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If prostitution were legal...

If prostitution were legal... would pimps be "necessary"?

  • Yes

    Votes: 2 5.6%
  • No

    Votes: 27 75.0%
  • Other

    Votes: 7 19.4%

  • Total voters
    36
And yet the conditions for the women there are far better than in the US.

Legalization is a no brainer.

Congratulations on completely ignoring all the research and evidence I just offered you. By all means, keep believing whatever you want to believe in spite of reality. No skin off my back.

No brainer should be your personal motto.
 
We already do that here though, buying and selling prostitutes is already illegal here and it hasn't done a bit of good.

You misunderstand. In Sweden SELLING is legal, BUYING (or PIMPING) is illegal.

Women who want to sell their bodies are going to do it and men are going to buy what they're selling.

And what about the women who don't want to do it but are forced to?
 
If prostitution were legal... would pimps be "necessary"?

Please note that "necessary" is in quotes.

If one takes a look at Germany, the answer is no.
 
You misunderstand. In Sweden SELLING is legal, BUYING (or PIMPING) is illegal.



And what about the women who don't want to do it but are forced to?

No, I think you misunderstand. Both are already illegal here and it hasn't done a thing. Legalization and regulation would prevent a lot of women being forced into the business. They would have many avenues to take. Keeping it in the dark and illegal doesn't help anyone.

Besides, why shouldn't two adults be able to exchange sex for money if they so desire?
 
No, I think you misunderstand. Both are already illegal here and it hasn't done a thing.

I'm talking about Selling=Legal, Buying=Illegal. You're talking about Selling=Illegal, Buying=Illegal. Do you not see the difference? I'll give you a hint - there's an extra letter in there somewhere. Why do you think it's ok to compare apples to oranges?

Legalization and regulation would prevent a lot of women being forced into the business. They would have many avenues to take. Keeping it in the dark and illegal doesn't help anyone.

You are wrong. I've already provided a number of links to empirical research that has demonstrated this is wrong. You're putting forth a theory. And reality has shown that that theory is wrong.

Besides, why shouldn't two adults be able to exchange sex for money if they so desire?

Because the legal framework that permits that may also lead to increased human trafficking.
 
Legalization and regulation would prevent a lot of women being forced into the business.

If we legalize and regulate rape it will prevent a lot of women from being raped. Pimping is about making a profit by forcing others to work. Factories and warehouses are not illegal and get regulated. Yet every year we find MILLIONS of people being forced to work in factories and warehouses. Again, legalization of prostitution will not create a "clean" market for it - it will simply make the already existing black market a more viable alternative. No amount of rebates and tax breaks will make forcing somebody to work for free less enticing. Ask slave owners.
 
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If we legalize and regulate rape it will prevent a lot of women from being raped.

Go troll somewhere else. I'm trying to have a serious discussion here.
 
Go troll somewhere else. I'm trying to have a serious discussion here.

If you were trying to have a serious discussion you would study up on the subject. Tens of thousands of Slavic women are still trafficked every year. All throughout European countries where prostitution has been decriminalized. So legalization of prostitution has simply made it easier for them to be put to work.
 
Necessary - no. But some "managers" and "marketing agents" will be still doing business. And so will bodyguards and drivers, of course.
The main difference: it will be all in daylight and regulated. Human trafficking and coercion will be gone or diminished greatly.
 
If you were trying to have a serious discussion you would study up on the subject. Tens of thousands of Slavic women are still trafficked throughout European countries where prostitution has been decriminalized. So legalization of prostitution has simply made it easier for them to be put to work.

That's because they are probably lax on their regulations.
 
If you were trying to have a serious discussion you would study up on the subject. Tens of thousands of Slavic women are still trafficked every year. All throughout European countries where prostitution has been decriminalized. So legalization of prostitution has simply made it easier for them to be put to work.

Pardon me, but their servitude is derived from their illegal status - as illegal immigrants, not from their work as prostitutes. That's where the power of traffickers over them is coming from. If they could immigrate legally, the criminal enterprise would collapse.
 
