View Poll Results: Will ObamaCare reduce healthcare costs and insurance preminums?

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  • Yes, ObamaCare will reduce healthcare costs and insurance premiums

    19 26.03%
  • No, ObamaCare will increase healthcare costs and insurance premiums

    45 61.64%
  • IDK/other

    9 12.33%
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Thread: Will ObamaCare reduce healthcare costs and insurance premiums?

  1. #51
    Student francois60's Avatar
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    Re: Will ObamaCare reduce healthcare costs and insurance premiums?

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    If it's repealed there's no way a more liberal bill passes...even if "Medicare for all" is insanely popular.
    You're right about the polling, but there's often more to it than that. Medicare for all would have been easy to pass, the reason it didn't is because 80% of Americans like the insurance they have. What people actually want is Medicare for all, plus they get to keep their insurance, which isn't realistic.

    Not to mention Medicare for all is not fiscally possible. Medicaid for all is possible, and ACA expands Medicaid greatly.

  2. #52
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    Re: Will ObamaCare reduce healthcare costs and insurance premiums?

    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    As much as it goes against my normal line of thinking, I support universal healthcare. I also think that Obamacare is just a step in that direction, though I agree with your point that it would be a mighty hurdle to overcome.

    Is it ideal? No. I just think it's the best possible option out of a lot of crappy options. My biggest consternation about Obamacare is that I feel it delays the inevitable. I'd rather we just suck it up now and get it done.
    Sorry to do three straight posts, but I had to respond to this. It's either ACA or nothing, forever. Once a country has universal health care, the basic outline doesn't change. Countries that established multi-payer stay multi-payer, countries that establish single-payer stay single-payer. ACA is multi-payer. Assuming it succeeds well enough, it's what we'll have for the next 100 years.

  3. #53
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    Re: Will ObamaCare reduce healthcare costs and insurance premiums?

    Quote Originally Posted by francois60 View Post
    But the previous complaint was that we needed this in part to reduce the burden on taxpayers of uncompensated emergency room care. Now we're giving the same people full insurance.
    The costs of uninsured visits were carried by hospitals and ultimately insurance companies. Hospitals aren't allowed to turn someone away that would die otherwise but the government doesn't cover the cost.

    Not to mention, ER care is expensive as hell to provide the same level of care a regular physician does. It's also the only way the uninsured can get medical care. It's a lose lose as in...yes in the end everybody is paying to some extent but it's MUCH cheaper to pay on the front end subsidizing someone's insurance than it is to pay the costs after hospitals/insurance companies and everyone in between gets their cut on the costs of providing healthcare to the uninsured.
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

  4. #54
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    Re: Will ObamaCare reduce healthcare costs and insurance premiums?

    Yes. I base this off evidence.


  5. #55
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    Re: Will ObamaCare reduce healthcare costs and insurance premiums?

    Quote Originally Posted by francois60 View Post
    You're right about the polling, but there's often more to it than that. Medicare for all would have been easy to pass, the reason it didn't is because 80% of Americans like the insurance they have. What people actually want is Medicare for all, plus they get to keep their insurance, which isn't realistic.

    Not to mention Medicare for all is not fiscally possible. Medicaid for all is possible, and ACA expands Medicaid greatly.
    I kind of agree with you....most Americans do prefer their current insurance but people that receive Medicare actually poll higher than people that have private insurance. Medicare is nice...there's a lot of things you don't need to worry about. It's go to the hospital if you need to. No getting justifications or fighting with insurance companies.

    I also agree it wouldn't be quite "Medicare for all". That's a catchy term used but it would be closer to government health insurance where you pay a rate based on income etc.
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

  6. #56
    Student francois60's Avatar
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    Re: Will ObamaCare reduce healthcare costs and insurance premiums?

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    The costs of uninsured visits were carried by hospitals and ultimately insurance companies. Hospitals aren't allowed to turn someone away that would die otherwise but the government doesn't cover the cost.
    So money hasn't been saved, the cost has just been shifted from hospitals and insurance companies to taxpayers.

    Not to mention, ER care is expensive as hell to provide the same level of care a regular physician does. It's also the only way the uninsured can get medical care. It's a lose lose as in...yes in the end everybody is paying to some extent but it's MUCH cheaper to pay on the front end subsidizing someone's insurance than it is to pay the costs after hospitals/insurance companies and everyone in between gets their cut on the costs of providing healthcare to the uninsured.
    Again, that's an argument with spotty evidence in support of it. The studies on whether preventive care saves money or costs money are contradictory, and national health systems seem to come firmly down on the side of favoring emergency room care over preventive.

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    Re: Will ObamaCare reduce healthcare costs and insurance premiums?

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post

    I also agree it wouldn't be quite "Medicare for all". That's a catchy term used but it would be closer to government health insurance where you pay a rate based on income etc.
    The main difference is that Medicare is more generous to providers than a national single payer plan could ever be. Medicare ALONE is fiscally unsustainable, extending it to the whole country is simply impossible unless the provider payments are cut down to Canadian or British levels.

    Now if we're starting in 1950 or even 1970, that system might work for most Americans, but in 2013, an awful lot of Americans have really generous insurance plans, especially union workers. Getting them to give that up would be impossible.

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    Re: Will ObamaCare reduce healthcare costs and insurance premiums?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    Yes. I base this off evidence.
    I'd love for you to share it, because everything I've seen indicates otherwise.

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    Re: Will ObamaCare reduce healthcare costs and insurance premiums?



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    Re: Will ObamaCare reduce healthcare costs and insurance premiums?


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