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Is this administration just a bunch of children?

Does this admninistration act like children?


  • Total voters
    28
  • Poll closed .
It's a Republican shutdown.

No, the Democrats in the Senate had the option of passing the House bill that did not fund Obama Care and they chose not to. The House is well within their authority not to fund a program since it has the Power of the Purse. The Senate Could have passed it and then there could be a discussion of what to do about Obama Care.

It's a shame this small group of Cruz novices, who don't understand how the federal govt works, was allowed to force a shutdown by the leaders in the House.

They know how goverment works thus they are forcing the issue this way. Obama and the Dem Leadership in the Senate are not wanting to do any compromise on Obama Care.

But it's a losing game to blame the shutdown on Obama.

While Obama has publicly stated that he will not agree with the House Bill in question at this point it is the Democrats in the Senate that are the ones to blame. They could just pass the bill and have confidence that Obama will Veto.

For one thing, what is shut down is the decision of bureaucrats, not Obama.

No, Obama is President and he signs Executive Orders determining what gets shut down how, why and when.

And it's a thing decided ahead of time, although it can be altered a bit, I think.

It is determined ahead of time by Obama and yes he can make needed alterations.

But "nonessentials" are decided at intervals, by people in the govt, for occasions such as this.

Obama will be advised on this issue but he is the one to make the decision.

They didn't get together in a smoke filled room one night and decide what to shutdown.

No, that crowd is probably a non-smoking crowd. Also it probably was a luncheon with watercress sandwiches with Obama and the Democratic Leadership.

It's predetermined, for the most part.

Of course it is predetermined.

But I'm sure Cruz researched this and knew that, right?

I'm sure he knew that Obama would pull a shutdown.

I'm sure he knew veterans establishments would be shut down, some veterans wouldn't receive health care, children with cancer wouldn't be able to get treatments, children who rely on federal subsidies for food would have to go hungry, etc. He knew all that, right?

I do not think he knew in what detail the shutdown would take. The fact that children with cancer is being used as a political football is on Obama.

But you either have a shutdown or you don't.

You mean like "being a little bit pregnant?" No, there are a verity of "species" of shutdowns however.

You don't declare a shutdown, then oops! decide to UN-shutdown some things that are unpopular with your constituents, picking some people as more important than others.

Obama has been playing favorites all along. He gave numerous exceptions to Obama Care to Corporations and Unions for one year. I think the remiander of the population should get that same favor.

Are veterans more important than children with cancer?

If we have nationalized health care this is one of the questions that will be determined by the government. What is needed for our People is a health system that is individualized for each person. You will not get that if you have a health care system run by the government. Government will at least on the surface have to look impartal and it will have it run by the numbers and profiles ignoring the individual.

Are healthy veterans who want to visit a memorial more important than ailing veterans in dire need of health care?

Closing the Memorial costs more money than keeping it open. Letting veterans visit a memorial (who, may themselves, be not all that healthy) has near zero cost and those in dire need of health care will still get the substandard treatment that is still available to veterans.

There's a story about this in the Bible. It's about Soloman and a baby. But I'm sure Cruz knows that story, right?

Bad analogy, Obama is not any way near a Solomon and the baby in question (Obama Care) is his.
 
Ordering and causing are two different things in this instance.

To understand why they closed the parks read this article
National Parks Close As Other Public Lands Stay Open : NPR

Now take into consideration the circumstances of how our government shutdown and maybe you'll see why the administration is not nearly at fault as when compared to congressional republicans.

The article shows that the National Parks are closed down due to the requirements involved with conserving the wildlife and scenery this has nothing to do about who is at fault for the shutdown.
 
That's because the National Park Service runs the Monuments. Can you imagine the sheer volume of people moving through there everyday? Now imagine maintaining and supervising these when practically all of your staff has been furloughed.

This can be rectified by changing the department responsible for memorials on the Mall.
 
Oh for F-sake. I get it. I really get it. I don't like the health care law either, I'm not a fan of the President (and I didn't vote for him), and I wish we had more clout in Washington. But THIS is what is childish. I'm honestly astonished at the reaction my fellow 'Conservatives' and 'Libertarians' have had to the shutdown. I mean what the hell did you think was going to happen? This is the consequence for our elected officials making a terrible and pedantic choice to try and fight a legitimately passed piece of legislation that they have zero (read that again: zero) chance of stopping. When the government shuts down it doesn't keep open just the things that we like. Is it BS that the World War II Memorial is closed? Yeah it probably be is. But for christ sake direct your anger at the right target.

