View Poll Results: Is it fair to call Republicans "The Party of Lincoln?"

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  • Yes, Lincoln's policies were ideologically equivalent to the modern GOP's

    7 22.58%
  • No, Lincoln's policies were not consistent to the modern GOP's

    24 77.42%
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Thread: Is it fair to call Republicans "The Party of Lincoln"?

  1. #61
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    Re: Is it fair to call Republicans "The Party of Lincoln"?

    Quote Originally Posted by aberrant85 View Post
    The GOP has often been called "The Party of Lincoln." It's true that the first Republican president was Abraham Lincoln.

    But the implication is that the party is politically aligned with how Lincoln was. Do you think that that is a true description?
    I think comparing any modern party, our modern issues, and our country now to the parties of that time, issues of that time, and country at that time is a waste of time. Parties will have their catchphrases, their branding, etc. etc. What's important for us is to filter out these superficial coatings and look deeper into why we support who and what we support.

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    Re: Is it fair to call Republicans "The Party of Lincoln"?

    Quote Originally Posted by SBu View Post
    I think comparing any modern party, our modern issues, and our country now to the parties of that time, issues of that time, and country at that time is a waste of time. Parties will have their catchphrases, their branding, etc. etc. What's important for us is to filter out these superficial coatings and look deeper into why we support who and what we support.
    My thoughts exactly. I'd like to look beyond catchy labels and get to the truth.

  3. #63
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    Re: Is it fair to call Republicans "The Party of Lincoln"?

    Quote Originally Posted by aberrant85
    YIKES! Where to start? Let's start with the Dixiecrats.



    You are saying that Dixiecrats did not join the Republicans after 1968? The south was known as the "Solid South" since the Civil War because it was reliably Democrat. After 1968 there's been only one Democratic presidential candidate to win a majority in the south, Carter. Either these Democrats switched their votes to Republican, or they all moved out of the South. Which was it?
    That has nothing to do with my argument. The "lie" is the portrayal republicans being racist because they don't support minority agendas.


    Quote Originally Posted by aberrant85
    I'm not sure what statistics would support that. Anecdotally, during the Democratic primaries in '08 there were no publicized instances of racist remarks against Obama by voters. By comparison, there are countless YouTube videos of Republican primary voters and rally goers in '08 making racist and Islamophobic remarks.
    Racist remarks, or biased remarks?

    Please look up the definition of "racism." You may also want to look at similar terms like bigot, racialism, prejudice, etc. and see which ones fit best.


    Quote Originally Posted by aberrant85
    Yes, and as you see, 1964 came before 1968 when the Southern Strategy realigned the parties. Indeed Republicans voted for it more than Democrats, but if you look at it by region it was overwhelmingly Southerners who voted against it. So we agree with the facts here.
    Agreed. Democrats were primarily racists, there were very few republicans that held office in the south as well. there were probably 10 democrats for every republican. Just guessing, not taking the time to look it up.


    Quote Originally Posted by aberrant85
    Every statistic on unemployment, incarceration, single parenthood, and education shows Blacks at a disadvantage to Whites.
    Is that racism, or because of culture?


    Quote Originally Posted by aberrant85
    There's only two ways to explain this. Either you have to accept the fact that a legacy of slavery and discrimination have a long-lasting impact on the Black community (like Democrats do), or you believe that there are no outside factors that should account for Black underperforming, so they must be lazy or naturally inferior. What do you think?
    How about a third option. Blacks are taught the white man is the cause of their problems. They are not told to take hold of life and take responsibility for themselves. No, the democrats keep them at bay by telling them they are victims.


    Quote Originally Posted by aberrant85
    These opinions demonstrate to me exactly why modern Republicans do not deserve to call themselves "The Party of Lincoln." Lincoln believed that God created all people equal and worked to repair a system that treated them otherwise. Republicans today cannot claim to do the same.
    This is why republicans are the right party for free blacks.

    They don't coddle them like children, lie to them about who's at fault. Republicans judge blacks by their character, and not the color of their skin. Democrats judge people by the color of their skin.

  4. #64
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    Re: Is it fair to call Republicans "The Party of Lincoln"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Alright, if you consider this information overload, then you must have had a very hard time in public school and left in the dust in college.

    Did you click the first link? It is a very very short letter. I gave you it, because I thought you could skim to find the sentence in the paragraph that is relevant. Did I overestimate your capability?

    Are you capable of reading a wikipedia article entry about the size of half a page? If so, then you would be able to find the relevant quotes.

    Are you capable of clicking on the first image that pops up in MLK's autobiography, and see the highlighted text? If not, we have problems.

    Do you like reading books? If not, why bother studying history at all?
    Yes.

