View Poll Results: Welfare: Keep, Reform or End?

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  • Keep it!

    19 24.05%
  • Keep it, but it needs SEVERE reform.

    38 48.10%
  • End it

    15 18.99%
  • Other

    7 8.86%
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Thread: Welfare: Keep, Reform or End?

  1. #11
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    Re: Welfare: Keep, Reform or End?

    What about some kind of community service in exchange for assistance
    What about mandatory enrollment in a trade program and tax incentives for businesses that hire from the program
    Maybe food pantries where people have credit and actually exchange the credit for food instead of getting the money directly, money would go further
    Last edited by opendebate; 08-25-13 at 10:28 PM.

  2. #12
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    Re: Welfare: Keep, Reform or End?

    Quote Originally Posted by John Liberty View Post
    I say we severely reform it. I'm all for helping people out...when they NEED it.

    Some issues with our current state of welfare:
    -Welfare is way too easy to get. There are too many people that are far from needing welfare.

    -Welfare pays too much. Welfare is supposed to be just enough to keep you alive, welfare is not supposed to be comfortable! If it's comfortable than where is the initiative to go out and work?

    -Welfare lasts too long. Welfare should be there just enough to help you get back on your feet.

    -The "Obamaphone" welfare program gets its own section. There are a lot of things wrong with people getting phones from welfare programs. If you can't figure out why, then you will never get it.
    I voted to keep it. If there had been an option for "minor reform" I would have selected that instead.

    Now you made several assertions, apparently based on "common knowledge." I'd ask that you back up each of those assertions with some facts. Explain:

    1. How it is "WAY too easy to get."
    2. Define "many" and then show how there are too "many" on it and which of these "many" are "far from needing it."
    3. Define "enough to keep you alive," then show how welfare "pays too much."
    4. How "just keeping you alive" serves to help you get OFF welfare.
    5. Show that it "lasts too long" for current recipients.
    6. How long it is supposed to take to "get back on your feet;" especially if the amounts paid "only keep you alive."
    7. How having a limited use cellphone should not be a welfare "perk, when it is necessary for many things, not the least of which is getting a job?

    Most employers require a contact number to reach you in order to contact you for interviews, call to come to work, inquire if you are sick, etc. Why should access remain outside the hands of people you want to GET work in order to GET OFF welfare?

    Now as a general observation (not focused on the OP) I find it interesting that people want to do away with welfare programs because (short-sightedly) they never think they would ever need it.

    Do those of you who believe this honestly think everyone who is on welfare thought they would be needing welfare when they first started out? That the more than 40 million working poor who qualify for Food Stamps thought they would need to rely on food stamps? That Millions of working people would need to depend on Medicaid to cover costs of health care for their children or themselves that their paychecks can't?

    Perhaps people should really try to give a little thought to the reasons for the existence of welfare pragrams besides buying into the myth of "lazy welfare mommas" sucking up our tax dollars.
    Last edited by Captain Adverse; 08-25-13 at 10:58 PM.
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  3. #13
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    Re: Welfare: Keep, Reform or End?

    Quote Originally Posted by GhostlyJoe View Post
    This thread needs perspective. Here's an interesting look at government benefits as a whole. Welfare, meaning direct cash paymet, in 2011, went to about 7% of households:

    More here

    And some general stats about welfare specifically

    Welfare is a very small expenditure, relative to other federal entitlements, and is only short-term assistance for a big majority of recipients. I'm not sure we need to come down hard on the poorest. The biggest beneficiary of government spending, after all, are the elderly and and the middle class. And if you start to add in tax benefits, well, I guess we all suckle at the government teet at one time or another .. should we all be forced to mow lawns and not eat Twinkies?
    Well the first liberal has leaped in here to stop all reform. Keep the spending going. Carry on.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
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  4. #14
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    Re: Welfare: Keep, Reform or End?

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    Well the first liberal has leaped in here to stop all reform. Keep the spending going. Carry on.
    Did you even consider looking at what he posted?

  5. #15
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    Re: Welfare: Keep, Reform or End?

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    Well the first liberal has leaped in here to stop all reform. Keep the spending going. Carry on.
    Thank you for posting this. I was going to comment something similar. People really do have misunderstandings about welfare. Especially recent changes, many under Clinton, and how many families have had to turn to assistance since the recent economic crash

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    Re: Welfare: Keep, Reform or End?

    Quote Originally Posted by JC Callender View Post
    What would you consider full employment and when did automation put an end to that?
    Full employment is when everybody has a job. Automation (and other factors) have been eating away at this for the last 30 years or so. When there is a job for everyone within their skills and the only ones not working are because they are too old, weak, dysfunctional, disabled.

    These replaced millions of workers and enabled us to hire overseas labor which is much cheaper.

    Welfare: Keep, Reform or End?-imgres-jpeg
    Welfare: Keep, Reform or End?-imgres-1-jpgWelfare: Keep, Reform or End?-imgres-2-jpeg

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    Re: Welfare: Keep, Reform or End?

    Quote Originally Posted by John Liberty View Post
    Federal Welfare. Should we keep it the way it is, severely reform it or end it completely?
    I have adopted the Dennis Miller view of welfare. I don't mind helping the helpless I just don't give a sh-- about the clueless. If you are able to work then you don't get it. If you're on it, you get drug-screened routinely.
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    Re: Welfare: Keep, Reform or End?

    Quote Originally Posted by John Liberty View Post
    I say we severely reform it. I'm all for helping people out...when they NEED it.

    Some issues with our current state of welfare:
    -Welfare is way too easy to get. There are too many people that are far from needing welfare.

    -Welfare pays too much. Welfare is supposed to be just enough to keep you alive, welfare is not supposed to be comfortable! If it's comfortable than where is the initiative to go out and work?

    -Welfare lasts too long. Welfare should be there just enough to help you get back on your feet.

    -The "Obamaphone" welfare program gets its own section. There are a lot of things wrong with people getting phones from welfare programs. If you can't figure out why, then you will never get it.
    The "Obamaphone" is a myth. It was initiated in 1984 and known as the Lifeline Program. The first cellphone component of Lifeline was initiated in 2008 under George Bush. snopes.com: Free 'ObamaPhones' for Welfare Recipients
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  9. #19
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    Re: Welfare: Keep, Reform or End?

    There has never been or never will be full employment, but I would say 4.4% is pretty low, and we had that back in 2007. Michigan, a very automated state, had a 3.4% unemployment rate in early 2000.

    Quote Originally Posted by specklebang View Post
    Full employment is when everybody has a job. Automation (and other factors) have been eating away at this for the last 30 years or so. When there is a job for everyone within their skills and the only ones not working are because they are too old, weak, dysfunctional, disabled.

    These replaced millions of workers and enabled us to hire overseas labor which is much cheaper.

    Welfare: Keep, Reform or End?-imgres-jpeg
    Welfare: Keep, Reform or End?-imgres-1-jpgWelfare: Keep, Reform or End?-imgres-2-jpeg

  10. #20
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    Re: Welfare: Keep, Reform or End?

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    Make it a one time deal (keeping biometeric data of the recipient to assure that no repeat is possible) and of a fixed amount calculated at 2080 (40 hours for 52 weeks) times the federal hourly minimum wage. No tests, qualifications or any other "strings" - beyond what liberals want for voting. U.S. tourism will boom! Better secure the border first.
    Keep it but restrict it to people that actually need it..........Under Obama it has become totally out of control especially food stamps.
    "God Bless Our Troops in Harms Way."

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