View Poll Results: Is the Revolt of the Masses an Accurate Picture of Society

Voters
28. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes

    6 21.43%
  • No

    14 50.00%
  • Other/In Between

    5 17.86%
  • I don't know

    3 10.71%
Page 4 of 5 FirstFirst ... 2345 LastLast
Results 31 to 40 of 46

Thread: Revolt of the Masses

  1. #31
    Sage
    Perotista's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Georgia
    Last Seen
    Today @ 12:22 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    17,938
    Blog Entries
    25

    Re: Revolt of the Masses

    Quote Originally Posted by Anagram View Post
    I just finished reading Jose Ortega y Gasset's book, The Revolt of the Masses. He basically contends that there are two types of people in the world, the mass and the minority. The minority are the truly talented people who also put great demand on themselves to make advancements in science, philosophy, and politics. The mass are those without the talent or drive to do such. He's quick to point out that this has nothing to do with class, as there is minority and mass in both the upper and lower classes.

    Ortega sees a growing problem among the masses due to the rise of democracy. With the growing belief that everyone is equal comes a belief among the masses that their unexamined opinions are inherently equal in many areas to the minority. Those who have spent little time thinking about or studying politics believe that their political opinions carry as much intellectual weight as those who have been doing so for thirty years. They don't recognize that there are people in some areas who know better than they do. The problem that Ortega sees with this is that because the masses greatly outnumber the minority, politicians wanting power will begin to appeal to these unexamined opinions of the minority, leading to people who don't really know what they're doing to direct the political conversation. Writing in the 1930's Ortega sees this as the reason behind the rise of power of fascism in Italy and Bolshevism in Russia, condemning both movements. He definitely does not reject democracy and is a strong proponent of that political system over all others, but he does see this as a serious problem with it that needs to be addressed.

    Especially a problem for Ortega are those that he calls the specialists. These are the people who are legitimately knowledgeable in one area. They are usually college educated people who really are experts in their narrow field. However, this knowledge generally leads to them believing they are experts in other fields, not usually deferring to those who are actually experts in them. Ortega sees them as often more stubborn and more arrogant than the regular masses in projecting their opinions in fields they are clearly ignorant of. Ortega writes the book specifically to challenge these people to examine their political ideals the same way they examine knowledge in their own narrow field of work.

    So my question is, do you think that Ortega's work is a generally accurate view of society? Is he correct about the categories of mass and minority and the relationship between them? Do most people stubbornly view their opinions as inherently equal to those who know better than them?
    pretty much. That is what we have in Washington today, a minority who belives they know what is best for the majority. The problem is we have a bunch of lawyers, college educated people in one field trying to run every other field available. They are no more an expert in those other fields than you or I. Theirs is always a top down approach with little to no field testing. They reside in the field of theory and not in reality. They are there to please the lobbyist and those who donate all the money to them with the American people as the guinea pigs whether they like it or not.

    We could change all of this, but we won't. We have become fans of political parties and back them no matter what whether it is good for the masses or not.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

  2. #32
    Jedi Master
    Captain America's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Wisconsin
    Last Seen
    Today @ 03:08 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    18,671

    Re: Revolt of the Masses

    I don't think a handful of Tea Party/FOXNews whiner types equates to any "Revolt of the Masses."

    It's GREAT to be me. --- "45% liberal/55% conservative"
    Diplomacy is the art of saying 'nice doggy" until you can find a gun.

  3. #33
    Sage
    shrubnose's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Europe
    Last Seen
    11-29-17 @ 03:46 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    18,851
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Revolt of the Masses

    Quote Originally Posted by avatar View Post
    I fear those who believe that they and the rest of the minority should have more input into government than the masses.



    I totally agree with that idea.

  4. #34
    On Vacation
    joko104's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 10:41 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    31,568
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Revolt of the Masses

    I see the "masses" as becoming totally emotionally dependent submissive sheeple who believe the goal in life is to best figure all the ways life is unfair, excuses for failure, and to determine all the things emotionally and physically wrong with themselves as part of those excuses - all self-degradation, self-pity and self-victimized people determined to remain nobodies.

  5. #35
    Global Moderator
    The Hammer of Chaos
    Goshin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Dixie
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 11:54 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    44,159

    Re: Revolt of the Masses

    Autocracy: One man tells everyone what to do.

    Oligarchy: A small group of men tell everyone what to do.

