View Poll Results: Who's Fault is this Shutdown? Defined by where you get your information.

Voters
24. You may not vote on this poll
  • I mostly watch Fox and its all Obamas fault

    2 8.33%
  • I mostly watch Fox and its all Dems Fault

    3 12.50%
  • I mostly watch Fox and its all GOP and/or Tea Party Fault

    1 4.17%
  • I mostly watch other than Fox and its all Obamas fault

    3 12.50%
  • I mostly watch other than Fox and its all Dems Fault

    6 25.00%
  • I mostly watch other than Fox and its all GOP and/or Tea Party fault

    14 58.33%
  • I mostly watch more conservative outlets than Fox, and its Obamas Fault.

    3 12.50%
  • I mostly watch more conservative outlets than Fox, and its GOP and/or Tea Party fault.

    0 0%
  • I mostly watch MSNBC and its Obamas fault.

    2 8.33%
  • I mostly watch MSNBC and its GOP and/or Tea Party fault.

    3 12.50%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Thread: Who's fault is this shutdown? Defined by where you get your information.

  1. #11
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    Re: Who's fault is this shutdown? Defined by where you get your information.

    Ok, some new manual options below. I think for the sake of this poll, we should consider mainstream anything owned by a corporation that has ties to anything outside the news media or gets its funding mostly from advertising dollars.

    11. I don't watch any of them and get news from the mainstream (internet, magazines, newspapers) , but identify as liberal: And I think ______ is mostly at fault.
    12. I don't watch any of them and get news from the mainstream (internet, magazines, newspapers) , but identify as conservative: And I think ______ is mostly at fault.
    13. I don't watch any of them and get news from the mainstream (internet, magazines, newspapers) , but identify as moderate/independent: And I think ______ is mostly at fault.
    14. I don't watch any of them and get news not considered mainstream (internet, magazines, newspapers) , but identify as liberal: And I think ______ is mostly at fault.
    15. I don't watch any of them and get news not considered mainstream (internet, magazines, newspapers) , but identify as conservative: And I think ______ is mostly at fault.
    16. I don't watch any of them and get news not considered mainstream (internet, magazines, newspapers) , but identify as moderate/independent: And I think ______ is mostly at fault.

  2. #12
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    Re: Who's fault is this shutdown? Defined by where you get your information.

    Quote Originally Posted by KevinKohler View Post
    The answer is clear....we are. Who are these peoples bosses?
    I think that was true when this country was founded. I think it has been unravelling ever since the start of our two party politics system that was started from Jefferson and Adams (Federalists vs Democrat-Republicans), but was kept somewhat in check by an independent news system until the past 20 years or so. Once corporations started buying out newspapers and magazines, and then the move from reading to fast food news by theatrics, posturing, and catch phrases, then our power has vaporized collectively. We are no longer their bosses. The corporations and wealthy donors are.

    We can be as educated as we can and spend all our time truth seeking through the piles of garbage partisan news, but we are only as powerful as what the majority thinks. If the majority is more interested in their local football team or who Britney Spears is dating, and only watches the corporate mainstream media for their drive-by facts, then we will be powerless against them without a voice to speak with the masses. Unfortunately, it takes millions of dollars to reach them...and who has that again?

    Collectively, I would suppose we could be to blame. But I would argue it a symptom of apathy and living paycheck to paycheck, us collectively being too busy to pay attention or look deeper than what is shoved in our face. Are we to blame by believing the billions of $$ of advertising, slick presentations, and complex concoctions of cherry picked facts and outright lies of the media outlets? Or are they to blame by using their money to turn us into marrionettes, and they the ventriloquists. Which came first, egg or chicken.... I am not sure.
    Last edited by Freemind USMC; 10-09-13 at 06:03 PM.

  3. #13
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    Re: Who's fault is this shutdown? Defined by where you get your information.

    The construction of the Federal government and the role of Congress is my source form stating the FACT that it is Republicans responsible for not funding Obamacare and the Democrats fault for shutting down every other aspect of government since the Republicans offered to do so. It has nothing to do with new sources. Just obvious fact.

  4. #14
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    Re: Who's fault is this shutdown? Defined by where you get your information.

    I couldn't really vote on the poll since none of the options matched how I feel.

    I get most of my news from Google News, so it comes from a variety of sources. I don't really watch TV for news.

