View Poll Results: What is the reason that we see less and less Traditional Family Structure?

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  • Affirmative Action Opened All the Right Doors...

    6 13.64%
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    4 9.09%
  • It is extremely complex issue...

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Thread: Why does Society Hate Families? Part II

  1. #91
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    Re: Why does Society Hate Families? Part II

    I am saying that more quality time with your kid is better than less. That is just how it is. It is better for the kids.
    Oh, really?
    I hadn't thought of that; nor, I'm sure, had any other working mom in history.
    See, here I was wasting my free time getting pedicures and squandering my evenings attending rated R movies and dancing the night away in 18-and-over bars.
    Spending quality time with my family never occurred to me.
    Thank you, Bodisa-whatever. Thank you, from the bottom of my heart. You've opened my eyes to the truth. I'm a convert.
    I understand it all, now.


    Surely this is understandable?
    It is now.
    Quality time.
    Wait, wait... lemme get a pen and write that down.
    Q.... U.....A.... L.... Quality. Quality time.

    Okay, got it.

    Thanks again.
    You've changed my life, my entire approach to childrearing.

  2. #92
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    Re: Why does Society Hate Families? Part II

    Two parent households do not have to have two incomes. They don't. How do I know that this is a fact? We do it. If we can do it, then others can do it (random variables aside, since there are always variables.) This is just simple logic.
    Well, it's "simple", at any rate.
    "Logic"? Not so much.

    If one unemployed parent is good, wouldn't two be better?
    If not, why not?
    Shall I produce evidence that it's been done, ergo it is logistically feasible?
    Last edited by 1069; 03-03-07 at 07:09 PM.

  3. #93
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    Re: Why does Society Hate Families? Part II

    Wow....

    Am I to understand from some people's posts here that I'm "selfish" for being an unmarried, childless woman in her 30s? That I'm a detriment to society for desiring to live my life the way I want and do the things I want to do as opposed to just accepting my "role" as society's breeding machine?

    In this day and age, I must say I am sufficiently surprised (and appalled) at such statements and/or implications.

    Yeah, I guess it is selfish of me to want to enjoy my life and do the things I want to do... to travel to the places I want to travel to... to experience all the things I want to experience. It is after all MY life, why shouldn't I try to enjoy it? Why should I sacrifice everything I want just so I can be molded into what someone else thinks I should be? Yeah, I guess it is selfish... but you know what? I really don't give a flying hoot if someone thinks it's selfish. It's my life and I'll do with it what I want.

    Aside from that obvious fact, it's better for my future children if I do these things I want to do now before having them so that when I DO have them, I don't feel resentment. I want to be able to both emotionally and financially support my child when I finally decide it's time. I want to be ready and willing to make the sacrifices that are necessary for raising a child. I want to have experiences and the wisdom gained from them to impart to my child. I want to be able to teach them all about the things I've done, the places I've been, the fun that I've had and encourage them to do the same. I want to be able to talk to them from personal experience about things they hear, or see, or read. Is that "selfish" too?

  4. #94
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    Re: Why does Society Hate Families? Part II

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    Wow....

    Am I to understand from some people's posts here that I'm "selfish" for being an unmarried, childless woman in her 30s? That I'm a detriment to society for desiring to live my life the way I want and do the things I want to do as opposed to just accepting my "role" as society's breeding machine?

    In this day and age, I must say I am sufficiently surprised (and appalled) at such statements and/or implications.

    Yeah, I guess it is selfish of me to want to enjoy my life and do the things I want to do... to travel to the places I want to travel to... to experience all the things I want to experience. It is after all MY life, why shouldn't I try to enjoy it? Why should I sacrifice everything I want just so I can be molded into what someone else thinks I should be? Yeah, I guess it is selfish... but you know what? I really don't give a flying hoot if someone thinks it's selfish. It's my life and I'll do with it what I want.

    Aside from that obvious fact, it's better for my future children if I do these things I want to do now before having them so that when I DO have them, I don't feel resentment. I want to be able to both emotionally and financially support my child when I finally decide it's time. I want to be ready and willing to make the sacrifices that are necessary for raising a child. I want to have experiences and the wisdom gained from them to impart to my child. I want to be able to teach them all about the things I've done, the places I've been, the fun that I've had and encourage them to do the same. I want to be able to talk to them from personal experience about things they hear, or see, or read. Is that "selfish" too?


    Meh. Shaddup and breed. /smacks rivrrat

    Off-topic, but I too adore the Marquis (erm... as far as literature goes). Doesn't he have the coolest quotes ever?

  5. #95
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    Re: Why does Society Hate Families? Part II

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    Wow....

    Am I to understand from some people's posts here that I'm "selfish" for being an unmarried, childless woman in her 30s? That I'm a detriment to society for desiring to live my life the way I want and do the things I want to do as opposed to just accepting my "role" as society's breeding machine?