That's because they are probably lax on their regulations.

What a simple minded solution to such a huge problem. I pointed out the fact that legalization will not stop the use of force - because it is the threat of force which makes the business profitable in the first place - and your solution is "stronger regulation!" - Well - we'll go right back to square one where people will simply create an unregulated black market. It's the same thing which happens with behind the counter medicine. Regulate it until it's inaccessible and unprofitable for all but a select few and people will simply find a way to sell it illegally and make a profit anyways.
 
If prostitution were legal... would pimps be "necessary"?

Please note that "necessary" is in quotes.

there will be lots of pimps even if it is legal
 
What a simple minded solution to such a huge problem. I pointed out the fact that legalization will not stop the use of force - because it is the threat of force which makes the business profitable in the first place - and your solution is "stronger regulation!" - Well - we'll go right back to square one where people will simply create an unregulated black market. It's the same thing which happens with behind the counter medicine. Regulate it until it's inaccessible and unprofitable for all but a select few and people will simply find a way to sell it illegally and make a profit anyways.

Certainly if prostitution is legalized there would be many benefits to visiting legal prostitutes as opposed to illegal ones which would tend to put a dent in the black market. It works the same way with legalizing drugs.
 
Pardon me, but their servitude is derived from their illegal status - as illegal immigrants, not from their work as prostitutes. That's where the power of traffickers over them is coming from. If they could immigrate legally, the criminal enterprise would collapse.

I'll pardon your ignorance on this subject all you want. Trafficking women is done by legally moving them through countries:

The 'Natasha' Trade: The Transnational Shadow Market of Trafficking in Women

Some traffickers use the woman’s legal documents and tourist visas to legally enter the destination countries. The women may be put on a circuit by pimps in which they are moved from country to country on legal tourist visas or entertainers’ visas. Other times, the woman is given false documents. In this case, the woman is even more vulnerable after she arrives in the destination country because she is there illegally. If police discover her, she is arrested and deported.

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/26/international/europe/26turkey.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

"Women are recruited at home with the promise of employment," Mr. Freedman said. "But once they are across the border their passports are taken away and they are beaten and raped and forced into prostitution." The women are typically kept locked in an apartment except when they are taken out to customers.

BBC News - Trafficking: The ordeal of a Moscow 'shop slave'

"When I arrived on the very first day they took away my passport," she said.

"Then I noticed the owner beating one of the girls, very badly. She pulled her hair and she kicked her really hard. That was when I realised that I was in a wrong place."

These women are entered legally into the countries and then beaten into submission. The days of sneaking them in on boats is long gone. They have passports, visas and all necessary documents to enter the countries.
 
Certainly if prostitution is legalized there would be many benefits to visiting legal prostitutes as opposed to illegal ones which would tend to put a dent in the black market. It works the same way with legalizing drugs.

Lol... I JUST debunked this myth in post 40.
 
Lol... I JUST debunked this myth in post 40.

All of those links are about other countries. A lot of those countries don't have the money or resources to enforce any kind of regulations, as I'm sure you are well aware.
 
Lol... I JUST debunked this myth in post 40.

Her and Crylek aren't saying the same thing. Are you contending that making prostitution legal wouldn't cut into the profits of the black market just as it would with drugs, and has with alcohol after the dirty thirties? Human trafficking doesn't really effect the loss of business people who do this illegally would have due to it being legal.
 
All of those links are about other countries. A lot of those countries don't have the money or resources to enforce any kind of regulations, as I'm sure you are well aware.

What other countries? I posted a link where many countries where prostitution is legalized and regulated and the same problem persists - since you didn't even bother to read the links here are a few:

Germany:

A criminal investigation in Germany in 1998 found that 87.5 percent of the women trafficked into Germany were from Eastern Europe. Seventeen percent were from Poland, 14 percent from Ukraine, 12 percent from Czech Republic and 8 percent from the Russian Federation.

