View Poll Results: Should Obamacare be eliminated?

Voters
83. You may not vote on this poll
  • No, Obamacare is great and more important than everything else combined

    10 12.05%
  • Yes, dump the lemon before it causes more suffering.

    38 45.78%
  • No, but it needs MAJOR serious changes.

    7 8.43%
  • Yes, replace it with real universal health care.

    28 33.73%
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Thread: Do you support Obamacare?

  1. #31
    Professor

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    Re: Do you support ObamaCare?

    As of now 13 for liberty, 2 honest libs, 5 socialists, and 2 that drink the kool aid.

  2. #32
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    Re: Do you support ObamaCare?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    Guess what! It would have sky rocketed anyway!
    Not like it did this year. This year was more than the last 10 years COMBINED

  3. #33
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    Re: Do you support ObamaCare?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocketman View Post
    Not like it did this year. This year was more than the last 10 years COMBINED
    There is a famous story about sex and money that I have heard in myriad variations. A man asks a woman if she would be willing to sleep with him if he pays her an exorbitant sum. She replies affirmatively. He then names a paltry amount and asks if she would still be willing to sleep with him for the revised fee. The woman is greatly offended and replies as follows:

    She: What kind of woman do you think I am?

    He: We’ve already established that. Now we’re just haggling over the price.

    (http://quoteinvestigator.com/2012/03/07/haggling/)

  4. #34
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    Re: Do you support ObamaCare?

    Certainly DO NOT eliminate it...Americans didn't know how much they liked alcohol until prohibition...but they found out...the same revelation will occur over MEDICAL care.
    "The fact that we are here today to debate raising America's debt limit is a sign of leadership failure" - 2006 Senator Obama...leadership failure indeed!

  5. #35
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Do you support ObamaCare?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    There is a famous story about sex and money that I have heard in myriad variations. A man asks a woman if she would be willing to sleep with him if he pays her an exorbitant sum. She replies affirmatively. He then names a paltry amount and asks if she would still be willing to sleep with him for the revised fee. The woman is greatly offended and replies as follows:

    She: What kind of woman do you think I am?

    He: We’ve already established that. Now we’re just haggling over the price.

    (Now We’re Just Haggling Over the Price | Quote Investigator)
    so Obama is a whore or a mere pimp?



  6. #36
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    Re: Do you support ObamaCare?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    so Obama is a whore or a mere pimp?
    I don't know, but in any case we're certainly the Johns. It's just a matter of what price we're paying and what we're getting for it. The status quo and the ACA guarantee that the price of health care will rise faster than inflation regardless. Bickering over the rising cost of the ACA vs. the status quo is sort of beside the point.

  7. #37
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    Re: Do you support ObamaCare?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    so Obama is a whore or a mere pimp?
    You're the john. Have it your way!
    "I did not mean that Conservatives are generally stupid people. I meant that stupid people are generally Conservatives."
    -John Stuart Mill-

  8. #38
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    Re: Do you support Obamacare?

    No one responds to my plan for universal healthcare because most elements are opposed by both political parties. But here are a few elements of it:

    1. Eliminate the unique protection to the drug industry which has both exemption from anti-trust laws AND patent protection. For this reason, they can literally extort any price they want with people's very lives - selling a nickel pill for $50 each. BOTH political parties are 100% kiss-ass to the drug industry and both are on-the-take. This costs consumers and the government $10s of billions - or more - each year - but is highly profitable to incumbents's fund raising.

    2. End the doctors' monopoly.
    It is exorbitantly difficult and costly for anyone to become a doctor. BUT there is no need for every doctor to be a jack-of-all-trades. Rather, medical professionals, doctors and otherwise, should only be required to be trained, certified and licensed in their specific field. This would not only radically reduce the costs and time it takes to become a medical professional, but make them more expertise in their specific field.

    3. Subsize medical educations: Doctors, technicians, nurses, other medical professionals.
    The government should subsize (pay for) medical educations for those who can't afford it, in return for a contract for employment for a certain number of years - relevant to the cost of the education - as a medical professional for the military or in ER and government charity (call it what it is) medical facilities and clinics - at military pay grade whether in military or civilian service. This and #2 above would quickly and dramatically make more doctors and medical professionals - specialists in their fields - available. And accordingly both reduce costs and increase skill/efficiency/expertise.

