View Poll Results: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to abort his baby?

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  • Yes, but only during the first 20 weeks, same as a woman.

    3 2.97%
  • Yes, but only during the initial period when a non-invasive technique works.

    0 0%
  • No, but he should have the right to be legally relieved of all responsibility.

    50 49.50%
  • NO! Only the woman has this right and he remains responsible.

    21 20.79%
  • I oppose all abortion, so neither have the right.

    22 21.78%
  • I Don't Know.

    5 4.95%
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Thread: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

  1. #451
    Dungeon Master
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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by JayDubya View Post
    What kind of sociopathic monster has her own kid killed?

    By comparison, that's pretty tame.
    He's no different if he coerces her to have an abortion.

  2. #452
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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Child support is the right of the child, not the mother.
    That is what our laws currently are. They need to catch up.
    It is what needs to be changed as he should not be burdened if he does not want the burden. The same choice she has.
    It is only fair, and equal.


    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Consent to sex is consent to have a child. Therefor a man's choice is made when he has sex and all is fair and equal.
    Wrong!
    Consent to sex is not consent to a child.


    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    That sperm is legaly a gift the woman may do with as she pleases, or that child sipport is a right of the child parents cannot sign away?
    And again. As a gift it solely belongs to her. Her choice of what she does with it should have no say/sway over what him, as it no longer belongs to him.
    “The law is reason, free from passion.”
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  3. #453
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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Adverse View Post
    Should a man have an absolute right to have his baby aborted?
    I can't imagine why.

    In the alternative, should he be granted relief from all legal responsibility if it is his clearly stated wish to abort but the woman decides not to?
    "Paper abortions" are a terrible idea.

    Let me preface my remarks with this disclaimer; I am Pro-Choice and I support a woman’s absolute right to choose to have an abortion for several reasons, including the fact it is the woman who must endure the pregnancy to carry the child to term, and then follows the lifelong responsibility to raise and care for any child born.
    With you so far...

    The dilemma occurs when the woman unilaterally decides to have the baby, even when the male does not wish to accept that long-term responsibility.
    Not really a dilemma, just don't have sex with said woman.

    In a recent news report, a young man was so desperate not to have a child that he tricked his girlfriend into taking a morning after pill. Now I do not support or condone this action, but it does bring up the thesis issue for me…why does the male partner have no say in a decision to keep the baby?
    You do realize pregnancy is a medical condition that can only affect women?

    When a woman makes the unilateral decision to keep the baby this then compels lifelong legal and emotional obligations on the part of the unwilling father. This creates resentment and recriminations in both parties. By attempting to force the man to marry and/or support both her and the child this only serves to create a negative environment for all concerned, especially for any child to grow up in.
    Who forces people to marry one another?

    Also, men have no obligation to support the mother of the child, only the child itself.

    Since we now have a simple method of aborting in the early stages of the first trimester, without needing an invasive surgery, why should the absolute choice to keep the baby reside with the mother?
    Said fetus, not baby, resides inside the mother's body.

    If it does, why can’t the man be legally relieved of further responsibility to both parties?
    Why can't a man sign off on his obligations to his child? Is this what you're asking?

    I have offered several voting options, please pick and then explain what do you think? I am especially interested in arguments for why the woman has the sole right to keep the child while making the man permanently responsible.
    Life just ain't fair, is it?

  4. #454
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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    Try not paying taxes and come back with that question.
    Yeah, I realize taxes are involuntary. That doesn't really answer my question.

  5. #455
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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbuti View Post
    Sex (excluding rape) requires mutual consent.
    Entering my house requires "mutual consent," what you do in it requires MY consent.

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    So, if I have this straight, you've said you'd jump in the water to save a kid a from drowning *derisive snort* because you're just so pro-human (and me a "human-hater") but when it comes to money, then **** the kid, let him starve. On the other hand you flame the **** out of people that wanted to save their dogs, but it it comes to saving their money, well that's different. Lol.
    I thought you would bring that unrealated issue up. Typical deceptive tactics; misdirection and appeals to over-emotionalism. Tut tut!

    The issue is abortion and why a male has no opt-out rights when a woman unilaterally decides to keep a child. The child will not die if the man does not participate in child support. The woman will care for it, her family will help, and we have a whole system of social welfare to make sure the child is given support.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbuti View Post
    No, there was no answer to my question in your post. All your post contained other than the part I was addressing was a failed analogy which doesn't even correlate to the discussion. But hey, if it was your intent to avoid answering the questions asked -- congrats, you succeeded.
    Again, repeating the same thing over and over serves no purpose. read for content, or move on.
    If I stop responding it doesn't mean I've conceded the point or agree with you. It only means I've made my point and I don't mind you having the last word. Please wait a few minutes before "quoting" me. I often correct errors for a minute or two after I post before the final product is ready.

  6. #456
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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    What you're saying does not make her choice "independent of his" at all. If you're truly pro-choice, I'd think you'd want her to be free to make the choice without financial coercion being a part of it. This is more pro-abortion than pro-choice.
    There is no coercion. The choices are independent of each other.
    If she wants to have a child and support it, it would be all her choice. No one else, just hers. No one is saying she can't make that decision.

    If he also wants to provided support and be it's father, he can make that choice, or not. His choice.
    There is no coercion of any of them.
    “The law is reason, free from passion.”
    Aristotle
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  7. #457
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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    This is really hilarious. You get all mad at men for looking at a half naked woman but you're completely fine with men walking away from any responsibility when it comes to the kids and leaving it all on her. Knowing your feelings about kids, I'm not surprised, I guess.
    While I certainly agree that a father actually abandoning the new family he just created through voluntary action is both despicable and likely to result in more abortions, more kids in the adoption system, more poverty and hardship - a real **** deal all around - at least it's logically consistent with the view that a mom can unilaterally and entirely abdicate responsibility by hiring a killer.

    So yeah, it's awful but at least folks who believe as she does are consistent in their awfulness... or something.

  8. #458
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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    This is really hilarious. You get all mad at men for looking at a half naked woman but you're completely fine with men walking away from any responsibility when it comes to the kids and leaving it all on her. Knowing your feelings about kids, I'm not surprised, I guess.
    I've never gotten mad for anyone looking at anyone. Just another one of your strawmen.

    Anyone who has rights has responsibilities. Again, the fact that you argue against this is yet another wormhole in your supposedly conservative ideals.

    As I've told you, I feel that way about abortions as well. Every man I've ever been with knows where I stand. Their only choice is to accept it or not. As such, I would never accept any monetary assistance. If I'm short on cash, that's my problem. I never gave him a choice, so I certainly wouldn't have the audacity to make him pay for mine.

  9. #459
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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    She forces nothing. He accepted the burdon when he chose to have sex. He should be a man and stand by his decisions.
    Wrong!

    And consent to sex is not consent to a child.
    “The law is reason, free from passion.”
    Aristotle
    (≚ᄌ≚)

  10. #460
    Dungeon Master
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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Adverse View Post
    I thought you would bring that unrealated issue up. Typical deceptive tactics; misdirection and appeals to over-emotionalism. Tut tut!

    The issue is abortion and why a male has no opt-out rights when a woman unilaterally decides to keep a child. The child will not die if the man does not participate in child support. The woman will care for it, her family will help, and we have a whole system of social welfare to make sure the child is given support.
    So you think people should sacrifice their beloved pets but not their beloved money. Got it.
    Last edited by X Factor; 09-14-13 at 07:54 PM.

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