The Dems in the Senate are the ones to blame at this point. They did not pass the House bill. They are the ones who are not in a compromise posture.
 
The Dems in the Senate are the ones to blame at this point. They did not pass the House bill. They are the ones who are not in a compromise posture.

They don't need to compromise and if we were them we wouldn't compromise. It is ridiculous.

We failed to prevent the passage of the ACA, we lost the Presidential election, we failed to retake the Senate, we lost in the Supreme Court. Now we wait till the government is down to the wire and we threaten to bring the whole thing down unless we get the chances we demand on the ACA? Not going to happen. We aren't going to get it and we are going to be crushed in the polls. I'm for PA and our position has already plummeted even amongst incumbents who had nothing to do with the shutdown faction.
 
It's a Republican shutdown. It's a shame this small group of Cruz novices, who don't understand how the federal govt works, was allowed to force a shutdown by the leaders in the House.

But it's a losing game to blame the shutdown on Obama. For one thing, what is shut down is the decision of bureaucrats, not Obama. And it's a thing decided ahead of time, although it can be altered a bit, I think. But "nonessentials" are decided at intervals, by people in the govt, for occasions such as this. They didn't get together in a smoke filled room one night and decide what to shutdown. It's predetermined, for the most part. But I'm sure Cruz researched this and knew that, right? I'm sure he knew veterans establishments would be shut down, some veterans wouldn't receive health care, children with cancer wouldn't be able to get treatments, children who rely on federal subsidies for food would have to go hungry, etc. He knew all that, right?

But you either have a shutdown or you don't. You don't declare a shutdown, then oops! decide to UN-shutdown some things that are unpopular with your constituents, picking some people as more important than others. Are veterans more important than children with cancer? Are healthy veterans who want to visit a memorial more important than ailing veterans in dire need of health care? There's a story about this in the Bible. It's about Soloman and a baby. But I'm sure Cruz knows that story, right?

Factually false, Obama and Reid are the ones who think "they are winning" and have shutdown the government.
 
Blue Ridge inn's act of defiance lasts about 2 hours

Answer...yes.

They usually have exactly ZERO personnel monitoring these roads and byways. Of course...due to the Bring the Pain campaign, the administration is dedicating 6 times the manpower...because...you know...the shutdown and all...

Petulant children from the top down. And sadly, there is a steady line of passengers boarding that ship of fools all too eager to justify the administrations stupidity.
 
They don't need to compromise and if we were them we wouldn't compromise. It is ridiculous.

We failed to prevent the passage of the ACA, we lost the Presidential election, we failed to retake the Senate, we lost in the Supreme Court. Now we wait till the government is down to the wire and we threaten to bring the whole thing down unless we get the chances we demand on the ACA? Not going to happen. We aren't going to get it and we are going to be crushed in the polls. I'm for PA and our position has already plummeted even amongst incumbents who had nothing to do with the shutdown faction.

The standard policy of the Democrats is no compromise. There is significant opposition to Obama Care and the constituents of the Republican House members want it to be stopped otherwise this would not be happening. The idea that the Republicans should just let this happen means essentially that there is no need of a second Party. There comes a time where one must take a stand and take any consequences with that come with it. By not taking this stand means that the citizens who are opposed to Obama Care will not have a voice in this and will be forced to seek another Party or go in opposition to the government policy.
 
How many here have been to DC? I have. There is no legitimate reason to block off the various outdoor exhibits other than Obama and company choose to act like children. Same with Mt. Rushmore. They are spending more money just to be assholes.
Minor correction - what they spend, how much they spend, how much they borrow so they can spend, and on what they spend is what makes them what they are. ;)

On the other hand - you're right too - image is everything to these people. :rwbdonkey :sinking:

:mrgreen:
 
The standard policy of the Democrats is no compromise. There is significant opposition to Obama Care and the constituents of the Republican House members want it to be stopped otherwise this would not be happening. The idea that the Republicans should just let this happen means essentially that there is no need of a second Party. There comes a time where one must take a stand and take any consequences with that come with it. By not taking this stand means that the citizens who are opposed to Obama Care will not have a voice in this and will be forced to seek another Party or go in opposition to the government policy.