    4. For "free" healthcare, the government would organize such healthcare to specialized locations of such specialized equipment and medical professionals. The best heart surgeon is one who does the same surgery over and over and over. In short, assembly line medical care. A person who needs heart surgery would be transported to a facility specifically for such surgery. The same for viruses, trauma injury, Alzheimers, stroke, pediatrics, etc etc.

    Assembly lines are inherently more efficient and produce a better result too. Facilities specially for the many known areas of medical care needed by hundreds of thousands or millions - diabetes, cancer, heart, dementia, pediatrics etc - would be superior in medical care and at a fraction of the costs. In fact, assembly line cars are not only a fraction that of hand built cars, but are more reliable than hand built cars. The same applies to medical care. Such specialized facilities would inherently have the most experienced and trained in the field of medical care it provides.

    Highly specific specialized central locations that address the same medical conditions in an assembly line method would cost a fraction as much, would prove more consistent and reliable healthcare and treatment, and overall be more efficient.

    Just those 4 would radically reduce medical costs for the indigent (and everyone), dramatically improve the quality of healthcare, and dramatically increase facilities and the number of medical professionals. It also means our military personnel would finally get truly good medical care too.

    Why would anyone then get insurance? With insurance you get to pick your doctor, your location, you maybe don't have to wait in line for non-life threatening conditions and YOU have the choice. If the government is paying it? Then the government also controls it for the reason of efficiency and costs. If you don't have insurance or money and are having a heart attack, maybe you don't want to go to the government run or supervised medical facility that specializes in heart attacks - but oh well too bad. The government would provide quality, skilled medical care. However, if you want something else, you (or your insurance) pays for it. "Beggars can't be choosey."

    Regardless, the medical care would be vastly better than now for indigents, as now the hospitals increasingly find excuses to give the person a bandaid and send them on their way - and Obamacare doesn't change that one iota, but rather encourages doing it more.

    How to pay for it for indigent care? Income tax, ie general revenue.

    BUT both political parties are lackeys for the drug industry, the AMA and the insurance industry.

    So, instead, we got all this Obamacare absurd crapola that has put millions into part-time employment, millions losing employment insurance, dramatic increases in insurance premiums, no more healthcare whatsoever if not less, a huge concession to corporations allowing them to DROP insuring their employees' insurance, and the insurance industry taking a big cut of all of it, plus an army of IRS agents, bureaucrats and political partisan chaos

    - along with then some strange feel-good claims such as really parents should be responsible for their kids until 26, I should pay premiums for people who destroyed their health by substance abuse via insurance premiums, convincing people they are getting something for nothing out of it, incentives to not work and lower your income, and trivia such as language about readable insurance contracts.
    Last edited by joko104; 10-15-13 at 11:37 PM.

  9. #39
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    Re: Do you support ObamaCare?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    There is a famous story about sex and money that I have heard in myriad variations. A man asks a woman if she would be willing to sleep with him if he pays her an exorbitant sum. She replies affirmatively. He then names a paltry amount and asks if she would still be willing to sleep with him for the revised fee. The woman is greatly offended and replies as follows:

    She: What kind of woman do you think I am?

    He: We’ve already established that. Now we’re just haggling over the price.

    (Now We’re Just Haggling Over the Price | Quote Investigator)
    I like this that one but I also like this one:

    A cowboy who is also a ventriloquist rides up on an indian sheep herder on the plains, says hello and ask to join the indian. The indiain says "sit down" and offers him some coffee.

    The cowboy ask "mind if I talk to your horse"? the indian rolls his eyes and says "go ahead"

    The cowboy ask the horse: "How does this man treat you"? The horse replies "man he is great, feeds me grain, makes sure I have plenty of water and after riding me all day he brushes me down and makes sure I'm comfortable"

    The cowboy says " Wow thats great and smiles at the indiam" "Mind if I talk to your dog"? Indian shrugs and cowboy ask the dog: "how are your treated?" The dog replies "man my owner is great, he gives me bones, lets me sleep by the fire, and rubs my shoulders after a long day of herding sheep"

    The cowboy replies " wow thats great!" He looks at the indian and says, "mind if I talk to your sheep?" The indian shouts:

    SHEEP LIE!

  10. #40
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Do you support ObamaCare?

    Quote Originally Posted by Grand Mal View Post
    You're the john. Have it your way!
    I don't have to buy into Obamacare. your comment is idiotic



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