    I did not make that reply until I went to all those links.

    Thanks for wasting my time. Next time I will ignore those useless links unless you provide a quote, or somehow indicate a passage.

    Look at the date of that first one, and look at my words indicating time frames.

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    Re: Is it fair to call Republicans "The Party of Lincoln"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord of Planar View Post
    Yes.

    I did not make that reply until I went to all those links.

    Thanks for wasting my time. Next time I will ignore those useless links unless you provide a quote, or somehow indicate a passage.

    Look at the date of that first one, and look at my words indicating time frames.
    So you read the links (actually read them), but want me to show you the quotes?

    I already said the date of the first one above. I provided a synopsis of what we know. I gave you the links with the pertinent information, exactly there, if you would read it.

    The only thing I can gather from this is that you actually didn't spend time on the source material, or just didn't want to admit your assertions had serious limitations.

    No one should accuse a libertarian of being willing to learn.
    Michael J Petrilli-"Is School Choice Enough?"-A response to the recent timidity of American conservatives toward education reform. https://nationalaffairs.com/publicat...-choice-enough

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    Re: Is it fair to call Republicans "The Party of Lincoln"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord of Planar View Post
    Is that racism, or because of culture?

    How about a third option. Blacks are taught the white man is the cause of their problems. They are not told to take hold of life and take responsibility for themselves. No, the democrats keep them at bay by telling them they are victims.

    This is why republicans are the right party for free blacks.

    They don't coddle them like children, lie to them about who's at fault. Republicans judge blacks by their character, and not the color of their skin. Democrats judge people by the color of their skin.
    They say that liberals are idealists, but this is why I think conservatives are the real idealists. Your idealism tells you that everything is right with the world, that all anyone needs to do is recognize this and they can be successful; if they don't then they just haven't seen the light yet. It must be comfortable to you to know that America has no cultural guilt whatsoever to acknowledge.

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    Re: Is it fair to call Republicans "The Party of Lincoln"?

    Quote Originally Posted by aberrant85 View Post
    My thoughts exactly. I'd like to look beyond catchy labels and get to the truth.
    If you're interested in branding and catchphrases and the like in modern politics, I think one of the most successful brandings of our modern time is actually not a political party branding itself...but a political party branding another political party with near impunity. The Democrats have not only been hugely successful branding themselves as the "mainstream" party of minorities, women, and immigrants...but have also successfully branded the Republicans as the antithesis of those groups. Now, the truth of the Democrats being that, or the Republicans being that is debatable (and would be a great thread on here). Either way, it's incredibly effective politics...good for our country?...who knows.

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    Re: Is it fair to call Republicans "The Party of Lincoln"?

    Democrats don't call themselves "The party of Andrew Jackson."

    It was LBJ who said "there goes the South for a generation" (to Republicans) when the Civil Rights Act was passed and then it worsened with court ordered busing. That strange court ruling by the Supreme Court that they cannot order states to fairly distribute school money so then had to move the children instead by buses is what more likely turned the South solidly Republican in presidential elections.

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    Re: Is it fair to call Republicans "The Party of Lincoln"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    We know he stated he had traditionally voted for Democrats, if I recall correctly, for national office, as of 1956. In the following election, we have apparently some piece of evidence that he may have voted for Eisenhower by way of a meeting MLK had with Nixon the subsequent year (I haven't been able to quickly track that one down yet either). We know he had felt personally snubbed by Nixon in 1960, which makes it difficult to sell the idea that he would then vote for the man that he felt snubbed him. We know that MLK later stated that had Kennedy lived through the next election cycle, he would have publicly endorsed the candidate. We then know on top of that in 1964, MLK felt it urgent to publicly campaign against Barry Goldwater, not because Barry was somehow seen as a racist, but because his philosophy and platform seemed too congenial for racists. Then, in his final years we do know that he was very much moving toward the Left, perhaps always was, in the remaining years before his assassination.
    Thanks for the information. To me its not about who gets the bragging rights but being honest and historically accurate.
    Having opinions all over the map is a good sign of a person capable of autonomous thinking. Felix -2011

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    Re: Is it fair to call Republicans "The Party of Lincoln"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    So you read the links (actually read them), but want me to show you the quotes?

    I already said the date of the first one above. I provided a synopsis of what we know. I gave you the links with the pertinent information, exactly there, if you would read it.

    The only thing I can gather from this is that you actually didn't spend time on the source material, or just didn't want to admit your assertions had serious limitations.

    No one should accuse a libertarian of being willing to learn.
    I see nothing that states, as fact, that MLK was not a republican in his later life. As I said before, I will trust his niece, over material that only suggests. Unless you have something that is definitive, you are wasting all our time.

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