View Poll Results: Is requiring voter photo ID a type of disenfranchisement?

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98. You may not vote on this poll
  • YES!

    20 20.41%
  • NO!

    52 53.06%
  • It can be!

    24 24.49%
  • Other. Please explain.

    2 2.04%
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Thread: Is requiring voter photo ID a type of disenfranchisement?

  1. #61
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    Re: Is requiring voter photo ID a type of disenfranchisement?

    Quote Originally Posted by iacardsfan View Post
    These laws just so happen to appear right after VRA is stuck down. Interesting.
    Actually, some, perhaps even most where introduced before VRA was struck down.
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    Re: Is requiring voter photo ID a type of disenfranchisement?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyrylek View Post
    Every single voter ID proposal includes free-of-charge issuance of the IDs. Otherwise, it would constitute a poll tax. Unconstitutional.
    That's nonsense. An ID ought to be a part of everyday life. It should be required for anything official. It's not a poll tax, it's a basic necessity of life and an expectation that every adult must have, without exception. Those without one ought to be breaking the law and should be ticketed, just like you are if you're caught driving without a license.
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    Re: Is requiring voter photo ID a type of disenfranchisement?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    The variety of "minimal" is pretty wide throughout the United States; from as little as $3 to about $50 or so.
    That is a minimal cost for something that you only have to do once in your entire life, unless you happen to lose it, then it's your responsibility to replace it.
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    Re: Is requiring voter photo ID a type of disenfranchisement?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    No, it's not. And you don't have the right to make it one.
    Why the hell not? Society has the right to make anything a requirement.
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  5. #65
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    Re: Is requiring voter photo ID a type of disenfranchisement?

    Oh no. I am an American citizen and have every right to move around my country without my papers. If I move up on a moutain have have no contact with civilization until time to vote, and I come down from the moutain, I have every right to vote anyone else does. It is that simple. I should then be allowed to vote. If I was really not an American citizen then the authorities should come up the mountain and arrest me and throw me in jail for the max. As a practicle matter I can see almost everyone having ID. but hte default position is allowing people to vote.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    That's nonsense. An ID ought to be a part of everyday life. It should be required for anything official. It's not a poll tax, it's a basic necessity of life and an expectation that every adult must have, without exception. Those without one ought to be breaking the law and should be ticketed, just like you are if you're caught driving without a license.
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    Re: Is requiring voter photo ID a type of disenfranchisement?

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    I'm curious to know how many people don't have a valid photo identification. How does one open a bank account without a valid I.D.? It can't be done. Cash a check at a currency exchange? At a bank? It can't be done. Sign up for welfare? God!! I hope! it can't be done. Buy a house? Can't be done. Open a charge account? Can't be done. Sign up for Social Security? Can't be done.

    Who are these people who don't have photo identification? And how are they living their lives?
    I don't believe people without IDs are significant in number but in 2000 selection of the leader of the free world came down to 500 votes out of tens of millions of votes cast.

    How do people open banks accounts without ID? Easy. They open the account when they had a valid ID then because of the 500% increase in the renewal fee and extra documentation they'd have to hunt down and/or order they simply let it expire. Of course they cannot open NEW accounts but they already have one that works fine. How do they buy a house or rent? Same thing. How do they sign up for SS? Same thing, they're already signed up back before it expired. How do they cash a check at a currency exchange? They don't; they have direct deposit or they sign it over to a friend or relative who has an account who gives them the cash after it clears. This is just their younger sister who struggles to make ends meet, not the whole family. Then, to get her license reinstated, because she let it expire and its been a while she not only has the extra hassle of the Real ID requirements, she has to take the written and road tests over again and decides not to bother.

    Again, not a huge number, just enough to skim off a few votes here and there that cumulatively might might a difference in a close race in a swing state.

