "yes" decision work for them better than you are describing. The goalposts of A) quit your current job and B) remain in an unemployed status remain as the only necessary qualifiers for C) get $25,000. Since the OP said nothing about a living standards or a household income requirement, cohabitation is not a "loophole" as there is nothing to avoid. Similarly, since a person doing odd jobs remains in an "unemployed" status, he continues to fulfill the requirements of the OP.

    You are working really hard here to cover for having overextended.

    Perhaps a better and more accurate OP question, based on many of the responses, would have been "Under what conditions would you quit your job and remain unemployed if you were guaranteed a $25,000 income from the government?"
    The entire universe of potential conditions is equally impossible to describe. It would change the assumption of the question from "starting where you are today" to "where could you start from", but it would be another way to describe the same phenomenon - that many people would effectively vote "yes", and take the money.

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    Re: Would you quit your job?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    I was mowing lawns back in 00-03, and a two-hour yard was going to costs you around $50-$60; and I was a kid with a truck. And your lady is hardly the typical consumer of law care services.



    sure, hard work doesn't always pay off. If you pour yourself every day into selling really, really, really well-crafted mud-pies with little smiley faces drawn in them, well, you are probably going to fail. However, as far as it is concerned, hard work is the best single cause, and the one everyone can bring to the table, for success.
    I once made $27,000 a year working in an air conditioned office with free donuts every day and BBQ dinners on most Fridays. It was much easier than mowing grass.

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