• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Should these teens be tried as adults

Should the 15 and 16 year old also be tried as adults

  • yes and throw away the key

    Votes: 72 87.8%
  • no, they deserve a second chance

    Votes: 10 12.2%

  • Total voters
    82
hey..if it makes you feel better to give cold blooded murderers a slap on the wrist because they are "children"....knock yourself out.





Anyone who supports treating children like adults has a problem.

And any of those people who refuse to recognize the fact that they have a problem have yet another problem.




"[/B]Better days are coming." ~ But not for today's out of touch, running out of time, GOP.
 





Anyone who supports treating children like adults has a problem.

And any of those people who refuse to recognize the fact that they have a problem have yet another problem.




"[/B]Better days are coming." ~ But not for today's out of touch, running out of time, GOP.


and anyone who can't see that teenagers who act like adults are not "children" has problems. you guys keep missing the point. it's not like these guys were out doing stupid "kid stuff" and someone got killed. they deliberately planned to hunt down another human being and kill them. that is not a lapse in judgement or any other childlike excuse. that is the act of a seriously ****ed up adult.

it's not like this was a bunch of kids who found daddy's gun and were playing cops and robbers and shot one of their playmates.
 
In this case, where three youths went on a "joy killing" of a man who did nothing to them, execution is a fitting punishment for the one who pulled the trigger. Life sentences for the other two, no parole.




You will not be making any decisions in this case.
 
The reason this "problem" has not been resolved before now is because nobody knows what to do.

It's not a matter of rehabilitation, they failed to develop the slightest shred of conscience or compassion during the early years when other children are developing those critical traits. My guess is that this lack of humanity in "children " is rapidly becoming an evident problem throughout the civilized world.

In all likelihood, these "children" if ever set free, will spend the rest of their lives brutally harming innocent people and even other children and still incur millions of dollars from taxpayers to babysit them for the rest of their lives.

We owe a duty to those future innocent victims as well as the young man they murdered.

I believe the solution is that they should be tried as adults, but with certain adult punishments taken off the table, such as the death penalty. That would leave the problem of long term cost to taxpayers, which would require that they be forced to work to pay for their room and board during the entire time they are incarcerated.
 
Last edited:
All three should be charged equally. The 17yo was driving so he was every bit as actively involved as the others. The ONLY way I'd consider letting him off the hook is if it can be proved that the others forced him into participating.

I don't disagree with you - it's possible that he was given the lesser charge because he seems to be the one that confessed and fingered the other two. It might have been some kind of agreement to get charged with a lesser offense in exchange for information.
 
All three should be charged equally. The 17yo was driving so he was every bit as actively involved as the others. The ONLY way I'd consider letting him off the hook is if it can be proved that the others forced him into participating.





You are another person who is quick to judge who will not be making any decisions in this case.
 
and anyone who can't see that teenagers who act like adults are not "children" has problems. you guys keep missing the point. it's not like these guys were out doing stupid "kid stuff" and someone got killed. they deliberately planned to hunt down another human being and kill them. that is not a lapse in judgement or any other childlike excuse. that is the act of a seriously ****ed up adult.

it's not like this was a bunch of kids who found daddy's gun and were playing cops and robbers and shot one of their playmates
.




Nothing that you have said changes my opinion even a little bit.

Children are children and adults are adults.

We shouldn't treat children the same way that we treat adults and we shouldn't treat adults the same way that we treat children.

Anyone who doesn't grasp those simple facts has a problem.




We don't do things here in the USA the way that the Taliban does in Afghanistan and Pakistan.
 
Last edited:
You killed somebody, so now I'm going to kill you. Hmm. That doesn't sound like justice to me boys. :)



Odd. It sounds EXACTLY like justice to me. It sounded EXACTLY like justice when the two young men who murdered my adopted brother were finally, FINALLY executed.
 
Nothing that you have said changes my opinion even a little bit.

Children are children and adults are adults.

We shouldn't treat children the same way that we treat adults and we shouldn't treat adults the same way that we treat children.

Anyone who doesn't grasp those simple facts has a problem.




We don't do things here in the USA the way that the Taliban does in Afghanistan and Pakistan.


Part of the problem is our definition of adult, and child.



Granted, a 15yo is not fully mature, mentally... certain portions of the brain require up to age 22 or so to fully develop.


However, a 15yo is not a CHILD anymore either, not in the same sense that a 7yo is a child at least. They are in between, neither fish nor fowl, and that itself is the source of a great deal of problems both from and upon the teenage demographic.


The fact that the vast majority of 15yo's (over 99%) appear to be able to restrain themselves from murdering people out of sheer boredom argues that they ARE old enough to know that is a heinously wrong action, with heinous consequences for doing it anyway.
 
Then why bother drawing the line at all? What's the use of saying juvenile offenders are tried with a different set of rules if the definition can be tossed aside at will? Just try every case the same and be done with it.