    To me the fact that its not likely to affect many people isn't the issue. What bothers me is mindset of the government leaders who tried it who likely had access to data showing the federal Real ID requirements were leading to a reduced number of licensed drivers in urban areas with adequate public transportation systems. That coupled with reducing early the voting schedule that "coincidentally" eliminated days they knew minorities voted in large percentages in the past. Add to that reducing early voting hours in neighborhoods where minorities live but leaving them opened longer in mostly non-minority neighborhoods IN THE SAME STATE. This after the sworn testimony from the top GOP official in Florida who stated UNDER OATH party officials held strategy meeting on how to legally reduce minority voting. Obviously it didn't work. In fact it backfired in their faces as minorities around the country camped out in parking lots the night before early voting began, stood in line till midnight on election day and probably turned off not just minorities but Americans of all races for many elections to come that this is what the party of family values calls standing up for principle and doing the right thing. I'm not focused on how many if any were affected. I'm focused on do I want to put my support behind a party that would pull such a stunt despite its utter failure.
    Last edited by Smeagol; 10-25-13 at 05:06 PM.
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  7. #67
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    Re: Is requiring voter photo ID a type of disenfranchisement?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    Why the hell not? Society has the right to make anything a requirement.
    Okay, how about we make orthodox Judaism a requirement? Oh wait, the constitution doesn't allow that. Just like it doesn't allow having to pay money in order to vote. You want everyone to have ID, you make sure it's easily accessible. Besides, plenty of these ID laws aren't just about people who are too poor to need or use ID. Or the plenty of seniors who let their IDs expire and have no need to get new ones. It's also about students. Lots of college students, who don't drive, and are supported by their families, scholarships, or loans (which again go through their families), are being preventing from voting in the states where they reside, where they go to school.

    Gee, who do poor people, the elderly, and students tend to vote for...
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    Re: Is requiring voter photo ID a type of disenfranchisement?

    Quote Originally Posted by mak2 View Post
    Oh no. I am an American citizen and have every right to move around my country without my papers. If I move up on a moutain have have no contact with civilization until time to vote, and I come down from the moutain, I have every right to vote anyone else does. It is that simple. I should then be allowed to vote. If I was really not an American citizen then the authorities should come up the mountain and arrest me and throw me in jail for the max. As a practicle matter I can see almost everyone having ID. but hte default position is allowing people to vote.
    This isn't about papers, it's about a requirement that you identify yourself should you do something wrong. If you want to live on your mountain, go ahead, so long as you have your identification. How would anyone know you were not a citizen if you were not required to prove it? Your right to vote is predicated on your citizenship. Prove you're a citizen.
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    Re: Is requiring voter photo ID a type of disenfranchisement?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    Okay, how about we make orthodox Judaism a requirement? Oh wait, the constitution doesn't allow that. Just like it doesn't allow having to pay money in order to vote. You want everyone to have ID, you make sure it's easily accessible. Besides, plenty of these ID laws aren't just about people who are too poor to need or use ID. Or the plenty of seniors who let their IDs expire and have no need to get new ones. It's also about students. Lots of college students, who don't drive, and are supported by their families, scholarships, or loans (which again go through their families), are being preventing from voting in the states where they reside, where they go to school.

    Gee, who do poor people, the elderly, and students tend to vote for...
    If society decided to do that, they could. Granted, they'd have to change the Constitution dramatically, but they could make any requirement they wanted. And yes, they can change the Constitution if they want to do that too. That's where I'm saying there ought to ALWAYS be a need to get an ID and renew an ID, whether people want to or not. If it was a general requirement for 100% of all citizens in the country over the age of 18 (or for anyone who drives), then it wouldn't be an issue for anyone.
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    Re: Is requiring voter photo ID a type of disenfranchisement?

    I go out and jog at lunch all the time in shorts, socks, shoes, a shirt, and no papers. If a police officer contacts me in the performance of his duties I do have a responsiblity to identify myself. As long as I do honestly, no problem. If I lie I can be leagally charged with false ID or some such charge. the same should be true with voting. As a rule I always have ID, but there are exceptions. Same should be true with voters.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    This isn't about papers, it's about a requirement that you identify yourself should you do something wrong. If you want to live on your mountain, go ahead, so long as you have your identification. How would anyone know you were not a citizen if you were not required to prove it? Your right to vote is predicated on your citizenship. Prove you're a citizen.
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