View Poll Results: Is blaming the victim a problem in our society?

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  • That's the understatement of the year. YES.

    10 35.71%
  • Somewhat, yeah.

    10 35.71%
  • Maybe, but there are far worse problems than this.

    3 10.71%
  • No. Jedem das Seine.

    5 17.86%
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Thread: Blaming the Victim

  1. #21
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    Re: Blaming the Victim

    Quote Originally Posted by aberrant85 View Post
    The most obvious example is the GOP cutting the food stamps program, which they portray as going to the lazy, when in reality they are used by the working poor and the increases in usage are directly because of the recession.
    ...that almost is every case goes to families with children too young to work even if they wanted to.
    Having opinions all over the map is a good sign of a person capable of autonomous thinking. Felix -2011

  2. #22
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    Re: Blaming the Victim

    Quote Originally Posted by Smeagol View Post
    IMHO, unfair. That's another problem for another thread but automatically deciding to agree with or disagree with a position not based on its merits but rather on how we've pre-defined the poster is in my opinion a microcosm of one big problem with American politics today. In other words, it doesn't matter that much what a given problem is. What matters is finding out who's for or against it and then side with or against, as the case may be, team over principle.
    Stop blaming me. I am a victim.

  3. #23
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    Re: Blaming the Victim

    Depends on what subject matter we are discussing. In many specific cases, yes, it is an enormous problem. Others, not so much.
    Michael J Petrilli-"Is School Choice Enough?"-A response to the recent timidity of American conservatives toward education reform. https://nationalaffairs.com/publicat...-choice-enough

  4. #24
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    Re: Blaming the Victim

    Quote Originally Posted by Phys251 View Post
    Is blaming the victim a problem in our society?
    I think in some cases solutions can be offered but blame assignment can cloud the issue and hinder people from considering better solutions because they're have been made to be preoccupied with being offended and defensive. I'll be the first to stand up and say I've been guilty of clouding issues by causing people to refuse to consider what I think are really good solutions because instead of being able to clearly see the value in my recommendations, as a consequence of how I explained the problem(s) they were too offended to think clearly about my suggestions. Proverbs 15:1
    Having opinions all over the map is a good sign of a person capable of autonomous thinking. Felix -2011

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    Re: Blaming the Victim

    Quote Originally Posted by Fisher View Post
    Stop blaming me. I am a victim.
    Having opinions all over the map is a good sign of a person capable of autonomous thinking. Felix -2011

  6. #26
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    Re: Blaming the Victim

    Quote Originally Posted by Gipper View Post
    Valid explanation: We're experiencing a lull in the economy, jobs are going away, and I'm having trouble fulfilling expectations of employers.

    Excuse: Rich people suck, they're the reason why I don't have a job!
    So that explains how you view what they have to say for themselves. What about what others say on their behalf? In other words, if I think that a large part of my kids bad attitude today is because his Dad was a dick to him, chances are that while I still expect him to behave himself, I will probably address that behavior in a different way then if he just woke up in a ****ty little mood. So if someone is raised in poverty, got a ****ty education, their parents gave up a long time ago and raised them believing there was no hope, their community is riddled with violence etc... If that someone behaves in a way I deem anti-social or destructive to others, I will probably give that person a little more room and approach them differently. Because I would first have to convince them that not only is there opportunity for a better life but that they are capable of achieving it and until they believe that their lives stay the same. Those to me are examples of conditions and legit reasons why someone ends up failing themselves, some call those excuses. I am not naive enough to believe that everyone one who fails does so for these reasons but I do believe there are many lives that get lost in hopelessness for these very reasons that would not be if they were convinced about other options and their ability to achieve them.
    "Judge a man by his questions rather than his answers" - Voltaire
    "There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow men. True nobility lies in being superior to your former self" -Hemingway

  7. #27
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    Re: Blaming the Victim

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    and as DVS is trying to deny, there is a lot of blaming people for being born poor.
    Blaming people for being born poor? Nope, what they did for themselves afterwards, sure. See, here's the deal. I was born into a "working poor" family. We were "working poor" most of my childhood. We never too food stamps and we never sat around waiting for the government to do something for us. I started working when I was 13. Since then I have bought my own clothes, shoes and I purchased my own vehicle and paid for the insurance starting at age 15.

    I am where I am today, not rich by any means, because of choices I made. If your born poor and you want to play the "victim" the only thing you are a victim of is your own poor choices and your unwillingness not to take opportunities to better yourself.
    Only a fool measures equality by results and not opportunities.