    I blame everyone to some extent, though I think the Republicans and the tea party deserve a larger share of the blame on the government shutdown issue. It's an even split on the debt ceiling.
    If you build a man a fire, he'll be warm for a day.

    If you set a man on fire, he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

  5. #15
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    Re: Who's fault is this shutdown? Defined by where you get your information.

    Quote Originally Posted by molten_dragon View Post
    I couldn't really vote on the poll since none of the options matched how I feel.

    I get most of my news from Google News, so it comes from a variety of sources. I don't really watch TV for news.

    I blame everyone to some extent, though I think the Republicans and the tea party deserve a larger share of the blame on the government shutdown issue. It's an even split on the debt ceiling.
    That's why I said "other that Fox and blame democrats."

  6. #16
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    Re: Who's fault is this shutdown? Defined by where you get your information.

    Quote Originally Posted by Freemind USMC View Post
    How about a poll that considers your background and potential bias? You have to first quantify where someone gets their information before you ask them how they feel about something. If you dont watch pundits and TV media news, and prefer to READ (wait, whats that?) instead of getting your fast food news and politics from the TV takeout window, please post as well.

    (Multiple choice is allowed. Comment with write in in a reply if I missed you in the options. )

    1. I mostly watch Fox and its all Obamas fault
    2. I mostly watch Fox and its all Dems Fault
    3. I mostly watch Fox and its all GOP and/or Tea Party Fault
    4. I mostly watch other than Fox and its all Obamas fault
    5. I mostly watch other than Fox and its all Dems Fault
    6. I mostly watch other than Fox and its all GOP and/or Tea Party fault
    7. I mostly watch more conservative outlets than Fox, and its Obamas Fault.
    8. I mostly watch more conservative outlets than Fox, and its GOP and/or Tea Party fault.
    9. I mostly watch MSNBC and its Obamas fault.
    10. I mostly watch MSNBC and its GOP and/or Tea Party fault.
    I watch mostly fox news,regular news and some MSNBC. I find both parties at fault. They both have their sacred cows that they do not want to give up on and that is what is fueling the government shutdown. Its idiotic to put the blame only on one party.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

  7. #17
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    Re: Who's fault is this shutdown? Defined by where you get your information.

    Quote Originally Posted by Freemind USMC View Post
    I think that was true when this country was founded. I think it has been unravelling ever since the start of our two party politics system that was started from Jefferson and Adams (Federalists vs Democrat-Republicans), but was kept somewhat in check by an independent news system until the past 20 years or so. Once corporations started buying out newspapers and magazines, and then the move from reading to fast food news by theatrics, posturing, and catch phrases, then our power has vaporized collectively. We are no longer their bosses. The corporations and wealthy donors are.

    We can be as educated as we can and spend all our time truth seeking through the piles of garbage partisan news, but we are only as powerful as what the majority thinks. If the majority is more interested in their local football team or who Britney Spears is dating, and only watches the corporate mainstream media for their drive-by facts, then we will be powerless against them without a voice to speak with the masses. Unfortunately, it takes millions of dollars to reach them...and who has that again?

    Collectively, I would suppose we could be to blame. But I would argue it a symptom of apathy and living paycheck to paycheck, us collectively being too busy to pay attention or look deeper than what is shoved in our face. Are we to blame by believing the billions of $$ of advertising, slick presentations, and complex concoctions of cherry picked facts and outright lies of the media outlets? Or are they to blame by using their money to turn us into marrionettes, and they the ventriloquists. Which came first, egg or chicken.... I am not sure.
    . I am. We are. The media doesn't cast a vote, nor do they force onto us ours. I work for a living, and still manage fairly handily every year to determine that main party candidates are douche nozzles.
    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    Reports indicate that everyone knew he was hauling a bunch of guns up there. But, since you brought it up, there's something which should be illegal: guns that breakdown.

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    Re: Who's fault is this shutdown? Defined by where you get your information.

    Quote Originally Posted by KevinKohler View Post
    . I am. We are. The media doesn't cast a vote, nor do they force onto us ours. I work for a living, and still manage fairly handily every year to determine that main party candidates are douche nozzles.
    Thats because you are a critic. As am I. However, we are not the norm.

    There is a reason newspapers are dropping left and right and news oriented magazines are going out of print. While Fox, CNN, and MSNBC numbers are in the hundreds of millions collectively. These are all snake oil salesmen, but their trade is false knowledge, and most of us collectively eat it up like it was gospel. And it scares the bejeesus out of me.

