View Poll Results: How Bad Could it Be?

Voters
33. You may not vote on this poll
  • Dems cave in again, allowing the debt to be used as a political tool

    5 15.15%
  • Landslide election for one side in 2014

    8 24.24%
  • Republican rebellion forces Boehner down

    4 12.12%
  • House impeaches Obama

    4 12.12%
  • Economic slump

    9 27.27%
  • Recession

    12 36.36%
  • Depression

    18 54.55%
  • Civil War

    1 3.03%
  • World War

    0 0%
  • End of USA as we know it

    1 3.03%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Thread: How Bad Could it Be? (Shutdown/Debt Limit)

  1. #11
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    Re: How Bad Could it Be? (Shutdown/Debt Limit)

    Quote Originally Posted by Perotista View Post
    I have been through 17 of these, this being the 18th. Ford 1, Carter 5, 7 Reagan, 1 under Bush the First and 2 under Clinton. These lasted anywhere from 1 to 21 days. All ended up being no big thing. In my opinion there is way too much hyperbole over this one coming from both sides.

    Fact is most Americans are going about their daily business as usual as the government being shutdown isn't effecting them. Now from the political partisan die hards, you think the world has come to an end. If our politicians in Washington would start putting country over party, then perhaps our problems as a nation could get solved. But as long as it is more important to those in D.C. to be Republicans and Democrats instead of Americans, this country will flounder and soon give up its ghost.
    But governing from crisis to crisis, in a peicemeal fashion is no way for a modern country to be run.

  2. #12
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    Re: How Bad Could it Be? (Shutdown/Debt Limit)

    Well Canadian news is already calling it a civil war between the far right Republicans and the centre-right Democrats.

  3. #13
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    Re: How Bad Could it Be? (Shutdown/Debt Limit)

    Quote Originally Posted by Unitedwestand13 View Post
    But governing from crisis to crisis, in a peicemeal fashion is no way for a modern country to be run.
    You are correct, but as I said when both major political parties are only looking out for only themselves, when they are trying to make the other party look as bad as possible and the only thing important to them is whether Republicans or Democrats get elected instead of governing and making our political system work. We will continue to have exactly what you described.

    There has been quite a lot of past presidents who have worked across the aisle with success. Eisenhower did it with LBJ, LBJ was senate majority leader back then. JFK and LBJ worked closely with Everett Dirksen, the republican senate minority leader. Reagan and Tip O'Neil exploits are famous. Even Clinton after the 1994 elections worked with first Gingrich, then Hastert along with Trent Lott. All accomplished quite a lot.

    Clinton learned and knew to get things done and done smoothly he had to change tactics and strategy and work with Republicans after 1994. President Obama hasn't done that. He has tried to govern like both chambers are still in the hands of the democrats and by huge margins which they are not. Now I am not placing all the blame on the president, the house republican's hold more than their share of the blame, so too does Senator Reid and the democrats in the senate. politics is said to be the game of the possible. To move forward three steps, sometimes one has to step back one or two steps. One has to be willing to give in order to take. This my way or the highway approach by both parties and the president isn't working. Our political system is broke and it is those in elected office today that has broken it.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

  4. #14
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    Re: How Bad Could it Be? (Shutdown/Debt Limit)

    Odd question. The worst that could happen would be, I suppose, that all nations on earth unleash all of their weapons of mass destruction at once, annihilating most life on the planet. Now, do I think that's likely? Of course not. But it is possible.

  5. #15
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    Re: How Bad Could it Be? (Shutdown/Debt Limit)

    Quote Originally Posted by aberrant85 View Post
    Given the trajectory our country is, I ask you: what is the worst possible development that could happen in the event that either the country defaults on its debt or President Obama unilaterally lifts the debt limit?

    Keep in mind, the former is warned to create an economic crisis, the latter a constitutional crisis.
    if we default, it has the potential to be a long term nightmare. the ironic part is that taxes will have to be raised significantly to deal with the increasing interest and the fact that it will be more difficult for us to borrow. if we lose global reserve currency status, then it's economic game over for the foreseeable future. think gas is expensive now? just wait.

    as for the trillion dollar coin idea, it sets a horrible precedence, and my opinion is that it's a nonstarter. we either will or will not default. my guess is that they do what they always do and kick the ball down the road. those throwing a tantrum in the house will get the medical device tax repealed as a bone, and then we'll go further into debt.