  8. #28
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    Re: Blaming the Victim

    Quote Originally Posted by opendebate View Post
    So that explains how you view what they have to say for themselves. What about what others say on their behalf? In other words, if I think that a large part of my kids bad attitude today is because his Dad was a dick to him, chances are that while I still expect him to behave himself, I will probably address that behavior in a different way then if he just woke up in a ****ty little mood. So if someone is raised in poverty, got a ****ty education, their parents gave up a long time ago and raised them believing there was no hope, their community is riddled with violence etc... If that someone behaves in a way I deem anti-social or destructive to others, I will probably give that person a little more room and approach them differently. Because I would first have to convince them that not only is there opportunity for a better life but that they are capable of achieving it and until they believe that their lives stay the same. Those to me are examples of conditions and legit reasons why someone ends up failing themselves, some call those excuses. I am not naive enough to believe that everyone one who fails does so for these reasons but I do believe there are many lives that get lost in hopelessness for these very reasons that would not be if they were convinced about other options and their ability to achieve them.
    We still live in a "land of opportunity" where social mobilization is as high, if not higher, than anywhere else in the world. If someone wants something badly enough, odds are likely that they'll get it. Poor people will have a tougher time in primary school, but once college time comes around, they have so many tickets out.

    Everybody runs the same race. Some people have better starting points, but all participants have a reachable finish line.

    If you're a poor minority, scholarship money is practically THROWN at you. If you're a black female, all you have to do is schedule a civil service exam, put down your name, check the "African-American" and "female" boxes, and show up next Monday. If that's not enough, start kickin' around words like "Affirmative Action" to sweeten your pot.

    On top of that, there is nothing keeping children (or adults, for that matter) from self-improving. Hell, in school I learned more from myself reading books and satiating my intellectual curiosity than I did from listing to some apple-polisher drone on in her own cute little way.

    Even though I'm a white male, I was latchkey since 6 with a mother who had to keep a home and food on the table with alimony checks and factory job paychecks. Ask me if I got grants for college, I dare you...

    This is why I'm posting as someone with an MBA instead of an excuse. I wanted better for myself, and by God I went out and got it.

  9. #29
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    Re: Blaming the Victim

    Quote Originally Posted by Gipper View Post
    We still live in a "land of opportunity" where social mobilization is as high, if not higher, than anywhere else in the world. If someone wants something badly enough, odds are likely that they'll get it. Poor people will have a tougher time in primary school, but once college time comes around, they have so many tickets out.

    Everybody runs the same race. Some people have better starting points, but all participants have a reachable finish line.

    If you're a poor minority, scholarship money is practically THROWN at you. If you're a black female, all you have to do is schedule a civil service exam, put down your name, check the "African-American" and "female" boxes, and show up next Monday. If that's not enough, start kickin' around words like "Affirmative Action" to sweeten your pot.

    On top of that, there is nothing keeping children (or adults, for that matter) from self-improving. Hell, in school I learned more from myself reading books and satiating my intellectual curiosity than I did from listing to some apple-polisher drone on in her own cute little way.

    Even though I'm a white male, I was latchkey since 6 with a mother who had to keep a home and food on the table with alimony checks and factory job paychecks. Ask me if I got grants for college, I dare you...

    This is why I'm posting as someone with an MBA instead of an excuse. I wanted better for myself, and by God I went out and got it.
    No, we're not number 1 for social mobility. In fact, Canada, Spain, France, and I believe Australia have us beat. http://carnegie.org/fileadmin/Media/...it_2012_v4.pdf
    Social mobility: the charts that shame Britain | News | theguardian.com I hate to break it to you, but we're not the shining city on the hill we used to be. The only thing we have left to feel superior about is our military. Big whoop, we're the best at blowing people up.
    Last edited by sbrettt; 09-23-13 at 03:03 PM.
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  10. #30
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    Re: Blaming the Victim

    Quote Originally Posted by sbrettt View Post
    No, we're not number 1 for social mobility. In fact, Canada, Spain, France, and I believe Australia have us beat. http://carnegie.org/fileadmin/Media/...it_2012_v4.pdf
    Social mobility: the charts that shame Britain | News | theguardian.com I hate to break it to you, but we're not the shining city on the hill we used to be. The only thing we have left to feel superior about is our military. Big whoop, we're the best at blowing people up.
    I figured it may not be the highest (since there are so many countries out there, many of which are not in an economically bad place right now), but I'd still contend with anyone who says that it's not high.

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