Well tough crap! A significant amount of Democrats didn't want our tax cut package in 2001 but they would have been insane to shutdown the government over it. And the voters would have punished them for it.

Sometimes laws get passed that you don't like, sometimes perspectives triumph that you'd rather not see ascendant. If we are going to establish the precedent that the government can be torpedoed whenever the party in opposition doesn't completely get its way than we might as well abandon the notion of Republican government because nothing will get done. We have ample opportunities to fight off the ACA and we lost every single one of them. This is like cheating at the end zone.

So fine. Accept your consequences, but the sane part of our party, movement, whatever you want to call it will blame you when Democrats reclaim the House in November.

Oh. And we will still have the ACA. *facepalm*
 
Minor correction - what they spend, how much they spend, how much they borrow so they can spend, and on what they spend is what makes them what they are. ;)

On the other hand - you're right too - image is everything to these people. :rwbdonkey :sinking:

:mrgreen:

I suggest an immediate rework on that image thing! It's not going too well for them, if they hoped to make the Repubs look bad, cause it's kinda backfiring! :wow:
 
I suggest an immediate rework on that image thing! It's not going too well for them, if they hoped to make the Repubs look bad, cause it's kinda backfiring! :wow:
IMHO, they're kicking back at the very Americans their policies are threatening to sink even further.
 
Blue Ridge inn's act of defiance lasts about 2 hours

Answer...yes.

They usually have exactly ZERO personnel monitoring these roads and byways. Of course...due to the Bring the Pain campaign, the administration is dedicating 6 times the manpower...because...you know...the shutdown and all...

Petulant children from the top down. And sadly, there is a steady line of passengers boarding that ship of fools all too eager to justify the administrations stupidity.
Dangit...self pwnage is the best pwnage....
 
Well tough crap! A significant amount of Democrats didn't want our tax cut package in 2001 but they would have been insane to shutdown the government over it. And the voters would have punished them for it.

There is a significant difference in kind between a tax cut and an imposition of a government program that will take over health care in our country more so than it already has.

Sometimes laws get passed that you don't like, sometimes perspectives triumph that you'd rather not see ascendant. If we are going to establish the precedent that the government can be torpedoed whenever the party in opposition doesn't completely get its way than we might as well abandon the notion of Republican government because nothing will get done.

A Republican government should not reflect a mere majority of the populace but a substantial majority within limits. There is a substantial majority in this country that wants Obama Care to be repealed entirely or modified extensively and if the Democrat strategy is to shut down the government to counter this then so it must be.


We have ample opportunities to fight off the ACA and we lost every single one of them. This is like cheating at the end zone.

That is an opinion that is open to interpretation. The Democats when they were in Control of both Houses did everything they could to minimize any dispute or compromise the Republican could offer. Keep in mind that the Republican Leadership was in control by "moderates" who simply could not recognize the Democrats were not going to compromise and still were acting as if that were so.

So fine. Accept your consequences, but the sane part of our party, movement, whatever you want to call it will blame you when Democrats reclaim the House in November.

That is yet to be seen. I think that the Republicans need to stick to their convictions and stand their ground and if that means that they loose seats then what the Republican Party stands for can not be held as viable and changes would have to be made on what it will stand for. I think that the fiscally conservative and the idea that big government is not the answer to all our ills and is likely the cause of some of them is a viable alternative to the Democarts belief that the money to pay for government programs will always be able to be paid by the "rich" ,i.e. the middle class, and that government is The Answer to any problem that occurs or can be manufactured.

Oh. And we will still have the ACA. *facepalm*

Perhaps, but if the Republicans are successful it will be delayed a year.
 
How many here have been to DC? I have. There is no legitimate reason to block off the various outdoor exhibits other than Obama and company choose to act like children. Same with Mt. Rushmore. They are spending more money just to be assholes.


I think they are just blocking those public exhibits off for political means. The administration is hoping that people get pissed off that they can't see these open air exhibits and will complain to their elected officials to cave in to the democrats.
 