    In this day and age, I must say I am sufficiently surprised (and appalled) at such statements and/or implications.

    Yeah, I guess it is selfish of me to want to enjoy my life and do the things I want to do... to travel to the places I want to travel to... to experience all the things I want to experience. It is after all MY life, why shouldn't I try to enjoy it? Why should I sacrifice everything I want just so I can be molded into what someone else thinks I should be? Yeah, I guess it is selfish... but you know what? I really don't give a flying hoot if someone thinks it's selfish. It's my life and I'll do with it what I want.

    Aside from that obvious fact, it's better for my future children if I do these things I want to do now before having them so that when I DO have them, I don't feel resentment. I want to be able to both emotionally and financially support my child when I finally decide it's time. I want to be ready and willing to make the sacrifices that are necessary for raising a child. I want to have experiences and the wisdom gained from them to impart to my child. I want to be able to teach them all about the things I've done, the places I've been, the fun that I've had and encourage them to do the same. I want to be able to talk to them from personal experience about things they hear, or see, or read. Is that "selfish" too?
    Methinks you've misunderstood. Now, if you had kids already and weren't willing to make any sacrifices for them, that'd be selfish. But seeing as how you're getting things out of the way now, so that you can provide a good life for a child....I'd call that being responsible.

  6. #96
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    Re: Why does Society Hate Families? Part II

    Quote Originally Posted by 1069 View Post
    Meh. Shaddup and breed. /smacks rivrrat

    Off-topic, but I too adore the Marquis (erm... as far as literature goes). Doesn't he have the coolest quotes ever?
    Yup, he's one of my absolute favs

  7. #97
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    Re: Why does Society Hate Families? Part II

    1069

    Oh, really?
    I hadn't thought of that; nor, I'm sure, had any other working mom in history.

    I didn't say that you had never thought of that now...did I?

    See, here I was wasting my free time getting pedicures and squandering my evenings attending rated R movies and dancing the night away in 18-and-over bars. Quite being ridiculous...nobody has ever said insinuated anything remotely like that...so theatrical!

    Spending quality time with my family never occurred to me. clever
    Thank you, Bodisa-whatever. Thank you, from the bottom of my heart. You've opened my eyes to the truth. I'm a convert. Are you ready to communicate openly now? Good.
    I understand it all, now.
    Not by a long shot...but none of us do, so why do you persist in acting like a foolish?

    I know that you aren't stupid... at least I think that you aren't. Chill out...I know you don't care about anything that I would say, but that was just a joke.

    I am wondering why you are refusing to accept this as our point though... now that I do know that you have thought of this before... hmmm...?


    It is now.
    Quality time.
    Wait, wait... lemme get a pen and write that down.
    Q.... U.....A.... L.... Quality. Quality time.

    Okay, got it.
    Your attempt at wit is boring since you are unwilling to even address what I am saying. I addressed your point...what you say is valid as well. There are many valid points, but you seem to only think that your view is correct and that what you think is best for all. That is fine...not everybody sees the "Big Picture".

    Thanks again.
    You've changed my life, my entire approach to childrearing.
    So melodramatic... What are you afraid of?

    Why do you dislike people that think differently than you?
    Why are you demeaning to the women that you should be helping, according to your logic?
    Why do you support abandoning children?
    Why do you support fragmenting the family?

    Why are you filled with contempt (i.e. Hate) for those that see things differently than you?

    From the onset, you have attacked me.

    I initially played along and thought that you were just a bitch.
    I then realized that you had a bit more intelligence than I originally thought.
    Now all I see is your anger.

    You can disguise it any way that you like, it is still a core of anger.

    Angry at what you were dished in life? Who knows? You are the only person that can ultimately answer that...

    Unless you start to communicate effectively we won't achieve anything substantial though...
    Last edited by BodiSatva; 03-04-07 at 02:47 PM.
    My teachings are easy to understand
    and easy to put into practice.
    Yet your intellect will never grasp them,
    and if you try to practice them, you'll fail.

  8. #98
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    Re: Why does Society Hate Families? Part II

    Well, it's "simple", at any rate.
    "Logic"? Not so much.
    That was the simplest form of logic...sorry if you are unwilling to see it.

    If one unemployed parent is good, wouldn't two be better?
    Unemployed? Oh Brother... Like the parent is "looking" for work...

    Will you accept one point? That the parent made a "Choice" to stay at home?

    If not, why not?
    Shall I produce evidence that it's been done, ergo it is logistically feasible?
    Of course it is logically feasable. What I said was equally as "logically feasable". You seem to love attacking what is different.

    I question...
    You attack...

    I embrace understanding and communication...
    You embrace hositlity and and a defensive attitude...

    BodiSatva
    Two parent households do not have to have two incomes. They don't. How do I know that this is a fact? We do it. If we can do it, then others can do it (random variables aside, since there are always variables.) This is just simple logic.
    So...let's try this again.

