View Poll Results: REPEAL OBAMACARE

Voters
61. You may not vote on this poll
  • Repeal immediately and completely. Repeal Medicare also.

    9 14.75%
  • Repeal within 2 years. Repeal Medicare also.

    0 0%
  • Repeal it and Medicare in whatever time it takes.

    0 0%
  • Repeal it. Keep Medicare like it is

    17 27.87%
  • Repeal only the individual mandate. Keep Medicare

    3 4.92%
  • Keep the individual mandate. Repeal the rest and medicare also.

    0 0%
  • Keep Obamacare like it is. I love it.

    11 18.03%
  • Keep Obamacare, but NO care for non-citizens.

    0 0%
  • Keep Obamacare, but NO care for illegal aliens.

    4 6.56%
  • Other (specify)

    17 27.87%
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Thread: Repeal obamacare completely

  1. #51
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    Re: Repeal obamacare completely

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    Correction: it is the best option that you have yet to see.
    i'm not entirely opposed to looking at other first world systems and taking the best parts from each one for a custom fit solution. what i am opposed to is the status quo and most of the PPACA because it doesn't control costs, and therefore probably won't work.

  2. #52
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    Re: Repeal obamacare completely

    Quote Originally Posted by Helix View Post
    i'm not entirely opposed to looking at other first world systems and taking the best parts from each one for a custom fit solution.
    One way that this endeavor fails is when one does not recognize differences in context. Socialism works well in small homogeneous groups. Removing it from that context is tomfoolery. When the solution includes the need to change demographics... fail.

  3. #53
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    Re: Repeal obamacare completely

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    One way that this endeavor fails is when one does not recognize differences in context. Socialism works well in small homogeneous groups. Removing it from that context is tomfoolery. When the solution includes the need to change demographics... fail.
    it's basically just expanding medicare to let other people in. that has to be better than using emergency rooms as primary care for the uninsured while we all pay top dollar for it through our premiums.

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    Re: Repeal obamacare completely

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    Folks can play lots of games with statistics and use clever accounting to "prove" anything. The point is that adding 40 million people at an average of $5000/year in total medical care costs but having them pay an average of $1000/year in total premiums will not lower costs, it will raise them....
    You will also reduce all sorts of other costs, many of which would be otherwise put on the government's tab.

    A major reason for bankruptcies in the US is because of medical issues. You have a health problem, which can result in a lost job, which leads to lost health insurance, which can result in bankruptcies and unpaid medical costs that, in turn, drive up hospital costs. You also have the bankrupt people more likely to collect safety net services like TANF, SNAP, disability and so forth.

    And FYI, emergency room rates did fall in MA, though it is not clear that it's a direct result of Romneycare: Emergency Department Visits Down For First Time Since Health Reform, Survey Finds | CommonHealth

    At a minimum, Romneycare has certainly not devastated health care in MA, or the state's economy.


    ....a great deal for the insurance company (they get to keep 15% to 20% as overhead) but not so much of a good deal for "total costs" of medical care.
    Obamacare is certainly a much better for the insurance companies than a single-payer system.

    However, unless they are seriously cooking the books (which is possible), their net profit margin is a reasonable 3.7%Industry Browser - Healthcare - Health Care Plans Industry - Company List and has been in that range for at least a few years now. (In comparison, soft drink companies have an 11% net profit margin; Coca-Cola's margins are over 20%.)

    Obamacare does throw insurers a large number of customers. However, insurers will also be expected to pay out a great deal more, since they can no longer deny pre-existing conditions, and yes, have to rebate revenues that used to go straight to the bottom line.

    I.e. If their margins do go through the roof for the next few years, we'll see it. And can adjust aspects like the rebates, as required.

    The benefits of Obamacare will almost certainly be less than its proponents insist, and its problems will almost certainly be nowhere near as bad as its detractors insist.

