View Poll Results: Should owning property be a requirement to vote

Voters
100. You may not vote on this poll
  • yes, only property owners should vote

    10 10.00%
  • no, let everyone vote

    90 90.00%
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Thread: Only property owners should vote

  1. #421
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    Re: Only property owners should vote

    Quote Originally Posted by sawyerloggingon View Post
    You don't pay fed taxes until you reach a certain income level. Working after school flipping burgers does not reach that threshold, you get virtually all your taxes back. To be a tax payer worthy of voting you should be a net contributor which a very large portion of this society is not. 47% of America pays no income tax and they should not vote until they do.
    Oh, so now working and being a productive member of society and having taxes withheld isn't enough. Even for adults. You have to leave some with the government.

    Another exception carved out to exclude those who might vote in a way you would dislike.

    How about new military E-1s who also probably get back virtually everything withheld?

    Ever so slowly the curtain is being lifted and the ugly truth is being exposed.
    If you claim sexual harassment to be wrong, yet you defend anyone on your side for any reason,
    then you are a hypocrite and everything you say on the matter is just babble.

  2. #422
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    Re: Only property owners should vote

    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    Why unemployment? Even though submitted by your previous employer(s), it was still a part of the cost of your overall compensation. Hence, you did pay into it yourself.

    Why (automatically) food stamps? For many it's merely a supplement for people who have low-paying jobs and still otherwise pay taxes.
    Fair questions.

    1. As we saw prior to--I think it must have been the last mid-term elections--there was some debate about extending unemployment benefits out to 99 weeks. It became a point of debate in the last elections. Benefits did get extended to the 99 weeks and people were able to obtain far more than what they contributed. A better way would be to reduce taxes so people could put away money to support themselves in case they find themselves unemployed.

    2. More people are on food-stamps than ever before and stories of it's abuse are plentiful. As such, if you're on food-stamps you don't get to vote.
    "Liberalism is a doctrine fostered by a delusional and illogical people and rabidly promoted by the mainstream media and ruling elite which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end." - unknown

  3. #423
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    Re: Only property owners should vote

    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    I'm not saying you have to be employed to be able to vote. I am saying voting should be commensurate with how independently you manage your own life and affairs. You can be independently broke as hell (meaning your in a **** situation but you're not accepting a status a dependence on the collective), and these people should get a full vote. Some people who accept dependence are only accepting, say, maybe 10% dependence (i.e. they still pay for 90% of their own stuff and manage 90% of their own affairs), and these folks should therefore get 9/10ths of of one vote.



    Government administers these welfare programs, and welfare programs are not rights, they're entitlements. Applying for welfare is an act of saying "I can't do it on my own right now, I need to depend on the collective to get by right now," which is akin to a partial reversion to the dependency of being a minor. Minors have rights too, but not the same ones as independent adults, and for good reason. To be consistent, reversion to a status of dependency should be commensurate with reduced rights. That's what being a dependent is all about. That should extend to voting. We don't let minors participate fully in democratic process and for good and obvious reason. Not giving societal dependents full voting power makes total sense too, as a most basic protection against the majority voting themselves money from the treasury.
    No kidding, what you're missing is that voting IS a right, not to be removed by government force due to arbitrary reasons.

  4. #424
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    Re: Only property owners should vote

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    No kidding, what you're missing is that voting IS a right, not to be removed by government force due to arbitrary reasons.
    It's not arbitrary, and every other right we have can also be suspended or even terminated by government for valid reasons (and via due process). This would be right along those same lines. If you commit violent crimes, your liberty is suspended, as well as your lawful right to own firearms, and other property. If you commit very violent or heinous crimes, the state can even terminate your right to life.

    And if you're a dependent, your rights are different from non-dependents. This move would improve consistency in a specific area where we are particularly inconsistent.
    Last edited by Neomalthusian; 09-26-13 at 05:55 PM.

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    Re: Only property owners should vote

    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    It's not arbitrary, and every other right we have can also be suspended or even terminated by government for valid reasons (and via due process). This would be right along those same lines.
    Nope, I don't want the government to have the power to strip any of us of any of our rights.

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    Re: Only property owners should vote

    It's stupid to give the entity who would LOVE the opportunity to strip us of our rights, ESPECIALLY the poor people, the power to do it. What's wrong with you people? Only 4.1% of the population are collecting welfare. That voting block does NOT carry a lot of power obviously.

    Welfare Statistics | Statistic Brain

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    Re: Only property owners should vote

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    Nope, I don't want the government to have the power to strip any of us of any of our rights.
    Then you're an anarchist.

  8. #428
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    Re: Only property owners should vote

    Quote Originally Posted by The Baron View Post
    Fair questions.

    1. As we saw prior to--I think it must have been the last mid-term elections--there was some debate about extending unemployment benefits out to 99 weeks. It became a point of debate in the last elections. Benefits did get extended to the 99 weeks and people were able to obtain far more than what they contributed. A better way would be to reduce taxes so people could put away money to support themselves in case they find themselves unemployed.

    2. More people are on food-stamps than ever before and stories of it's abuse are plentiful. As such, if you're on food-stamps you don't get to vote.
    1. That was more a political decision that shouldn't affect the individual (regarding this issue). The individual is more of a pawn in stuff like that. The concept remains.

    Then you have people like myself. I worked for the same employer for 21 years when the economy caught up with me and I got laid off. (I wasn't the only one) The last recession hit the construction industry hard in California and that was me. I collected unemployment for awhile. I think I paid my share over 21 years.

    2. Again, this was a political decision, IMO. The great expansion of benefits has concerned me greatly, and I do believe we have gone beyond what is truly needed, and I would prefer that it be scaled back. But again at the same time I don't like the idea of penalizing people who are nothing but pawns in a bigger political game.
    If you claim sexual harassment to be wrong, yet you defend anyone on your side for any reason,
    then you are a hypocrite and everything you say on the matter is just babble.

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    Re: Only property owners should vote

    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    Then you're an anarchist.
    Lol, Okay if you say so. I've been called worse.

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    Re: Only property owners should vote

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    Lol, Okay if you say so. I've been called worse.
    If the government cannot suspend or terminate any of our rights for any reason, then there is no government. Government can suspend or terminate virtually any right via due process. Liberty is suspended via incarceration and regulations. Property is suspended by legal penalties and judicial processes. Life is terminated via the death penalty.

    Discounting the weight of a person's vote based on the extent to which they independently manage their own adult affairs is not arbitrary at all. It is much less arbitrary than having zero voting power at age 17 to suddenly having 100% of one vote at age 18.

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