Because there is a VAST difference between letting an adolescent get off lightly for "mischief"-grade crimes like minor vandalism, petty theft, or fist fighting... and letting them get off lightly when they murdered a man for no reason at all other than boredom and malicious indifference to human life.
 
Odd. It sounds EXACTLY like justice to me. It sounded EXACTLY like justice when the two young men who murdered my adopted brother were finally, FINALLY executed.

Doesn't to me.
 
Well, so you don't like my analysis and prefer your own - that's fine - I don't believe your analysis that these are just three precious dears who need to be saved and are just misunderstood and if they could get some guidance and handholding they can be rehabilitated and tossed back out into an unsuspecting world.

Your analysis? :lamo FYI, I'm not making any analyses, I'm waiting to hear more information before I crucify them. Again, nobody said anything about "three precious dears who need to be saved" or any of these other retarded things.
 
birds of a feather....... leader or follower, all 3 were old enough to know better
The only prayer the other two should have is if they did not know the shooter was "going to do that". If they thought he was going to commit a prank or something along those lines that's one thing, but if they knew he was going to shoot someone and went along that's accomplice charges, in my state you get the same penalty under that circumstance. If they simply wouldn't have stopped him from shooting I think the charge is some form of "indifference".
 
My apologies for referring back to your son so flippantly - I was trying to make a point against your comment and mine was uncalled for and I uncategorically apologize for it.

Yes, I accept your apology, but you really should practice on leaving the personal stuff out of your debate. It makes you look weak, seriously.

No, we don't have the death penalty here - not that the majority of the electorate don't favor reinstating the death penalty - recent polling shows 63% of Canadians favor reinstatement - our politicians, however, are opposed.

Yahoo! News Canada - Latest News & Headlines

Interesting information here from your link:

Canadians do seem torn on the issue, however. When the option of life imprisonment — without the possibility of parole — is introduced to the mix we seem to change our tune. When the pollster asked respondents if they support capital punishment or life in prison, the majority of those surveyed chose the latter (45 per cent versus 39 per cent). The bottom line, I guess, is that Canadians want tougher penalties for those who commit murder.



As for children, the majority of Canadians are outraged at the leniency with which young adults are treated under our Young Offenders Act and want it abolished and most if not all teenaged youth tried as adults particularly when they commit heinous crimes like murder.

Funny, I didn't note that in the link provided. Care to quote that section for me?
 
Your analysis? :lamo FYI, I'm not making any analyses, I'm waiting to hear more information before I crucify them. Again, nobody said anything about "three precious dears who need to be saved" or any of these other retarded things.

No, you're not waiting - you've already determined by your own words that they should not be tried as adults and they should not spend any time in an adult correctional facility. Equally, you've already determined that the evidence presented in court at their hearing isn't truthful or that it isn't reliable.
 
Ever had someone you love murdered? It can change your mind.

I completely understand that it would make even more emotional about it. Emotion should probably not be included when applying the law.
 
Gosh Chris, you give "Stand Your Ground" a different perspective. You've been taking on all comers to defend your position since yesterday. I truly admire what seems to be sincere fortitude. :peace
I agree with your statement above. The original question concerns their crime status as adults or children; I will re-issue my response...
Based upon the alleged admissions of the alleged perpetrators that they did knowingly plan, follow through, and execute with malice and forethought the heinous crime of murder upon an innocent soul the young men should stand trial as adults and if convicted receive full force and effect of the most severe punishment available in accordance with the laws of the State of Oklahoma.
I do not agree, in this case, that rehabilitation is an option.
Hang in the --- oops ... how about .. Keep on Truckin' Chris

Thom Paine

Thank you Thom. I'll take that as a compliment. :) I appreciate your respectful reply, and I certainly acknowledge that you are entitled to disagree.

Everything you stated above is allegedly what occurred, but that still doesn't change the fact that they were kids, and I'm still against the DP.
 
No, you're not waiting - you've already determined by your own words that they should not be tried as adults and they should not spend any time in an adult correctional facility. Equally, you've already determined that the evidence presented in court at their hearing isn't truthful or that it isn't reliable.

I'm referring to their guilt or innocence and what exactly occurred, since I don't know enough details about that yet, other than this article. I also read elsewhere that the pictures of the boys was somehow inaccurate too. Go figure. None of this changes the ages of the defendants though.
 
I completely understand that it would make even more emotional about it. Emotion should probably not be included when applying the law.

I agree with that. If that man was my brother I'd honestly probably want them executed in the most painful way possible. But right now I recognize that as irrational. And there's nothing wrong with being irrational in a situation like that. In fact there might be something wrong if you weren't. But the justice system shouldn't reflect that.
 
Neither will you.





Well it looks like you got one thing right.

I'll just add that I am not interested in trying to judge those young men, I'll leave that to the Oklahoma justice system.
 
Back
Top Bottom