  5. #55
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    Re: Repeal obamacare completely

    Quote Originally Posted by Helix View Post
    it's basically just expanding medicare to let other people in. that has to be better than using emergency rooms as primary care for the uninsured while we all pay top dollar for it through our premiums.
    Medicare is the largest source of fraud in US history.

  6. #56
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    Re: Repeal obamacare completely

    Quote Originally Posted by Visbek View Post
    You will also reduce all sorts of other costs, many of which would be otherwise put on the government's tab.

    A major reason for bankruptcies in the US is because of medical issues. You have a health problem, which can result in a lost job, which leads to lost health insurance, which can result in bankruptcies and unpaid medical costs that, in turn, drive up hospital costs. You also have the bankrupt people more likely to collect safety net services like TANF, SNAP, disability and so forth.

    And FYI, emergency room rates did fall in MA, though it is not clear that it's a direct result of Romneycare: Emergency Department Visits Down For First Time Since Health Reform, Survey Finds | CommonHealth

    At a minimum, Romneycare has certainly not devastated health care in MA, or the state's economy.



    Obamacare is certainly a much better for the insurance companies than a single-payer system.

    However, unless they are seriously cooking the books (which is possible), their net profit margin is a reasonable 3.7%Industry Browser - Healthcare - Health Care Plans Industry - Company List and has been in that range for at least a few years now. (In comparison, soft drink companies have an 11% net profit margin; Coca-Cola's margins are over 20%.)

    Obamacare does throw insurers a large number of customers. However, insurers will also be expected to pay out a great deal more, since they can no longer deny pre-existing conditions, and yes, have to rebate revenues that used to go straight to the bottom line.

    I.e. If their margins do go through the roof for the next few years, we'll see it. And can adjust aspects like the rebates, as required.

    The benefits of Obamacare will almost certainly be less than its proponents insist, and its problems will almost certainly be nowhere near as bad as its detractors insist.
    As they say in Missouri - show me. All sort of predictions and analogies abound but Obama, while calling for delay of the PPACA employer mandate, now tells us that 3 years is just not enough time to "implement them effectively". In other words, Obama is scared to death what economic harm that this 20,000 page PPACA nightmare may actually cause, immediately before the 2014 congessional elections, the last that he must endure for his final term as teleprompter in chief.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

  7. #57
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    Re: Repeal obamacare completely

    Keep the good parts of Obamacare, but repeal the other 99%.

    IOW, repeal the individual mandate and the part that costs $150 million/year. Keep the part that repeals the insurance companies' exemption to anti-trust laws.
    If you expect people to be rational, you aren't being rational.

  8. #58
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    Re: Repeal obamacare completely

    Quote Originally Posted by shrubnose View Post
    No.

    We don't ask our soldiers to die.

    We ask our soldiers to make those poor losers on the other side die for their country and/or cause.
    What is this? Your wanting to play word games?
    You quote one post, insult me, and blame another post?
    In a perfect scenario, sure, I'd agree, we ask them only to win.
    In reality, this is not what happens. We do not always win every skirmish and every battle, and sometimes we lose someone.
    I have a few family members that could tell you all about it.
    Anyhow, this is as silly as my wife nagging me about my use of "your" instead of "you're".
    Word games.

  9. #59
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    Re: Repeal obamacare completely

    Quote Originally Posted by Painter View Post
    We have 2 standards of medical care in this country:

    #1 The best treatment on the entire planet for the wealthy and the insured.

    #2 And treatment that is worse than many 3rd world countries and rates below nations such as Cuba, for the uninsured, the poor, and middle class small business owners.
    #2 is blatantly false. No health insurance =/= no health care.
    If you expect people to be rational, you aren't being rational.

  10. #60
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    Re: Repeal obamacare completely

    Actually, no it is not. If you add or no ability to pay. Then we are thrid world.
    Quote Originally Posted by mpg View Post
    #2 is blatantly false. No health insurance =/= no health care.
    God Bless the Marine Corps.

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