View Poll Results: Would you vote for or consider voting for an Atheist for any public office?

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  • Yes

    71 91.03%
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    7 8.97%
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Thread: Would you vote for an Atheist?

  1. #101
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    Re: Would you vote for an Atheist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    That's because all groups have a natural distribution of reasonable folk and crazy folk, and the crazy folk in all groups tend to be the loudest.
    Yup, pretty much. I guess the question comes down to who would you want for your president? A jerk atheist or a jerk Christian?

    Or is that just debating whether you'd rather be shot by a bullet made of iron or a bullet made of lead?

  2. #102
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    Re: Would you vote for an Atheist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    Yup, pretty much. I guess the question comes down to who would you want for your president? A jerk atheist or a jerk Christian?

    Or is that just debating whether you'd rather be shot by a bullet made of iron or a bullet made of lead?
    Iron is a necessary mineral, lead is poison. So I guess I'd choose iron
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  3. #103
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    Re: Would you vote for an Atheist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    It's an interesting premise. If natural rights are god given, then an atheist couldn't override that. But more to the point, currently there are lots of theist politicians (pretty much the lot of the main Republocrat party) who do not accept natural right and define everything instead by government power. So what are these people who refuse to vote for atheists really getting by not voting for atheists. It seems whether they are outraged by lack of moral compass or lack of belief in natural rights that our current politicians already violate all of that.

    The only real reason why people wouldn't vote for atheists is rooted in prejudiced and bias because many of these people are supporting the same politicians doing things they claim they cannot vote for an atheist because. So it's obviously not so much the act in and of itself as it is being an atheist.
    Ikari...I completely agree.

    I'm totally perplexed with the the "Natural Rights" argument. It's not connected to anything we find in our modern day society and our system of government.

    Other than the term "Natural Rights", which is linked to John Locke's publication "Second Treatise of Government" written in the late 1600's. I just don't see how it applies in the same manner in our Constitution. Sections related to rights to life, liberty and property aren't without conditions within our system of government and legal institutions. Nobody wants to lose their life unjustly...but people unjustly kill people every day despite our laws. Liberties are certainly not inalienable. The "right to own property"...? Uh huh, but conditional to obligations to pay taxes forever on property. There is a price that we all pay for our rights.

    And while claiming them to be inalienable sounds great. In my reply to The Baron...why wouldn't god give natural rights to all people in every nation on the planet...and make damn sure they are enforced?

    Atheists...wouldn't know where to start to "strip" individuals from their god given rights...as The Baron contends. God simply doesn't compute in the minds of atheists.

    On the other hand, as you've already pointed out...we might have plenty of people in government who are way more interested in stripping away or reducing our rights.

    Thanks...

  4. #104
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    Re: Would you vote for an Atheist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Removable Mind View Post
    Ikari...I completely agree.

    I'm totally perplexed with the the "Natural Rights" argument. It's not connected to anything we find in our modern day society and our system of government.

    Other than the term "Natural Rights", which is linked to John Locke's publication "Second Treatise of Government" written in the late 1600's. I just don't see how it applies in the same manner in our Constitution. Sections related to rights to life, liberty and property aren't without conditions within our system of government and legal institutions. Nobody wants to lose their life unjustly...but people unjustly kill people every day despite our laws. Liberties are certainly not inalienable. The "right to own property"...? Uh huh, but conditional to obligations to pay taxes forever on property. There is a price that we all pay for our rights.

    And while claiming them to be inalienable sounds great. In my reply to The Baron...why wouldn't god give natural rights to all people in every nation on the planet...and make damn sure they are enforced?

    Atheists...wouldn't know where to start to "strip" individuals from their god given rights...as The Baron contends. God simply doesn't compute in the minds of atheists.

    On the other hand, as you've already pointed out...we might have plenty of people in government who are way more interested in stripping away or reducing our rights.

    Thanks...
    No right has ever been without condition, but that doesn't mean that natural rights do not exist. In the end, all humans are human and because we all share a base commonality, we all share a base set of rights. Those are natural rights.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

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  5. #105
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    Re: Would you vote for an Atheist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    No right has ever been without condition, but that doesn't mean that natural rights do not exist. In the end, all humans are human and because we all share a base commonality, we all share a base set of rights. Those are natural rights.
    Well, now I'm completely at a loss. So you believe that there are "natural rights" god given?

  6. #106
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    Re: Would you vote for an Atheist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Removable Mind View Post
    Well, now I'm completely at a loss. So you believe that there are "natural rights" god given?
    No, there are natural rights but they are not god given. Since there are no gods, they cannot be god given.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  7. #107
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    Re: Would you vote for an Atheist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    If he voted, he would hardly be an anarchist, would he?
    DOH! I meant atheist.

  8. #108
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    Re: Would you vote for an Atheist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Quag View Post
    pure bs
    And yet I've provided you with a definition of the term going all the way back to the 1500's and yet all you can manage is "bs".

    Your response is unintelligent, uninformed and uninteresting.
    "Liberalism is a doctrine fostered by a delusional and illogical people and rabidly promoted by the mainstream media and ruling elite which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end." - unknown

  9. #109
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    Re: Would you vote for an Atheist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    No, there are natural rights but they are not god given. Since there are no gods, they cannot be god given.
    Ahhhhh...thanks, I thought I misread something in the post I responded to.

    Okay....to go out on a limb here...

    What natural rights are you talking about specifically? In what form do they exist? How are we as a nation protected by them? Or as far as that goes...how are we as individuals protected by them? Who enforces them?

  10. #110
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    Re: Would you vote for an Atheist?

    Quote Originally Posted by TiredOfLife View Post
    If you see Natural Rights as those being found in Nature, which is nonsense, then you are incorrect. Who invented or created Nature becomes the issue then. God, a big dog with fleas, or the Universe itself? You don't have to believe in God to rights as Natural.
    Yet it was Sir Edward Coke that defined the term in the 1500 / 1600's, Blackstone utilized the term in his writings and Jefferson studied Blackstone. Jefferson understood the meaning of the term natural law to mean God's law. You have to redefine the word to make it fit your argument.
    "Liberalism is a doctrine fostered by a delusional and illogical people and rabidly promoted by the mainstream media and ruling elite which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end." - unknown

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