    Plutocracy: The richest people tell everyone what to do.

    Democracy: A show of hands tells everyone what to do.



    Liberty: Everyone decides for themselves what to do.

    Fiddling While Rome Burns
    ISIS: Carthago Delenda Est
    "I used to roll the dice; see the fear in my enemies' eyes... listen as the crowd would sing, 'now the old king is dead, Long Live the King.'.."

  6. #36
    Global Moderator
    Moderator
    Anagram's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    St. Louis MO
    Last Seen
    Today @ 03:14 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Conservative
    Posts
    6,191

    Re: Revolt of the Masses

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    I think the OP just describes how people fall into a bell curve, and then complains about it. People fancying themselves to be more exceptional than they really are seems like a much bigger problem than the fact that geniuses are rare.
    Well that seems to me to be part of what Ortega is arguing. People have a higher opinion of themselves and their opinions than they really are, and that this causes problems.
    There should be Instant Runoff Voting

  7. #37
    Sage
    Navy Pride's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Pacific NW
    Last Seen
    05-07-15 @ 02:01 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    39,883

    Re: Revolt of the Masses

    I think if there ever was a time it is now under the Obama Administration....To pull it off you would need the military and I believe there are powers there that just might go for it. That said I hope it never happens but I feel the frustration our military feels in the way Obama treats them.
    "God Bless Our Troops in Harms Way."

  8. #38
    Sage
    clownboy's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Oregon
    Last Seen
    08-17-16 @ 10:31 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    26,087

    Re: Revolt of the Masses

    OMG! The masses are so revolting.

  9. #39
    Sage
    Cephus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    CA
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 09:38 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Conservative
    Posts
    29,792

    Re: Revolt of the Masses

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    That is precisely how liberals are viewed, and a lot of why I disagree with them. Frankly I think it's mostly true by the Left's support for income redistribution and the movement in schools to play to self-esteem instead of achievement. If you really support equal opportunity, then you have to put an end to the notion that everyone must have the same. Equal opportunity is not about having the same, but earning it. There's a big difference in my book.
    I really do see the support for equality of outcome in schools, liberals believe that minorities and the poor are disenfranchised, therefore we need to cater to them in testing and expectations, such that a C-level minority may be equivalent to a B-level or higher non-minority. I've seen that suggested several times before.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

    Blog me! YouTube me! VidMe me!

  10. #40
    Sage
    Lord Tammerlain's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 08:48 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    10,432

    Re: Revolt of the Masses

    Quote Originally Posted by Gathomas88 View Post
    I wasn't suggesting anything so discriminatory; only that putting some sort of test or brief course in place that a person must pass before being allowed to vote might not be a bad idea. The process could conceivably be handled in a fashion somewhat similar to obtaining a driver's license or citizenship without unduly limiting any particular group's presence in the electorate.
    I know you were not suggesting something so discriminatory, but given human nature it is what I expect it would fall to. Re the literacy tests for voting that prevented primarily blacks from voting in the US. Require such tests today, and the people in charge could certainly direct those administering the vote to ensure group A is prevented from voting as much as possible. Over time Group A would be ignored by the government as they would not effect the vote to any real degree

    Requiring that a person actually demonstrate some level of knowledge and initiative concerning the political process before taking part in shaping any of a given nation's policies could do wonders for cutting down on the "low information" riff-raff, so to speak.
    And what is to stop the tests becoming a farce designed to limit the vote of certain groups. The integrity of the politicians? The integrity of those in charge of the voting system. History has shown that such tests have been used by politicians without integrity to push their own agenda rather then ensure the best people vote, but only their people vote

    Perhaps, but is that really all that big a problem in comparison to what we see today? I'd take a highly competent oligarchy elevating a nation's fortunes over an unruly mob running things into the ground any day.

    China is hardly "democratic" and it has seen more growth, development, and modernization over the course of the last few decades than most Western nations have seen in their entire histories.


    A highly competent oligarchy in a ethno/cultural homogenous state could work provided corruption among that group was contained (see china to a degree), but any minority groups are likely to be discriminated against, by the politicians, the public and the government. A strong constitution and bill of rights would not protect them. See China and history in the US among other historical examples
    Happy Hanukkah Cheerfull Kwanzaa
    Happy Christmas Merry New Year Festivus for the rest of us

Page 4 of 5 FirstFirst ... 2345 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •