View Poll Results: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to abort his baby?

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  • Yes, but only during the first 20 weeks, same as a woman.

    3 2.97%
  • Yes, but only during the initial period when a non-invasive technique works.

    0 0%
  • No, but he should have the right to be legally relieved of all responsibility.

    50 49.50%
  • NO! Only the woman has this right and he remains responsible.

    21 20.79%
  • I oppose all abortion, so neither have the right.

    22 21.78%
  • I Don't Know.

    5 4.95%
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Thread: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

  1. #1111
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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by year2late View Post
    I just have never heard of men being required to pay for cost of pregnancy or delivery. (in a non marriage situation)
    Neither have I, but it doesn't matter.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  2. #1112
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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbuti View Post
    Of course he doesn't have that same right -- he's not the one carrying the embryo. He doesn't deserve the same privileges she's afforded.
    easy enough to reverse. She's not the one paying child support, she doesn't deserve the same privileges (of abandonment) that he is afforded.

    That's not what is being debated here. There are some folks here taking the position that if the woman has the baby, the man should not have to be responsible to support his own child.
    well I and I imagine the vast majority of posters on my side here would disagree (assuming that she did not keep the child a secret precisely in order to avoid such; you might get some disparity there) with that claim - can you show it being argued? Thus far the people you cited did not support your description.

    You have an actual quote?
    Did you not see the earlier citation? Allow me to happily re-post it for you.

    Child support - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Melanie McCulley, a South Carolina attorney coined the term male abortion in 1998, suggesting that a father should be allowed to disclaim his obligations to an unborn child early in the pregnancy.[85] Proponents hold that concept begins with the premise that when an unmarried woman becomes pregnant, she has the option of abortion, adoption, or parenthood; and argues, in the context of legally recognized gender equality, that in the earliest stages of pregnancy the putative (alleged) father should have the same human rights to relinquish all future parental rights and financial responsibility—leaving the informed mother with the same three options.

    McCulley states:

    'When a female determines she is pregnant, she has the freedom to decide if she has the maturity level to undertake the responsibilities of motherhood, if she is financially able to support a child, if she is at a place in her career to take the time to have a child, or if she has other concerns precluding her from carrying the child to term. After weighing her options, the female may choose abortion. Once she aborts the fetus, the female's interests in and obligations to the child are terminated. In stark contrast, the unwed father has no options. His responsibilities to the child begin at conception and can only be terminated with the female's decision to abort the fetus or with the mother's decision to give the child up for adoption. Thus, he must rely on the decisions of the female to determine his future. The putative father does not have the luxury, after the fact of conception, to decide that he is not ready for fatherhood. Unlike the female, he has no escape route'.

    McCulley's male abortion concept aims to equalize the legal status of unwed men and unwed women by giving the unwed man by law the ability to 'abort' his rights in and obligations to the child. If a woman decides to keep the child the father may choose not to by severing all ties legally.

    This same concept has been supported by a former president of the feminist organization National Organization for Women, attorney Karen DeCrow, who wrote that "if a woman makes a unilateral decision to bring pregnancy to term, and the biological father does not, and cannot, share in this decision, he should not be liable for 21 years of support...autonomous women making independent decisions about their lives should not expect men to finance their choice."[86]

    The legal concept was tried in Dubay v. Wells and was dismissed. This was not surprising, since legislation in the various jurisdictions currently sets forth guidelines for when child support is owed as well as its amount. Accordingly legislation would be required to change the law to implement McCulley's concept.

  3. #1113
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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    easy enough to reverse. She's not the one paying child support
    That is untrue

    The mother is just as responsible for raising and supporting the child as the father is
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  4. #1114
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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    That is untrue

    The mother is just as responsible for raising and supporting the child as the father is

    Oh sure, she has her own piece of the pie, but hey, she's not specifically paying child support. Ergo, because it's different obviously they shouldn't have equal rights, right?

  5. #1115
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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Oh sure, she has her own piece of the pie, but hey, she's not specifically paying child support. Ergo, because it's different obviously they shouldn't have equal rights, right?
    She is specifically paying to support the child so "Yes, she's paying child support"

    What she isn't paying is "court-ordered child support".

    If the father wasn't such a dead beat, neither would he
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by year2late View Post
    I am curious, are you pro-life?
    This debate is proving to highlight just how hypocritical these pro-lifers are. What their position amounts to is ...

    ... if a woman has an abortion, which they're against, they may not agree with that choice, but at least it gets them out of being a parent and doesn't cost them any money ...

    ... if a woman doesn't have an abortion, which is what they want, then they want to make her pay for choosing to do what they want her to do by not having to support their own child.

    The more I think about it ... their position is not only hypocritical, it's downright misogynistic.

  7. #1117
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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbuti View Post

    The more I think about it ... their position is not only hypocritical, it's downright misogynistic.
    And this surprises you because.........????
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    So, CpWill, are you prolife or are you prochoice?

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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    easy enough to reverse. She's not the one paying child support, she doesn't deserve the same privileges (of abandonment) that he is afforded.
    Of course women pay child support. Where on Earth do you come up with this stuff???

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    well I and I imagine the vast majority of posters on my side here would disagree (assuming that she did not keep the child a secret precisely in order to avoid such; you might get some disparity there) with that claim - can you show it being argued? Thus far the people you cited did not support your description.
    I don't see anybody here trying to get out of financial support for just the period the woman is pregnant and not the 18 years which follow. You are completely lost. But since you believe the majority on your side feel that way, it should be very easy for you to quote some, as I did, who clearly say that.....

  10. #1120
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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    Birth is not a "decision"; it's an "event"
    Okay, since when are people held responsible for the consequences of "events" that they did not personally cause?

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