View Poll Results: If there was a national vote on equal rights for gays what would you do?

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  • Vote Yes - granting equal rights and the right to legal marriage

    133 76.00%
  • Vote No - denying equal rights and banning them from getting legal marriage

    24 13.71%
  • No vote - you simply dont vote at all

    18 10.29%
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Thread: If there was a National Vote on Equal rights for gays, what would you do [W:72,96,331

  1. #531
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    Re: If there was a National Vote on Equal rights for gays, what would you do. [W:72]

    Quote Originally Posted by DA60 View Post
    And who would protect these contracts? The same people that protect any personal contracts between two or more people...civil court.
    You make a contract, set the terms and sign it. If one or both parties violate the contract, take them to civil court.
    Absolutely would not trust this to result in equal enforcement of rights for everyone. First, those 1000 rights would go down the toilet once the govt got out of marriage, only some of which a civil court would manage to reinstate by simple contract. This would also create an impractical burden on the courts as you'd have probably millions of new lawsuits over things that are currently routine.

  2. #532
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    Re: If there was a National Vote on Equal rights for gays, what would you do. [W:72]

    Quote Originally Posted by Jesse Booth View Post
    At least we wouldn't have to listen to the gay marriage debate any more?
    Oh yeah, poor you. You wouldn't have to if it would just become legal either, think of that?

  3. #533
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    Re: If there was a National Vote on Equal rights for gays, what would you do. [W:72]

    Quote Originally Posted by chromium View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Jesse Booth
    At least we wouldn't have to listen to the gay marriage debate any more?
    Oh yeah, poor you. You wouldn't have to if it would just become legal either, think of that?
    There's this fancy new invention called a "joke." I was just debuting one so that people like you might hear about it, along with the other revolutionalry concepts of "bullsh*t apologies" and "sarcasm." My bad. I'll definitely make this mistake again, regardless of your dry, flavorless personality.
    Quote Originally Posted by truthatallcost View Post
    Pepe Booth strikes again.

  4. #534
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    Re: If there was a National Vote on Equal rights for gays, what would you do. [W:72]

    Quote Originally Posted by BrianBoroihme View Post
    How is there going to be a national vote? There is no such thing.

    I think that the government has NO business in marriage. Period. Straight, gay.

    For MY religion, marriage is a covenant between a man, a woman, and God.

    Since "Congress shall make no law..." it seems to me that it is a clear violation of the separation. Anyway, I do think that society has an interest in regulating contracts and everyone, should they decide could get a marriage license for that purpose. But you should be able to marry in a church without one. No government is mentioned as a ratifier of marriage in my religion.
    Your religion does not own marriage. In fact, since no religion owns marriage then it is not a violation in any way for the government to use the word marriage to set up family relationships, spouses and inlaws. You are completely free to get just a religious marriage if you wish, but that does not mean that others should be prevented from getting a civil marriage.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  5. #535
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    Re: If there was a National Vote on Equal rights for gays, what would you do. [W:72]

    Quote Originally Posted by DA60 View Post
    Oh Jeez...null and void ONLY as far as the government is concerned.

    That does not mean people cannot get married...it just means marriage no longer has any meaning to the government. Everyone would be legally single.

    People are still free to get married and make any contractual arrangements they want within that marriage.

    You would be able to designate another person (any person) of your choice as your partner for matters of government, military, insurance, next-of-kin...etcetera.
    But you would not have to marry them, just designate them.
    And you could undesignate them any time you wish...like designating a beneficiary in a will or for life insurance.

    So, I will ask again, EXACTLY which Constitutional right is being violated by this?


    And, to 3)...their marriage 'contract' is strictly that...contractual. It is only legal in a contractual way (like a rent agreement or a employment contract). A personal agreement between two parties.
    Family relationships have meaning to the government, and spouses that are established via marriage are family relationships. So yes, marriage is needed for this.

    Marriage licenses are the most efficient contract in the US government. One single piece of paper takes care of thousands of things for most people. And since everyone would have to file their paperwork that designates their spouse with the government anyway, then it is stupid to replace the marriage license with spousal designation forms that cover less.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  6. #536
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    Re: If there was a National Vote on Equal rights for gays, what would you do. [W:72]

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    thats what i thought, facts win again

    YOUR posts are the only ones not answering questions lol

    let us know when you can post answers and let us know when you post support for your strawman.

    already answered you, you have no right to violate their legal contract, ZERO, NONE. If you disagree simply tell us why you can.
    Until you can do his you have nothing.
    can I say your will is void just cause i dont like it? why not?
    cause it violates rights you have no legality to discriminate against them based on your feelings

    your posts can keep dodging this fact but nobody honest and educated will buy it.

    again if you disagree simply teach me a lesson. Prove my statements wrong. Simply point out why you have the right to void their legal contracts and violate their rights.
    For the record, you are now on my ignore list.

