View Poll Results: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to abort his baby?

Voters
101. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes, but only during the first 20 weeks, same as a woman.

    3 2.97%
  • Yes, but only during the initial period when a non-invasive technique works.

    0 0%
  • No, but he should have the right to be legally relieved of all responsibility.

    50 49.50%
  • NO! Only the woman has this right and he remains responsible.

    21 20.79%
  • I oppose all abortion, so neither have the right.

    22 21.78%
  • I Don't Know.

    5 4.95%
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Thread: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

  1. #1021
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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    Pregnancy is a medical condition
    No it isn't, only if there are associated complications such as gestational diabetes, or pregnancy-induced hypertension. Pregnancy in and of itself is NOT a medical condition. We only refer to it as such in the United States so that our insurance will cover for pregnancy. In other parts of the world, it is certainly not considered a medical condition but a natural process of the female body. Our bodies are built for carrying and delivering children. There is nothing unnatural about it.

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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    No we don't. Currently we allow one gender to duck its' responsibility, and do not allow the other gender to do so. If women are allowed to decide they no longer wish to be held responsible for the child up to a certain point, men ought to be afforded the exact same opportunity.
    Oh boo-hoo. Thank you for proving my point that you are not concerned at all about the child and it's rights but only about your own. The ONLY reason women are allowed abortions is because it is in their body and can cause complications, but an abortion can have it's own complications, therefore the woman does not "escape" the responsibility because HER body can be damaged. Your body is NOT at risk during a pregnancy.

    On the contrary, it has quite a lot to do with abortion. As you put it, the child either has rights (such as the right to life and support from its parents) or it doesn't.
    Actually no, according to the law it has no rights until after it is born. That is when the rights kick in because it is now a separate human entity that no longer feeds off it's mother's body.

    In the meantime, ad hominem does not make your case for you, it just makes you look foolish and desperate.
    The only ones who appear foolish and desperate are you and the other men and women who want to make this into something that it is NOT, and want to punish the innocent while doing it.

  3. #1023
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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Then neither are children being abandoned under the proposal to allow men to divest themselves of parental responsibilities during pregnancy .

    If I knock someone down with my car, I am responsible, as I am if I go in for unprotected sex. That doesn't give me the right to enslave the person I injure, obviously. Choplogic is tedious, it really is.

  4. #1024
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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    Oh boo-hoo. Thank you for proving my point that you are not concerned at all about the child and it's rights but only about your own.
    Apparently you have decided it is safer emotionally for you to engage in personal attacks rather than deal with points as they are actually raised.

    1. As I have pointed out to you multiple times, in fact, my preference is for neither parent to be able to absolve their responsibilities for the child.

    2. That being said, if we are going to do so, then we need to do so on an equitable basis. If the woman can choose up until a certain point that she no longer wishes to be a mother, a man should get to choose up to that point that he no longer wishes to be a father.

    3. That being said, I think that the effects of such a change in the law would actually be long term positive, as it would increase incentives (as you note) to choose ones' sexual partners with an eye towards demonstrated responsibility.

    Actually no, according to the law it has no rights until after it is born.
    Then it has no right to a father, and the father is not denying it its' rights by divesting himself of any future responsibility to the child.

    That is when the rights kick in because it is now a separate human entity that no longer feeds off it's mother's body.
    What, you mean when it's 12 months old?

    The only ones who appear foolish and desperate are you and the other men and women who want to make this into something that it is NOT, and want to punish the innocent while doing it.
    On the contrary - again - I would rather both parents be held responsible for their actions. I merely point out that if we are going to allow people to avoid their responsibilities, we should do so equally rather than give one gender power over the other via the law. It is your continued insistence that those who disagree with you must be coming to it because they wish to personally avoid parental responsibilities (I am happily currently raising 3 children) that is foolish and desperate; as most ad hominem is. It is the standing in of personal attack in the gap created by the lack of a reasonable argument.

  5. #1025
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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Then neither are children being abandoned under the proposal to allow men to divest themselves of parental responsibilities during pregnancy .
    You appear to be thoroughly confused to what this thread is about. It's questioning if men who knock someone up can evade supporting their own child should the mother have the baby. So yes, despite your confusion, there really is a child being abandoned by a deadbeat dad under this pathetic scenario.

  6. #1026
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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbuti View Post
    You appear to be thoroughly confused to what this thread is about. It's questioning if men who knock someone up can evade supporting their own child should the mother have the baby. So yes, despite your confusion, there really is a child being abandoned by a deadbeat dad under this pathetic scenario.
    Actually, the thread is about whether or not a man should be able to force a woman to have an abortion against her will, in order to prevent himself from becoming a parent. The discussion of whether or not men should have the right to refuse paternity is slightly off-topic, and has been presented as a more morally viable alternative to giving a man wrongful legal authority over a woman's medical decisions.

  7. #1027
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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by lizzie View Post
    It's about whether or not men have the right to avoid being a parent, just as women do. If a woman doesn't want to have the responsibility, she can just kill the baby inside her body, as long as she does so before it's born. Men do not have that option.
    Wrong.
    If a woman becomes she can opt for an abortion within the parameters of Roe vs Wade which means before viability except in extreme cases.

    The extreme cases are when a woman's life ,or irreparable damage to a major bodily function would occur if the pregnancy continued or when the fetus would be stillborn or when the fetus is so malformed it would only live a few minutes or hours.
    Those are extreme cases.
    When it comes to matters of reproduce health, Politicians and the religious dogma of another faith should never interfere with religious liberty of an individual or her faith.

  8. #1028
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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    On the contrary, women get two ways to opt out; they can either have the child killed, or give it up for adoption. No such escapes are made available to the father.
    No woman can legally have a born child killed. You are playing word games.
    When it comes to matters of reproduce health, Politicians and the religious dogma of another faith should never interfere with religious liberty of an individual or her faith.

  9. #1029
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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Adverse View Post
    Society has changed to allow abortion. Society can adjust to a male's right to opt-out.
    Women are not allowed to opt out of their responsibility to raise a child, so men should not be allowed to do
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  10. #1030
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    Re: Should a Man have an Absolute Right to Choose to Abort His Baby?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    I am correct.
    No Jerry. You are wrong, as consent to have sex is not consent to a child.

    You have been asked twice so far to provide a SCOTUS case saying so.
    And you have failed at doing so both times - because you can't.
    You can't, because you are wrong.
    Consenting to sex is not consenting to children.


    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    In my view, this will never, ever happen for one simple reason - if the father of a child isn't responsible for the financial wellbeing of his child, the child will, in all likelihood, become a financial burden on the state. The state will never pass a law that makes them the child's supporter by default. And as a taxpayer, you should never support any law that makes the state "daddy".
    Really?
    You think women are going to bring children into the world knowing that she wont be getting any support from the man?
    I am sure some will. But then we will be having those who choose otherwise.

    Then if there is still a problem with women bring children into this world that need to be supported by the state, then we can make further laws to prevent that.

    But back to the fairness. It will happen. Not in my lifetime, but it will happen. Attitudes are, and will continue to change.
    It is not fair for her to subject another to a hardship by her decision.
    “The law is reason, free from passion.”
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