I think they are just blocking those public exhibits off for political means. The administration is hoping that people get pissed off that they can't see these open air exhibits and will complain to their elected officials to cave in to the democrats.
They are. I think it is backfiring already. Only the most committed true believers and retards are buying into the dem rhetoric regarding shutting down the monuments. Democrats and liberals that have maintained the capacity for independent thought may still very well blame the GOP for the shutdown but they certainly see the park and monument shutdowns for what they are...and the see the administration for what it is as well. I dont think it is their finest hour and i think most democrats see that.
 
How many here have been to DC? I have. There is no legitimate reason to block off the various outdoor exhibits other than Obama and company choose to act like children. Same with Mt. Rushmore. They are spending more money just to be assholes.

Who's acting like children? The Republicans shut down the government because they didn't get their way in the election.

Your poll should have one more option: No, it is the Republicans who are acting like children.
 
I suggest an immediate rework on that image thing! It's not going too well for them, if they hoped to make the Repubs look bad, cause it's kinda backfiring! :wow:

No. It isn't. The people voted for Obama. They know the GOP is holding everything up just because they don't like ObamaCare.

This ends anytime the Republicans want it to. All they have to do is pass a clean resolution on the budget THEY wanted in the first place. On which the Democrats already negotiated plenty, and do not need to negotiate anything more.
 
yes Comunitee Obamacare is all the Republicans fault? Wait What? :doh
 
No. It isn't. The people voted for Obama. They know the GOP is holding everything up just because they don't like ObamaCare.

This ends anytime the Republicans want it to. All they have to do is pass a clean resolution on the budget THEY wanted in the first place. On which the Democrats already negotiated plenty, and do not need to negotiate anything more.

Current polls are indicating otherwise, but I agree it's not over yet!

Greetings, Comunitee. :2wave:
 
I guess you failed to read the thread, dunno:confused:

Obama and the idiots are spending more money to close open exhibits that is spent when they are open. Has nothing to do with the shutdown.

The House T's have voted to pay people for not working. It has everything to do with their shutdown.
 
No. It isn't. The people voted for Obama. They know the GOP is holding everything up just because they don't like ObamaCare.

This ends anytime the Republicans want it to. All they have to do is pass a clean resolution on the budget THEY wanted in the first place. On which the Democrats already negotiated plenty, and do not need to negotiate anything more.
Current polls are indicating otherwise, but I agree it's not over yet!

Greetings, Comunitee. :2wave:
The current polls are irrelevant. The only poll that matters is the one that re-elected the President who gave us ObamaCare and defeated the one whose only domestic policies were running against it and cutting taxes on the rich.

If there were another Presidential election today, Obama would win in a landslide even bigger than his first two.
 
No. It isn't. The people voted for Obama. They know the GOP is holding everything up just because they don't like ObamaCare.

This ends anytime the Republicans want it to. All they have to do is pass a clean resolution on the budget THEY wanted in the first place. On which the Democrats already negotiated plenty, and do not need to negotiate anything more.

The current polls are irrelevant. The only poll that matters is the one that re-elected the President who gave us ObamaCare and defeated the one whose only domestic policies were running against it and cutting taxes on the rich.

If there were another Presidential election today, Obama would win in a landslide even bigger than his first two.

The current polls are showing what the people are thinking today, not in the past. People change their minds all the time, which is why I stated "it's not over yet."
 
The current polls are showing what the people are thinking today, not in the past. People change their minds all the time, which is why I stated "it's not over yet."

Good day Polgara :2wave:

People do change their minds. If you remember back in April or early May of 2009 CNN with Wolf Blitzer did a special on Obama's first 90 days in office. CNN conducted a survey of only those voters who voted for Obama in 2008. When the results were revealed live on CNN by Blitzer, you may have remembered the expression on Blitzer face when the results were released. 15 % of those who voted for Obama said they believe they may have made a mistake voting for Obama.

By 2010 and 2011 even MSNBC was hinting that Obama might be a one term President.

During 2012 Obama ran on lies, cover ups, and misinformation to be given a second chance and reelected. It seems to have worked.

For any young people out there who are seriously thinking of getting involved in politics and running for elected office here's a sure way of getting elected to public office. Start with getting involved with Chicago politics and read Sauhl Alinsky's "Rules for Radicals." It's a no brainier and a shoe in into a political career. Who knows, you could be President some day.
 
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