    Your ideas maybe decent (more freedom), but your approach to 'non-believers' is troll-like.

    You use personal attacks, muddy the waters and refuse to answer direct questions.

    You are a complete waste of time to 'debate' with, IMO (and I have tried several times with you).

    I would have PM'd you this...but your box is full.


    Good day.

  7. #537
    I'm kind of a big deal

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    Re: If there was a National Vote on Equal rights for gays, what would you do. [W:72]

    Quote Originally Posted by DA60 View Post
    1.)For the record, you are now on my ignore list.
    2.)Your ideas maybe decent (more freedom), but your approach to 'non-believers' is troll-like.
    3.)You use personal attacks, muddy the waters and refuse to answer direct questions.
    4.)You are a complete waste of time to 'debate' with, IMO (and I have tried several times with you).

    I would have PM'd you this...but your box is full.


    5.)Good day.
    1.) meaningless to your failed suggestion and the fact that it will violate more rights
    2.) this deflection also doesnt change anything, also what is a nonbeliever lol
    3.) posting lies like this wont help your failed arguments please stay on topic, i posted ZERO person attacks to you
    4.) you are going to have this issue often when your arguments fail and facts prove them wrong. The solution is easy though, simply dont argue against fact and be able to support your posts

    when you can support your failed arguments please let us know whe'd love to hear why your idea of further infringing on rights is the better move and why its acceptable

    5.) its a great day thank you
    This space is currently owned by The Great Winchester, stay tuned for future messages!
    Make America Great Again!
    Pro-Equal Rights / Pro-Gun Rights / Pro-Human Rights / Pro-Choice

  8. #538
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    Re: If there was a National Vote on Equal rights for gays, what would you do. [W:72]

    The only flaw in a national referendum is that amendment cannot be made for possible loopholes in the text. Provided that the initiative being voted on is worded correctly and does not allow for loopholes, I would vote for the initiative; assuming there is a hypothetical national initiative for this referendum to take place, I would also have petitioned for the initiative to get on the ballot. However, if the initiative was worded poorly, I would have to vote in the negative.

    There are numerous reasons backing the argument for legal gay marriage, the most convincing being that firstly, we have a separation of church and state, meaning that religious beliefs should not be imposed on all people by the government. That includes the religious belief that gays are inferior to others and don't deserve legal marriage. The other is non-discrimination, and the government does not have the right to treat certain citizens as inferior to others.

    This referendum does not just address marriage, however. It also mentions equal rights, which I assume refers to non-discrimination in the workplace, evictions, and being served at a business, among other things. The same basic principles apply here as to marriage. This issue is remarkably similar to the civil rights movement, and arguing for businesses to have the right to discriminate is very analogous to the argument presented by those against civil rights in the 1960's.

    I also hope transgender rights were addressed in the hypothetical referendum, although by the looks of the OP, that doesn't seemed to be addressed by the OP.

  9. #539
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    Re: If there was a National Vote on Equal rights for gays, what would you do. [W:72]

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Would you do the same for other family relationships as well? Basically completely destroy any family relationships leaving the government to gain pretty much any and all property that the people hold when they fail to write a will? There are plenty more things that eliminating marriage in this country would do than just make everyone legally single. Marriage has existed for thousands of years as a contract of kinship (mainly). Not recognizing marriage does absolutely nothing positive for this country.
    How would it destroy family relationships if the 'govt.' didnt recognize them?
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have felt pain when I was in the womb. So when you say they are incapable of feeling pain, that is based on junk science.
    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

  10. #540
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    Re: If there was a National Vote on Equal rights for gays, what would you do. [W:72]

    Quote Originally Posted by WorldWatcher View Post
    So, all states have what are called "assumed parentage laws" meaning that the spouse in a legel marriage is automatically the legal parent of a child born in that marriage. Father's would not have to adopt their own children?

    While I see no need for govt recognized & subsidized marriage, one reason I support it is because it does provide protection for children.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have felt pain when I was in the womb. So when you say they are incapable of feeling pain, that is based on junk science.
    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

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