  9. #19
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    Re: Who's fault is this shutdown? Defined by where you get your information.

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    The construction of the Federal government and the role of Congress is my source form stating the FACT that it is Republicans responsible for not funding Obamacare and the Democrats fault for shutting down every other aspect of government since the Republicans offered to do so. It has nothing to do with new sources. Just obvious fact.
    It has everything to do with news sources. And it is a much disputed "fact" that looks an awful more like an opinion.

    Where did you come by this determination that it was the Dems fault for shutting down the entire govt? Where did you come by the idea that Republicans offered something. (I dont know what that is, because I am not aware of anything they have offered). Where did you get the information that led you to be for or against the Affordable care act in the first place?

    Everything you know, you read, watched, or heard from something or somebody. This is how people in Canada can KNOW something completely different about the same thing we KNOW. Because we have different information channels. In this country, the divergant media business plans have reflected our own two party system and morphed it into two polar ideologies. How can millions of us Americans with an infinite myriad of life experiences, backgrounds, and complex belief systems, be pigeon-holed into two distinct ideology "templates"? Because the media is the one that passed the information on to us, whether it was a newspaper, magazine, internet or television. Its just that television has the ablity to sway our emotions much stronger in the channels desired direction through their delivery. They take an event or quote or subject, extract the pieces of facts that further their agenda, belief system, and or market plan, color them, shade them, flip them on their head, take them out of context (whatever it takes to further their end goal) and dish it up with a side of opinion and onslaught of experts agreeing with them to show us how right they are. And even when they are PROVEN wrong, no retraction or apology is given or demanded by us. For those watching or reading only one news source, they will never know those things that have been proven false. They will continue believing them as fact, because some snake oil salesman on Fox/CNN/MSNBC told them it was so and a herd of paid like minded talking heads confirmed it....and then backed it up with small viewer sourced polls postured as national polls.

    So in reality, your opinions are usually a product of your chosen information channels. The greater number and more widely varied in their left/right slant you use to obtain information, the more informed and more balanced to the truth you will be.

  10. #20
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    Re: Who's fault is this shutdown? Defined by where you get your information.

    Quote Originally Posted by Freemind USMC View Post
    It has everything to do with news sources. And it is a much disputed "fact" that looks an awful more like an opinion.

    Where did you come by this determination that it was the Dems fault for shutting down the entire govt? Where did you come by the idea that Republicans offered something. (I dont know what that is, because I am not aware of anything they have offered). Where did you get the information that led you to be for or against the Affordable care act in the first place?

    Everything you know, you read, watched, or heard from something or somebody. This is how people in Canada can KNOW something completely different about the same thing we KNOW. Because we have different information channels. In this country, the divergant media business plans have reflected our own two party system and morphed it into two polar ideologies. How can millions of us Americans with an infinite myriad of life experiences, backgrounds, and complex belief systems, be pigeon-holed into two distinct ideology "templates"? Because the media is the one that passed the information on to us, whether it was a newspaper, magazine, internet or television. Its just that television has the ablity to sway our emotions much stronger in the channels desired direction through their delivery. They take an event or quote or subject, extract the pieces of facts that further their agenda, belief system, and or market plan, color them, shade them, flip them on their head, take them out of context (whatever it takes to further their end goal) and dish it up with a side of opinion and onslaught of experts agreeing with them to show us how right they are. And even when they are PROVEN wrong, no retraction or apology is given or demanded by us. For those watching or reading only one news source, they will never know those things that have been proven false. They will continue believing them as fact, because some snake oil salesman on Fox/CNN/MSNBC told them it was so and a herd of paid like minded talking heads confirmed it....and then backed it up with small viewer sourced polls postured as national polls.

    So in reality, your opinions are usually a product of your chosen information channels. The greater number and more widely varied in their left/right slant you use to obtain information, the more informed and more balanced to the truth you will be.
    Laid out in a professional manner. I'd say that pretty much sums up our news media.


    Still doesn't let American voters off the hook. We were distracted from the truth because we wanted to be, we collectively chose to be on this path. If it was not our will, we would not be here.
    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    Reports indicate that everyone knew he was hauling a bunch of guns up there. But, since you brought it up, there's something which should be illegal: guns that breakdown.

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