Greece:

Lena, aged 21, was recruited by a woman who said her daughter was working in Greece and making a lot of money. When Lena arrived in Greece, her passport had been taken away and she was put into a small room in a brothel guarded by two dogs. She was sold in prostitution each night from nine in the evening until six in the morning. When she escaped and returned to Mykolayiv she had US$55.00.

Italy:

In Milan, Italy in December 1997, police uncovered a gang that was holding auctions of trafficked women from the former Soviet Union. The women were stripped partially naked, displayed and sold for an average price of US$1000. Traffickers and pimps use extreme violence to control their women and territory.

These women aren't being sent to Macedonia to work. They're being sent to countries where people have the money to spend on prostitution.

Sex trafficking | Prostitution | Eastern Europe | GlobalPost

Western demand for Eastern European prostitutes fuels today’s sex-slave industry. Currently, the market for Slavic woman and children in brothels and in pornography in "developed" countries — particularly the EU and the U.S. — is the hottest compared to other parts of the world, and is drawing on an endless supply of impoverished and vulnerable women.

Seriously - if you're going to debate this subject at least have a friggin clue as to what it is you're discussing.
 
I'll pardon your ignorance on this subject all you want. Trafficking women is done by legally moving them through countries.

I'll pardon your inability to read what other people write as well: They are not legal immigrants. They have to right to work legally there. Which makes them entirely dependent on the traffickers.
 
Her and Crylek aren't saying the same thing. Are you contending that making prostitution legal wouldn't cut into the profits of the black market just as it would with drugs, and has with alcohol after the dirty thirties?

On this topic? I am. Bringing the government into the mix by legalizing prostitution would simply create a bigger need for cheaper prostitutes. In essence, prostitutes would become too expensive for the average joe, criminal enterprises would then begin trafficking women they can sell cheaper. What makes human trafficking attractive is the fact that you can force somebody to work for free while making a profit.
 
I'll pardon your inability to read what other people write as well: They are not legal immigrants. They have to right to work legally there. Which makes them entirely dependent on the traffickers.

I'll make it simple for you, here's a simple example of the legal immigration of prostitutes:

1. Guy puts out an ad looking for girls who want to work as secretaries in X country.
2. Girls reply to the ad, they are provided with visa (insuring entry into the country) and all legal documentation to the enter the country.
3. Girls are then repeatedly raped, drugged and beaten.
4. They are forced to work off their debt even if they are legally living within the country.

This happens every single day to thousands of women - no amount of legalization/regulation will stop it and it's all for the same reason that Nike/Apple having sweatshops isn't anything remotely new. Nothing beats free laborers. Nothing.
 
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I always thought if I ever gpt desperate enough that I had to steal, i'd rob pimps. Karma free.

Except if prostitution were legal you'd be robbing what are essentially agents. Legal agents.
 
What other countries? I posted a link where many countries where prostitution is legalized and regulated and the same problem persists - since you didn't even bother to read the links here are a few:

Germany:



Greece:



Italy:



These women aren't being sent to Macedonia to work. They're being sent to countries where people have the money to spend on prostitution.

Sex trafficking | Prostitution | Eastern Europe | GlobalPost



Seriously - if you're going to debate this subject at least have a friggin clue as to what it is you're discussing.

None of these countries are comparable to the United States. Sorry.
 
I'll make it simple for you, here's a simple example of the legal immigration of prostitutes:

1. Guy puts out an ad looking for girls who want to work as secretaries in X country.
2. Girls reply to the ad, they are provided with visa (insuring entry into the country) and all legal documentation to the enter the country.
3. Girls are then repeatedly raped, drugged and beaten.
4. They are forced to work off their debt even if they are legally living within the country.

This happens every single day to thousands of women - no amount of legalization/regulation will stop it and it's all for the same reason that Nike/Apple having sweatshops isn't anything remotely new. Nothing beats free laborers. Nothing.

And that goes on MORE now because there are absolutely no regulations and those women are scared by those men because of our laws.
 
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