View Poll Results: Do you think there is a correlation between teacher pay and quality of education?

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Thread: Do you think there is a correlation between teacher pay and quality of education?

  1. #151
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    Re: Do you think there is a correlation between teacher pay and quality of education?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    When it comes to children of poverty, i think it is more than 10% the teacher, but even if that's so, that's 3 students out of the normal class of 30 every year. That's a lot of productive citizens who won't be collecting welfare or burning up the tax money sitting in prison.

    But, you do have a point: They can't do it just for the money. It has to be a calling, something beyond just pay.

    Which is not to say that they shouldn't be paid more than they are, as they are contributing far more than they are costing.
    A lot of them, I don't think are. I'd be entirely fine if teachers all made the same amount of money and, either on a quarterly or once a semester term, they were eligible for raises or bonuses based on the demonstrable improvement in their classroom. I'd love to see students required to take a standardized exam at the end of every single year of school, those scores become the starting place for the next teacher and on some interval, they get a bonus (quarter or semester) or a raise (annual) for beating some objective standard. If they don't make it, they don't get the money. We just need to make sure that the teacher is actually teaching and the kids are actually learning, the teacher or the school isn't just gaming the system.
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    Re: Do you think there is a correlation between teacher pay and quality of education?

    The better colleges pay their instructors more and get better results. There is no reason to think that the same wouldn't happen with public K-12 schools if handled correctly. Many people opt out of teaching because they can get better pay (and working conditions) elsewhere. Higher pay will generate more candidates for teaching positions, allowing schools the ability to choose only the better ones.

  3. #153
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    Re: Do you think there is a correlation between teacher pay and quality of education?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard Truth View Post
    The better colleges pay their instructors more and get better results. There is no reason to think that the same wouldn't happen with public K-12 schools if handled correctly. Many people opt out of teaching because they can get better pay (and working conditions) elsewhere. Higher pay will generate more candidates for teaching positions, allowing schools the ability to choose only the better ones.
    Just to point out, there is a fundamental difference between K-12 Public Education and College Education. That is 100% of the students, from a government standpoint, are there voluntarily. There is no law that requires student attendance at colleges. And if a student has disciplinary problems or does not perform academically, they can be booted.



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  4. #154
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    Re: Do you think there is a correlation between teacher pay and quality of education?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gipper View Post
    No, I'm not saying that 10% of children will get "touched". I'm saying that if the child succeeds, the teacher should get about 10% of the credit, whereas the child itself should get 90%.
    I agree with the sentiment. I would go further, however, and say you can't even quantify such a thing.
    Michael J Petrilli-"Is School Choice Enough?"-A response to the recent timidity of American conservatives toward education reform. https://nationalaffairs.com/publicat...-choice-enough

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    Re: Do you think there is a correlation between teacher pay and quality of education?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    I agree with the sentiment. I would go further, however, and say you can't even quantify such a thing.
    Well yeah, there's no formula for this type of thing. I just wanted to portray that a child succeeding is about the child and not about the teacher, who is just doing his or her job. It's just something you "have" to say, like a Grammy winner thanking God, or a Super Bowl winning quarterback thanking his coach after throwing 6 touchdowns.

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    Re: Do you think there is a correlation between teacher pay and quality of education?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    A lot of them, I don't think are. I'd be entirely fine if teachers all made the same amount of money and, either on a quarterly or once a semester term, they were eligible for raises or bonuses based on the demonstrable improvement in their classroom. I'd love to see students required to take a standardized exam at the end of every single year of school, those scores become the starting place for the next teacher and on some interval, they get a bonus (quarter or semester) or a raise (annual) for beating some objective standard. If they don't make it, they don't get the money. We just need to make sure that the teacher is actually teaching and the kids are actually learning, the teacher or the school isn't just gaming the system.
    Part of the problem is the questionable nature of relying on standardized exams. I'm not speaking on a "we don't want to be measured and lose our job security" platform, but more of a skepticism in being able to demonstrably improve the quality of education through these measurements. We don't even know if we're looking at the right things or testing the students the right way. On one hand, if we do what some of the Dewyians want, we will have no real systematized knowledge base for judging our educational system. On the other hand, there's a dramatic limitation to using outcome-based assessment via state tests for pay. We're barely getting it right on basic statistics for life outcomes (not being able to reliably measure much else other than employment or educational attainment). As a result, we have almost no God damned idea how to proceed with what limited information we actually have. We're not quite there yet.
    Michael J Petrilli-"Is School Choice Enough?"-A response to the recent timidity of American conservatives toward education reform. https://nationalaffairs.com/publicat...-choice-enough

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    Re: Do you think there is a correlation between teacher pay and quality of education?

    Quote Originally Posted by ChezC3 View Post
    and when it is self serving, when will those statistics be manipulated? and the determination of progress? Standardized testing? No, I don't think so. The number one problem I see in the education of our youth today is this standardized, homogenized one size fits all pedagogy which is what precisely is the matter with our education system. We don't educate our children, we indoctrinate them. This is truth, we teach them to perform functions, that's all. Those that pass beyond that, they aren't some magical outlier, destined for greatness, the next turn of the evolutionary wheel -- No! They are simply those who happen to be receptive to the current pedagogical construct. The construct which allows for some over-achievement yes, but by far it creates class after class of mediocrity. I will concede that there are some very successful individuals who in spite of themselves --educationally speaking-- have achieved marvelous success, but again, by and large, the education system in America churns out unremarkable graduates bound for fulfilling humdrum tasks.
    and that has to do with my orginal post how?

  8. #158
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    Re: Do you think there is a correlation between teacher pay and quality of education?

    There are two things that hinder teachers and public education the most...

    1) Restriction placed on what teachers are allowed to do, and

    2) Directing resources away from gifted and above-average students to spend on below-average and underachieving students. Nothing screams average like artificially hindering those who can excel.
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    Re: Do you think there is a correlation between teacher pay and quality of education?

    I teach on the college level, but I know many teachers in the elementary and high school level. I am not sure this is right. How did you come up with these two hindrances?
    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    There are two things that hinder teachers and public education the most...

    1) Restriction placed on what teachers are allowed to do, and

    2) Directing resources away from gifted and above-average students to spend on below-average and underachieving students. Nothing screams average like artificially hindering those who can excel.
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    Re: Do you think there is a correlation between teacher pay and quality of education?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocketman View Post
    and that has to do with my orginal post how?
    My point exactly...

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