View Poll Results: Does racism occur in this video?

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  • Yes

    22 61.11%
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    10 27.78%
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Thread: Is this racist?

  1. #161
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    Re: Is this racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    No.

    In my view, and perhaps you hold a different view, racism requires a certain level of irrational behaviour that is driven solely by a dislike for a person's race. It would be racism, in my view, to be the white owner of a store and deny blacks to shop there - that's just not good business and hurting yourself irrationally. It would not be racism, however, in my view, to be the white owner of a store and keep a close watch on young black male customers because in the past you've had trouble with young black males shoplifting or holding you up. That's just being smart and protecting your property and your interests.
    So then you condone the idea of me assume you are a racist because you are a white conservative and holding that view about you, perhaps acting on it, until you prove otherwise?

  2. #162
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    Re: Is this racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    No. You can be quite rational while practicing racism.

    Take this definition:

    A common trait among the sociological definitions of racism is that they define racism backwards from its results. The results of racism include, among other things, social inequality based on apparent racial affiliation. Thus, anything that causes social inequality becomes racism, regardless of intent. This allows the possibility of unconscious racism, evident in the definition offered by the Christian Anti-Racism Initiative in South Africa:

    Racism is essentially a conscious or unconscious belief in the inherent superiority of one race over another\others and thereby the right by that race to use power to dominate.[5]

    Daniel Hindes - Essasys

    Or this one:

    Racism
    Is any action or attitude, conscious or unconscious, that subordinates an individual or group based on skin colour or race. It can be enacted individually or institutionally.

    Source: US Civil Rights Commission

    Defining Race Racism and Racial Discrimination

    You can be quite rational and do these things.

    Some people take loss of revenue as a cost of doing business, prioritizing one one thing over another. Sometimes this make very good sense. But it isn't irrational in and of itself. It's no more rational or irrational to ignore someone clearly stealing a bike.
    Sorry, racism is an irrational act based on race as witnessed by someone else who can view the irrationality of the act. People, themselves, don't believe they're being irrational when they are - otherwise, they wouldn't be. I'm not buying into your attempt to create or find racism where it doesn't exist - I'm not invested in the racism industry that needs perpetuation to justify existence.
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." William F. Buckley Jr.

  3. #163
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    Re: Is this racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by opendebate View Post
    So then you condone the idea of me assume you are a racist because you are a white conservative and holding that view about you, perhaps acting on it, until you prove otherwise?
    If I could get a translation, I might be able or inclined to respond.
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." William F. Buckley Jr.

  4. #164
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    Re: Is this racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    If I could get a translation, I might be able or inclined to respond.
    Are you saying that you do not understand my post

  5. #165
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    Re: Is this racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by opendebate View Post
    Are you saying that you do not understand my post
    It didn't make any sense.
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." William F. Buckley Jr.

  6. #166
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    Re: Is this racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    It didn't make any sense.
    Do you really want to know what I was trying to say or were you blowing me off?

  7. #167
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    Re: Is this racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by opendebate View Post
    Do you really want to know what I was trying to say or were you blowing me off?
    If you want to tell me what your were trying to say, I'll have a look - I can't "blow you off" if I don't know what you're talking about.
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." William F. Buckley Jr.

  8. #168
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    Re: Is this racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    The thing is, over and over again, no one stands up and makes a stink. Over and over again in these type of exercises, minorities come out on the wrong end. Not once, not twice, but over and over and over again. At some point you have to address the reason.
    Christ - again, I'm not ignoring it.

    I'm trying to explore the entire situation.

    Maybe I should say it this way: why do people respond differently when it comes to race? There's more to this than "I don't LIKE you because you're black." - there's a deeper, heavier topic that people are not thinking of at all. Instead, people are flopping around and freaking out, and not trying to understand what is truly going on.

    How can you fix something if you refuse to understand WHAT it is?

    But it is funny (maybe I should say ironic) - in recent situations, when violence is only acted out against whites - people claim there's no racism at all. . . but give a video of some random people treating a black person differently, then there's crime afoot.

    Odd - and THAT - the entire 'differential treatment on all parts' makes me wonder what is going on in people's heads UNDERNEATH what we are seeing. If wanting to talk about this deep underneath is a PROBLEM then we're ****ed - and stuck existing in this **** climate where race is considered the only center of anything bad and we don't clime out of our nation's own version of the dark ages.

    Obvious to me that 'having a real conversation about race' really means 'let's only look at everything through a 'you're racist!' lens' rather than 'let's try to understand everything that's going on in people's heads.

    I see that everyone else is watering it down by pointing fingers to the 'you're just a racist bitch' easy out.

    People - though - are more complicated. . . can't deny that.

    For example: how different would things be if they were in a predominately black area, and set this up with two white offenders and one black?
    Last edited by Aunt Spiker; 08-29-13 at 05:13 PM.
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    It has happened before, but there is nothing to compare it to now.
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  9. #169
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    Re: Is this racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    Sorry, racism is an irrational act based on race as witnessed by someone else who can view the irrationality of the act. People, themselves, don't believe they're being irrational when they are - otherwise, they wouldn't be. I'm not buying into your attempt to create or find racism where it doesn't exist - I'm not invested in the racism industry that needs perpetuation to justify existence.
    Oh, I think they understand. But they justify it. They have used the Bible. Crime statistics. people here have sat and justified the act of watching someone steal and doing little to knowing when the white guy was doing, but acting quickly when a perosn of color was doing. We all rationalize, and while often poor reasoning is involved, it is rational in this respect:

    being in or characterized by full possession of one's reason; sane; lucid: The patient appeared perfectly rational.

    Rational | Define Rational at Dictionary.com

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  10. #170
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    Re: Is this racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    Christ - again, I'm not ignoring it.

    I'm trying to explore the entire situation.

    Maybe I should say it this way: why do people respond differently when it comes to race? There's more to this than "I don't LIKE you because you're black." - there's a deeper, heavier topic that people are not thinking of at all. Instead, people are flopping around and freaking out, and not trying to understand what is truly going on.

    How can you fix something if you refuse to understand WHAT it is?

    But it is funny (maybe I should say ironic) - in recent situations, when violence is only acted out against whites - people claim there's no racism at all. . . but give a video of some random people treating a black person differently, then there's crime afoot.

    Odd - and THAT - the entire 'differential treatment on all parts' makes me wonder what is going on in people's heads UNDERNEATH what we are seeing. If wanting to talk about this deep underneath is a PROBLEM then we're ****ed - and stuck existing in this **** climate where race is considered the only center of anything bad and we don't clime out of our nation's own version of the dark ages.

    Obvious to me that 'having a real conversation about race' really means 'let's only look at everything through a 'you're racist!' lens' rather than 'let's try to understand everything that's going on in people's heads.

    I see that everyone else is watering it down by pointing fingers to the 'you're just a racist bitch' easy out.

    People - though - are more complicated. . . can't deny that.

    For example: how different would things be if they were in a predominately black area, and set this up with two white offenders and one black?
    Racism is more than I don't like you because you're black. And no, a real discussion has to start with rather we do it knowing we do it or not, we treat minorities differently. There is more than enough evidence to show that. This evidence is just one more small piece added to a long list of evidence.

    And in fact, these studies have been done in reverse. The odd thing, there's no real change in the reaction. Whites were largely ignored, and blacks stopped nearly instantly. None of this is really new.

    And yes, people are complicated, which only means they may not be intentional. It may well be that a wide variety of societal influences have helped create an unintentional racism. But treating one race different than another based purely on race is at the end of the day racist.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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