View Poll Results: Do you support the Death Penalty

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  • I support the Death Penalty

    38 42.70%
  • I Oppose the Death Penalty due to Principle

    27 30.34%
  • I Oppose the Death Penalty due to Practicality

    17 19.10%
  • Other

    7 7.87%
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Thread: Death Penalty in Theory

  1. #121
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    Re: Death Penalty in Theory

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    If the government fails it CAN be the fault of the People, it could be the fault of the government as well. But this is neither here nor there, this is a deflectionary argument aimed at attacking the messenger...not the message. Stay on target please.
    The government exists at the discretion of the people. If people don't like what the government is doing, they have the ability, at the ballot box, to remove any who offend them. Whether they do or not is largely irrelevant, it is their power and it is their responsibility to exercise that power.

    It costs way more money to kill someone than to keep him alive. So you're really just making us spend more money.
    No it doesn't. The legal wrangling costs more, not the sentence. The only reason it costs more is because liberal asshats have allowed convicted murderers to file appeal after appeal after appeal, based not on claims of their factual innocence, but because they don't want to die. Stop them from doing that, limit their appeals past the first mandatory one to those which purport their innocence, and the death penalty will be positively cheap.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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  2. #122
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    Re: Death Penalty in Theory

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    That's why the left has worked so hard to make people dependent on the government, so they're more likely to get votes. Certainly, there need to be massive and sweeping changes across the board to return this country to the way it was originally intended to be. Unfortunately, we've managed to put people in charge who benefit directly from keeping things the way they are.
    Instead of nobility one might be born into, we have managed to make that nobility our elected representatives...
    I don't often change my signature, but this was just too over the top to let anyone forget with what this country is up against...
    Quote Originally Posted by James D Hill View Post
    I am for gay marriage because it ticks off Jesus freaks and social conservatives. Gays are also good voters because the vote for my side so I fight next to them.

  3. #123
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    Re: Death Penalty in Theory

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    There's no emotion here, nobody is suggesting killing people at random, it's only those who, through their own actions, have proven themselves to be unworthy of continued life on this planet.
    We are all just humans, and not one of us should be able to the judge the worthiness of another human's life or taking another human's life. That makes you a murderer and not one bit better or more just than the murderer you are killing.

  4. #124
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    Re: Death Penalty in Theory

    Quote Originally Posted by AlabamaPaul View Post
    Instead of nobility one might be born into, we have managed to make that nobility our elected representatives...
    Which is certainly a massive problem, but not one to be solved in this particular thread.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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  5. #125
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    Re: Death Penalty in Theory

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    The government exists at the discretion of the people. If people don't like what the government is doing, they have the ability, at the ballot box, to remove any who offend them. Whether they do or not is largely irrelevant, it is their power and it is their responsibility to exercise that power.
    blah blah blah, not relevant. Stay on target.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    No it doesn't. The legal wrangling costs more, not the sentence. The only reason it costs more is because liberal asshats have allowed convicted murderers to file appeal after appeal after appeal, based not on claims of their factual innocence, but because they don't want to die. Stop them from doing that, limit their appeals past the first mandatory one to those which purport their innocence, and the death penalty will be positively cheap.
    Well excuse me if we need to make damned sure that the guy you want to put a bullet through is guilty of the crime you claim him to be guilty of. Oh the travesty!

    This is the ultimate use of government force, you do not get to use it on whim.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  6. #126
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    Re: Death Penalty in Theory

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Yes, checks and balances cost money. And when you're dealing with the ultimate use of government force, you need the ultimate use of check and balance.
    No, there is no reason to deny a person the right to a speedy trial, and 15-20 years worth of appeals does not make for a speedy decision...
    I don't often change my signature, but this was just too over the top to let anyone forget with what this country is up against...
    Quote Originally Posted by James D Hill View Post
    I am for gay marriage because it ticks off Jesus freaks and social conservatives. Gays are also good voters because the vote for my side so I fight next to them.

  7. #127
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    Re: Death Penalty in Theory

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    We are all just humans, and not one of us should be able to the judge the worthiness of another human's life or taking another human's life. That makes you a murderer and not one bit better or more just than the murderer you are killing.
    Emotional arguments don't make good arguments. It doesn't make one a murderer because murder is defined specifically as killing that is against the law. As the death penalty is legal, it cannot be murder. You know that, but you want to make an emotional argument, not a rational one.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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  8. #128
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    Re: Death Penalty in Theory

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    We are all just humans, and not one of us should be able to the judge the worthiness of another human's life or taking another human's life. That makes you a murderer and not one bit better or more just than the murderer you are killing.
    When you kill in cold blood, you pretty much prove your unfitness and unworthiness to go on living.
    "God is the name by which I designate all things which cross my path violently and recklessly, all things which alter my plans and intentions, and change the course of my life, for better or for worse."
    -C G Jung

  9. #129
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    Re: Death Penalty in Theory

    Quote Originally Posted by AlabamaPaul View Post
    No, there is no reason to deny a person the right to a speedy trial, and 15-20 years worth of appeals does not make for a speedy decision...
    Not the right to speedy trial, but also not the speedy insertion of lead into brain by government goon. You have to make sure, the main problem with the death penalty has been that we have found many innocent jerks on death row. It costs innocent life. Innately. We do not possess perfect knowledge, you will get innocents caught up. And in your zeal to kill that guy over there, you seem to be willing to go through 3 other dudes. It's illogical. There is nothing we get from the death penalty except further in debt. That's it. No additional security, not additional punishment not wrought by LWOP. Just more debt and some innocent people dead along side the guilty.

    It is not necessary anymore and since it's not necessary and since the failure modes are so extreme, it is best to avoid it all together.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  10. #130
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    Re: Death Penalty in Theory

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Not the right to speedy trial, but also not the speedy insertion of lead into brain by government goon. You have to make sure, the main problem with the death penalty has been that we have found many innocent jerks on death row. It costs innocent life. Innately. We do not possess perfect knowledge, you will get innocents caught up. And in your zeal to kill that guy over there, you seem to be willing to go through 3 other dudes. It's illogical. There is nothing we get from the death penalty except further in debt. That's it. No additional security, not additional punishment not wrought by LWOP. Just more debt and some innocent people dead along side the guilty.

    It is not necessary anymore and since it's not necessary and since the failure modes are so extreme, it is best to avoid it all together.
    The system was not designed to achieve the correct outcome every time; it was designed to be as fair as possible given we're all human...
    I don't often change my signature, but this was just too over the top to let anyone forget with what this country is up against...
    Quote Originally Posted by James D Hill View Post
    I am for gay marriage because it ticks off Jesus freaks and social conservatives. Gays are also good voters because the vote for my side so I fight next to them.

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