    By your own admission, two parent households do not need two incomes, in fact, you say correctly that they don't even need one (at least this is possible for some, at any rate). Personally, we can get by quite easily on one medium sized income.

    So you insult me...
    Incorrectly assess my logic...
    Contradict yourself....
    Inadvertantly back up my logic with parallel logic...
    And what will we see?
    Will you come full circle back to being hostile again?
    It is your choice.
    My teachings are easy to understand
    and easy to put into practice.
    Yet your intellect will never grasp them,
    and if you try to practice them, you'll fail.

  9. #99
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    Re: Why does Society Hate Families? Part II

    You seem to love attacking what is different.

    If irony were avocados, we'd all be eating a lot of guacamole right about now.

  10. #100
    The Bodhisattva

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    Re: Why does Society Hate Families? Part II

    Originally Posted by rivrrat
    Wow....

    Am I to understand from some people's posts here that I'm "selfish" for being an unmarried, childless woman in her 30s? That I'm a detriment to society for desiring to live my life the way I want and do the things I want to do as opposed to just accepting my "role" as society's breeding machine?
    Nope. Defensiveness leads to communication breakdown.

    You must seek Understanding in order to be Aware...

    Perhaps you should read some of that stuff again...

    Am I to understand from some people's posts here that I'm "selfish" for being an unmarried, childless woman in her 30s?...

    Yeah, I guess it is selfish of me to want to enjoy my life and do the things I want to do... to travel to the places I want to travel to... to experience all the things I want to experience. It is after all MY life, why shouldn't I try to enjoy it? Why should I sacrifice everything I want just so I can be molded into what someone else thinks I should be? Yeah, I guess it is selfish... but you know what? I really don't give a flying hoot if someone thinks it's selfish.

    It's my life and I'll do with it what I want...
    Wow! LOL! That was pretty amazing... total contradictions...

    Anyway. There are varying degrees of selfishness. What you are doing is selfish. We are ALL selfish to a degree. You don't have kids... you can do what you like.

    The point that you are missing for some reason, and perhaps it is because you don't have kids, is that once you have kids you should do what is BEST FOR THE CHILDREN as well as what is best for the family.

    If you had kids and expressed that attitude above, I would be extremely worried for your children.

    Aside from that obvious fact, it's better for my future children if I do these things I want to do now before having them so that when I DO have them, I don't feel resentment.
    That is one way to look at it. I think exactly the opposite. I think that there is no waiting until the "Right" time to have kids. If you think that you would have resentment towards your kids for them keeping you from "travel" and such, then PLEASE DO NOT HAVE CHILDREN!!!

    OMG!

    You and 1069! Sacrifice! Resentment! Priority of Careers!

    When your Priority is to have kids and love them...then have kids, until then you are not ready.

    I want to be able to both emotionally and financially support my child when I finally decide it's time. I want to be ready and willing to make the sacrifices that are necessary for raising a child. I want to have experiences and the wisdom gained from them to impart to my child. I want to be able to teach them all about the things I've done, the places I've been, the fun that I've had and encourage them to do the same. I want to be able to talk to them from personal experience about things they hear, or see, or read. Is that "selfish" too?
    In essence...yes.

    You can do ALL OF THOSE THINGS with kids. How do I know that this is a fact! We do it! Simple logic...that is the stuff that really confuses 1069! LOL!

    We travel...get this, WITH OUR KIDS! All over the place.

    Here is the thing that you guys don't seem to get.

    INCLUSION!

    We INCLUDE our kids in our adventures. We don't have them and THEN sit back and tell them about them later. "Gee, I am an old man now and I can't shoot hoops with you son, being 56 when your oldest graduates High-School can do that, but when I was younger...DAMN! I had a great time!" LOL!

    Can you imagine? I see these old parents all over the place. BMW's. Hawaiian vacations. Huge house. But they don't spend any time with their kids. They spent so much time getting the things that they thought that they needed in order to have kids that they missed the point ... Kids do not need all of that crap. They need parents that are with them, not out maintaining some level of life that they didn't even need i nthe first place. THAT is my point.

    If you are unlcear as to anything that I said, just ask.

    If I seemed rude towards you or if I did not seem open, it is because I am goofing around with humor at the same time that I am serious with worry for kids.

    I don't want to get off on the wrong foor with you since this is a passionate topic.

    Please don't go 1069 on me...

    I hope for her, and she tries to enlist people to her cause, but I am not expecting any real change...

    rivrrat , do what you think is best and if you have a solid core and are able to adapt, you will find your path and do what is best for you and your children.

    Take it easy.
    Last edited by BodiSatva; 03-04-07 at 03:26 PM.
    My teachings are easy to understand
    and easy to put into practice.
    Yet your intellect will never grasp them,
    and if you try to practice them, you'll fail.

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