  6. #16
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    Re: How Bad Could it Be? (Shutdown/Debt Limit)

    Fail. The dictator has to keep his golf course open, his essential 3 white house chefs, and then make it hurt on the people so they'll blame the other party.


    Quote Originally Posted by Dickieboy View Post
    Ok, just in an effort to put things into perspective and propose options I’ve made some ‘back of the envelope’ calculation.

    Annual revenue = ~$2,400b
    Monthly revenue = ~$200b
    Debt = $17,000b
    Annual interest on debt = ~$415b
    Monthly interest on debt = ~$35b
    It seem obvious that our monthly revenue would cover the monthly interest thus preventing ‘default’.

    Consider further that debt = debt held by public + intragovernmental debt (SS trust fund)
    Current monthly social security payments = ~$62b

    So we take $62b from monthly revenue reimburse SS trust fund, which reduces current debt, which would then allow an additional $62b in borrowing OR not and prevent hitting the ceiling. This can occur infinitely. Will the shutdown continue and necessarily expand due to insufficient revenue, yes but default is off the table. The burden of his expansion of the shutdown would ultimately cause the public to pressure the POLs to solve it…but the global economic calamity associate with default is avoided.

  7. #17
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    Re: How Bad Could it Be? (Shutdown/Debt Limit)

    Could you explain how we could default with monthly revenues of $250 billion and interest costs of 33 billion?


    Quote Originally Posted by Helix View Post
    if we default, it has the potential to be a long term nightmare. the ironic part is that taxes will have to be raised significantly to deal with the increasing interest and the fact that it will be more difficult for us to borrow. if we lose global reserve currency status, then it's economic game over for the foreseeable future. think gas is expensive now? just wait.

    as for the trillion dollar coin idea, it sets a horrible precedence, and my opinion is that it's a nonstarter. we either will or will not default. my guess is that they do what they always do and kick the ball down the road. those throwing a tantrum in the house will get the medical device tax repealed as a bone, and then we'll go further into debt.

  8. #18
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    Re: How Bad Could it Be? (Shutdown/Debt Limit)

    [QUOTE=Perotista;1062391519]I have been through 17 of these, this being the 18th. Ford 1, Carter 5, 7 Reagan, 1 under Bush the First and 2 under Clinton. These lasted anywhere from 1 to 21 days. All ended up being no big thing. In my opinion there is way too much hyperbole over this one coming from both sides.

    Fact is most Americans are going about their daily business as usual as the government being shutdown isn't effecting them. Now from the political partisan die hards, you think the world has come to an end. If our politicians in Washington would start putting country over party, then perhaps our problems as a nation could get solved. But as long as it is more important to those in D.C. to be Republicans and Democrats instead of Americans, this country will flounder and soon give up its ghost.[/QUOT

    If recent history is any indication, they'll continue in DC doing as they are currently doing... blaming the other side all the way down to the bitter end! ....

    Greetings, Pero.

  9. #19
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    Re: How Bad Could it Be? (Shutdown/Debt Limit)

    Quote Originally Posted by CalGun View Post
    Could you explain how we could default with monthly revenues of $250 billion and interest costs of 33 billion?
    the way i understand it, we could go on short term by diverting money from other things to pay the most important bills. there are also a few treasury options that don't seem to be on firm legal footing. however, the biggest danger is perception; it's almost certain to lower our credit rating, which means more interest. if that happens, we will be in a situation where taxes will be increased. also, if our currency is in question, the globe starts looking for the next best option. this cannot be allowed to happen.

  10. #20
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    Re: How Bad Could it Be? (Shutdown/Debt Limit)

    Dems cave in again, allowing the debt to be used as a political tool?

    You mean, "normally" overspending and skyrocketing national debt should have nothing to do with politics?

    Then I am just curious, what all these politicians are supposed to do over there, in Congress? Hold hands and sing The Star-Spangled Banner all day long?

    The level and pattern of federal spending is the number one issue in the country right now. And Dems better "cave in again", and allow some minimal responsibility to seep in.

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